Cleveland, Cincinnati, and Columbus vying for 2016 Political Conventions (Shaker Heights: best city, high school)
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I figured it would be you that would chime in with the barely concealed glee, but do you really have to make multiple posts like this? I'm sure you could fit it all into one.
-Columbus' bus ridership in 2014 was the highest since 1986 and the system has expanded every year.
-Transit, as it turns out, wasn't the real problem like I thought it might be. Instead, it came down to two other factors: Money, which I mentioned (the donor issue and also a smaller incentives package), but also security. The Arena District/Convention Center area was logistically a security issue because of the density of the residential population. Philly's area is surrounded by parking lots.
-The light rail routes that would work in Columbus are no less dense than where it's being built in Cincinnati or where they currently exist in Cleveland, so that argument doesn't make any sense.
BTW, just curious, but when Cleveland didn't win in 2012 or in previous years when it was in the running, did that mean it wasn't competitive? A little humility is probably in order with you.
Cleveland wasn't competitive in 2012 or prior years because it didn't win. Hotels were the issue, not much else. That issue has been resolved and is only getting better. The infrastructure was always there and with the recent and future overall improvements, Cleveland has an excellent opportunity to become a real convention town; especially post-RNC.
Please do not mention Philly's lack of density especially where its convention center is located. Cinci's streetcar makes no sense either.
So Columbus wasn't competitive. It should have been dumped earlier then if the reasons were money and ''lack of security''.....please. Both obvious factors from the get-go. So the convention selling points Columbus made, especially the logistic location of the arena/convention center didn't work because of security reasons? Not buying that line at all. Same goes for the Barclay Center in Brooklyn then. The DNC prefers isolated arenas.
Guess Columbus will never have a DNC event then since it can't fix its security ''issues''. Maybe the RNC since Cleveland's arena and convention center are in dense locations but the the transit issue comes up again for Columbus...ugh.
I'm not gleeful since I never expected Columbus to win this.
Cleveland wasn't competitive in 2012 or prior years because it didn't win. Hotels were the issue, not much else. That issue has been resolved and is only getting better. The infrastructure was always there and with the recent and future overall improvements, Cleveland has an excellent opportunity to become a real convention town; especially post-RNC.
Please do not mention Philly's lack of density especially where its convention center is located. Cinci's streetcar makes no sense either.
So Columbus wasn't competitive. It should have been dumped earlier then if the reasons were money and ''lack of security''.....please. Both obvious factors from the get-go. So the convention selling points Columbus made, especially the logistic location of the arena/convention center didn't work because of security reasons? Not buying that line at all. Same goes for the Barclay Center in Brooklyn then. The DNC prefers isolated arenas.
Guess Columbus will never have a DNC event then since it can't fix its security ''issues''. Maybe the RNC since Cleveland's arena and convention center are in dense locations but the the transit issue comes up again for Columbus...ugh.
I'm not gleeful since I never expected Columbus to win this.
Politico.com had the story about the security issues with the locations, and mentioned that Philly's site was surrounded by parking rather than mixed-use, dense development. Brooklyn was cited as having the same problem as Columbus in this regard. Perhaps the issue can be addressed next time, maybe not. I'd rather have the dense, mixed-use neighborhood than a lot of parking if it comes down to that requirement.
You stated that Columbus doesn't have enough density for light rail, but the density in the neighborhoods it would make most sense to have routes in is on par with, or in some cases, greater than that where rail is under construction or exists elsewhere in the state, so that's really a non-issue.
Cleveland wasn't competitive in 2012 or prior years because it didn't win. Hotels were the issue, not much else. That issue has been resolved and is only getting better. The infrastructure was always there and with the recent and future overall improvements, Cleveland has an excellent opportunity to become a real convention town; especially post-RNC.
Please do not mention Philly's lack of density especially where its convention center is located. Cinci's streetcar makes no sense either.
So Columbus wasn't competitive. It should have been dumped earlier then if the reasons were money and ''lack of security''.....please. Both obvious factors from the get-go. So the convention selling points Columbus made, especially the logistic location of the arena/convention center didn't work because of security reasons? Not buying that line at all. Same goes for the Barclay Center in Brooklyn then. The DNC prefers isolated arenas.
Guess Columbus will never have a DNC event then since it can't fix its security ''issues''. Maybe the RNC since Cleveland's arena and convention center are in dense locations but the the transit issue comes up again for Columbus...ugh.
I'm not gleeful since I never expected Columbus to win this.
I have read your posts for a long time. I probably know city of Cleveland much better you do. I also very familiar with the city of Columbus because I lived there for almost a decade.
You are the most clueless, uninformed poster that I've ever seen on C-data!! While Cleveland is a nice city, it isn't the finest city in the world. And while Cleveland was awarded the Republican convention, this doesn't mean that the city is head and shoulders above Columbus and Cincinnati.
It is quite apparent that you need to go away and do some research because it's very obvious that you don't know what you're talking about!!!
I have read your posts for a long time. I probably know city of Cleveland much better you do. I also very familiar with the city of Columbus because I lived there for almost a decade.
You are the most clueless, uninformed poster that I've ever seen on C-data!! While Cleveland is a nice city, it isn't the finest city in the world. And while Cleveland was awarded the Republican convention, this doesn't mean that the city is head and shoulders above Columbus and Cincinnati.
It is quite apparent that you need to go away and do some research because it's very obvious that you don't know what you're talking about!!!
It's very obvious that you have to embellish in your post. ''Cleveland isn't the finest city in the world...'' who said it was?
I know Cleveland quite well, but as far as the national political conventions for 2016, Cleveland is head and shoulders above Columbus and Cincinnati. Sorry, it's a fact.
You must be the most uniformed poster on C-data if you don't realize the thread is ''Cleveland, Cincinnati and Columbus vying for 2016 Political Conventions'' and the topic is the these cities competing to win the RNC or DNC. One of the three won a convention. It happened to be Cleveland. Deal with it.
Pay attention to the thread topic.
Not sure what that last line is about other than major sour grapes about Cleveland winning the RNC and Cincinnati and Columbus losing. Columbus eliminated round 1 RNC; Columbus never a real contender for the DNC, sorry, but that's true as well.
Politico.com had the story about the security issues with the locations, and mentioned that Philly's site was surrounded by parking rather than mixed-use, dense development. Brooklyn was cited as having the same problem as Columbus in this regard. Perhaps the issue can be addressed next time, maybe not. I'd rather have the dense, mixed-use neighborhood than a lot of parking if it comes down to that requirement.
You stated that Columbus doesn't have enough density for light rail, but the density in the neighborhoods it would make most sense to have routes in is on par with, or in some cases, greater than that where rail is under construction or exists elsewhere in the state, so that's really a non-issue.
Sure you aren't.
Columbus is not densely populated, its metro sprawls and is a glob of counties but if you want to spend a billion $$ to have a light-rail out to Port Columbus so Columbus can be a ''big'' city, then go for it, oh and pay for it yourself.
Cincinnati's streetcar is a loop in its downtown area. No sense with it in its current set-up.
The dense neighborhood trade off with the parking lot in Philly is misplaced since Philly has tons of dense, mixed use neighborhoods to trade-off against the contrived Arena District.
Columbus is not densely populated, its metro sprawls and is a glob of counties but if you want to spend a billion $$ to have a light-rail out to Port Columbus so Columbus can be a ''big'' city, then go for it, oh and pay for it yourself.
Cincinnati's streetcar is a loop in its downtown area. No sense with it in its current set-up.
The dense neighborhood trade off with the parking lot in Philly is misplaced since Philly has tons of dense, mixed use neighborhoods to trade-off against the contrived Arena District.
Sure you aren't.
I understand this thread is about the Ohio cities (Wow, there seems to be more intrastate animosity in Ohio than there is in PA), but I keep reading comments about "density" and the PA Convention Center. Yes, the PA CC is surrounded by parking lots, for about 1 block in most directions. Other than that, and regardless of that, it's smack in the middle of a very urban area.
I have read your posts for a long time. I probably know city of Cleveland much better you do. I also very familiar with the city of Columbus because I lived there for almost a decade.
You are the most clueless, uninformed poster that I've ever seen on C-data!! While Cleveland is a nice city, it isn't the finest city in the world. And while Cleveland was awarded the Republican convention, this doesn't mean that the city is head and shoulders above Columbus and Cincinnati.
It is quite apparent that you need to go away and do some research because it's very obvious that you don't know what you're talking about!!!
<< I probably know city of Cleveland much better you do. >>
Nobody who knew Cleveland and Columbus well could have written this spiteful post. The fact is, Cleveland well exceeds Columbus as a destination, and Cincinnati also is above Columbus. E.g., both Cleveland and Cincinnati easily exceed Columbus in their cultural and pro sports amenities, and, no, Ohio State does not offset these advantages, except in the eyes of Columbus-based Buckeye sports fanatics, and I'm a Buckeye fan who regularly attends sporting events there.
Here's the evidence of Cleveland's great superiority as a destination:
Where are the similar accolades for Columbus? If there are any, I've missed them.
Most of the derogatory comments in your post, apply to you, not Kamms.
A big reason that Cleveland won a national political convention is its excellent, new convention center. Hotels being built to support it, also were a consideration. A deficient convention center and a paucity of hotels kept Cleveland from serious consideration in decades past.
Cleveland's cultural amenities rate very highly in the U.S., and in the world, especially given the size of the city. Its physical location on Lake Erie also is a great asset; e.g., lake cruise ships, great museum ships, boat rentals, jet ski and kayak rentals downtown, fishing, surf beaches, etc. These amenities also make the city more attractive for large conventions.
The whiners here about comparisons between Cleveland and Columbus seem to be fact-less bashers who deal in subjective generalities instead of in reality. See post 238 in this thread for the factual realities.
Philadelphia is one of a handful of cities in the U.S. that surpass Cleveland in its cultural amenities in addition to its status as a major historical destination. Additionally, nearby are the likes of Longwood Gardens, Winterthur, Valley Forge, to say nothing about the weeks worth of attractions within an hour.
It will be tough for a convention visitor to be bored in Philadelphia.
Cleveland benefits even today from its status as perhaps the wealthiest city in the world as measured by mean per capita net worth at the turn of the 20th century. The heirs of the city's great industrialists established a cultural mecca early in the 20th century and continued to enhance those efforts through the 20th century. It's extremely difficult to duplicate these efforts in the 21st century. No longer could a Jeptha Wade II cruise the world on his yacht collecting treasures on the cheap for his beloved art museum. A Sherman Lee, an Asian Monuments Man, could no longer use an immense acquisitions budget to roam Asia collecting important works in the aftermath of World War II. E.g., India, at the time, actually encouraged the export of cultural masterpieces to enhance the appreciation of its cultural globally.
Even late in the 20th century, Cleveland benefited from visionary efforts of a remarkable nature.
I enjoy Columbus very much. Over the years, I've explored most of the city, all of the gentrifying neighborhoods, and most attractions in the region. What sickens me are the uninformed posts that attempt to aggrandize Columbus for no reason at the expense of Cleveland and even Cincinnati. I have friends in Columbus, and have visited major attractions there countless times, and I greatly enjoy my visits there.
However, nobody who has set foot in the Cleveland Museum of Art, Severance Hall, the West Side Market, the Rock Hall, etc., could write with any objective honesty the absurdities about Cleveland which regularly populate the Ohio city-data forums.
I understand this thread is about the Ohio cities (Wow, there seems to be more intrastate animosity in Ohio than there is in PA), but I keep reading comments about "density" and the PA Convention Center. Yes, the PA CC is surrounded by parking lots, for about 1 block in most directions. Other than that, and regardless of that, it's smack in the middle of a very urban area.
The PA CC is not surrounded by parking lots. It is, as you know, adjacent to Reading Terminal Market, hotels, retail and such. Unless these parking lots are obscured on the north side of the CC, I don't know where the 1 block parking lot perimeter is that you mention.
I understand this thread is about the Ohio cities (Wow, there seems to be more intrastate animosity in Ohio than there is in PA), but I keep reading comments about "density" and the PA Convention Center. Yes, the PA CC is surrounded by parking lots, for about 1 block in most directions. Other than that, and regardless of that, it's smack in the middle of a very urban area.
As you know, the thread is about the 3 Ohio Cs competing for either the DNC or RNC. Columbus eliminated 1st round, Cincinnati withdrew/eliminated 2nd round, Cleveland won the RNC in the end (without a peep of support or congrats from the sour grapes losers).
Cleveland withdrew from the DNC and Columbus competed for and ultimately lost the DNC.
All I stated was that, of the 3, Cleveland won. As you also know, Cleveland has been the butt of national and state of Ohio jokes and dumping on for 50 years; I hated to mention my hometown wherever I went for the usual ripping and eye rolling from people. I remember a co-worker from Columbus working in Chicago getting visibly ticked-off and arguing that Cleveland did not have a rail transit system. Very bizarre.
Anyway, of the 3 Cs, only Cleveland had the ability to pull off a national convention so this is the fall-out for this win.
I stated all along that Columbus was not capable to handle the DNC, so that was turned into Cleveland insecurity, negativity etc., which it is not. There is a one-way rivalry from Cincinnati and to a lesser extent from Columbus with Cleveland.
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