[Plutonic Panda]

Tulsa really needs to be thankful for that park as OKC should be thankful for the Devon Tower.

Tulsa's Gathering Place will rival any park in Dallas at the moment.

[Howest2008]

I have a problem with two polar opposite groups of peoples I guess you could call them group A and group B. Group A will tell everyone that they meet that OKC was never anything , isn't anything now , and will never be anything in the near and distant future 25 hours of each and every day . Group B are those lying wonders that tell everyone that they meet on God's Green Earth that OKC has arrived and is willing and able to Whup Some ( A Fifty Five ) A55..... Memphis , Louisville , Cincinnati , Columbus , Cleveland , Jacksonville , Kansas City, St. Louis , Tampa Bay , Orlando , Pittsburgh , Charlotte and Raleigh , Ft. Worth etc. etc. and the list goes on......this just isn't going to happen anytime soon ....but should OKC give up having a plan on overtaking those cities in the near to distant future.....Hades No OKC Shouldn't.......LOL.....Falling Out Of My Chair....

[bawac34618]

^^ I am a part of a third group that acknowledges the improvements in OKC and will say its much better than it once was. However, there are still some serious quality of life issues here that make it a very difficult if not downright frustrating place to live for a lot of people.

The best way for me to sum it up is that anybody who moves to OKC needs to make sure their heart is fully in it because if its not, it can be a miserable, isolating place to be. I think in terms of culture shock, this place is a little more difficult to warm up to than a lot of places especially to people who have lived on the coasts.

[eddie gein]

Originally Posted by bawac34618

^^ I am a part of a third group that acknowledges the improvements in OKC and will say its much better than it once was. However, there are still some serious quality of life issues here that make it a very difficult if not downright frustrating place to live for a lot of people.

The best way for me to sum it up is that anybody who moves to OKC needs to make sure their heart is fully in it because if its not, it can be a miserable, isolating place to be. I think in terms of culture shock, this place is a little more difficult to warm up to than a lot of places especially to people who have lived on the coasts.

Not wanting to pry (our other friend would consider this request to be "prying"), but, would you be kind enough to let us know where you've lived that allows you to have this perspective?

You are obviously the opposite of that friend of yours that came from Jackson, MS.

Then it would be interesting to get an idea of what you did in those places in your leisure time that you cannot do in OKC. You have already mentioned the shopping issues and as I said, I can see that those are legitimate issues.

What else are things that you are unable to do?

[Griffis]

Originally Posted by bawac34618

^^ I am a part of a third group that acknowledges the improvements in OKC and will say its much better than it once was. However, there are still some serious quality of life issues here that make it a very difficult if not downright frustrating place to live for a lot of people.

The best way for me to sum it up is that anybody who moves to OKC needs to make sure their heart is fully in it because if its not, it can be a miserable, isolating place to be. I think in terms of culture shock, this place is a little more difficult to warm up to than a lot of places especially to people who have lived on the coasts.

Not surprisingly, I have to agree.

I have spent the bulk of my life in Oklahoma, in various cities and towns, but I have also traveled to a few other countries, have spent time in 46 of the 50 US states, lived in a dozen or so of them.

I have to say, and I can't specifically state why this is the case, OKC is the only place I've ever lived where it felt really foreign to me. Like I was an alien, or alienated from the place and its people.

I've never experienced anything like that anywhere else I've been. Last time I lived in OKC it was for more than a year and a half (until almost exactly one year ago) and I never got to like it any better, although I did get exposed to some nicer areas and agree that it is far better than it was 20-30 years ago.

Still, I feel like it is a lump of coal in the rough.

Again, just to clarify: I'm not stating that Tulsa is a World Class City or even just such a great place on its own--I just have strong feelings that it is the "better" or "nicer" of the two metros for several reasons.

I also agree that if I had to choose, I would take OKC over Lawton any day. Lawton at least is near Medicine Park and the Wichitas, but I know I COULD live in OKC again. I don't think there's anything that could compel me to live in Lawton short of a large 6-figure salary, or if someone gave me a free house & land or something.

I will also admit that part of my feeling for Tulsa, though I try to be as objective as possible, is that I spent some formative years there with a lot of action and a great circle of friends.

But even as a kid I disliked OKC.

[flyingcat2k]

Originally Posted by Plutonic Panda

Tulsa really needs to be thankful for that park as OKC should be thankful for the Devon Tower.

Tulsa's Gathering Place will rival any park in Dallas at the moment.

Here's a difference between OKC and Tulsa. Tulsa Chamber doesn't believe for a second that the new park will drive tourism (outside of our idiot mayor). Nobody goes to Dallas or any other city to see a park unless its where the zoo or museum is. It will drive some home sales possibly through QOL. OKC Chamber somehow seems to think that Devon Tower will drive tourism with the restaurant at the top?? Maybe someone from Lawton will drive in for that but not anywhere else. The new building will drive home sales as it increased Class A office space in OKC.

I didn't have such a foul feeling about OKC when I moved here in 2010. I read comments and articles by Steve Lackmeyer dogging Tulsa in 2012 through 2014, found out about the fiasco that is the American Indian Museum and OKC PS's opposition to more funding for schools. Now, I can't stand the place. Tulsa World's writers throw plenty of barbs at OKC but they are usually political in nature (well deserved too), not QOL or music/food scene related.

[bawac34618]

Originally Posted by eddie gein

Not wanting to pry (our other friend would consider this request to be "prying"), but, would you be kind enough to let us know where you've lived that allows you to have this perspective?

You are obviously the opposite of that friend of yours that came from Jackson, MS.

My friend from Jackson is now in a significant relationship and will probably soon be married. His goal is to buy a house in the suburbs, settle down, and raise a family. He is only 24. OKC is very conductive to that way of life.

I myself may never be married and don't want kids. I prefer a townhome or a condo tower to an exurban house on 3 acres. My idea of quality entertainment does not consist of sitting at home and watching Dancing with the Stars or Duck Dynasty.

Originally Posted by eddie gein

Then it would be interesting to get an idea of what you did in those places in your leisure time that you cannot do in OKC. You have already mentioned the shopping issues and as I said, I can see that those are legitimate issues.

What else are things that you are unable to do?

To be honest, I would feel a little limited in about any town the size of OKC, but that doesn't change the fact that most other cities this size are a lot better. I could be happier in Memphis or Jacksonville FL than I am here. Those cities are much more vibrant, have a lot more character, and have more to do in the cities themselves and the surrounding area.

I want to be a part of an active, vibrant, urban community. I want an environment where I am not looked down upon if I am not a carbon copy of everyone else. There is immense pressure in OKC to conform to the norm and if you do not you are outcasted. In fact I have never known anywhere else that individualism was as frowned upon as it is here.

I want nightlife that doesn't revolve around PTA meetings or religion. I could care less about hunting, fishing, rodeos, or college football. I don't like modern pop country music. As dvxhd said, there aren't many niche social groups available around here because for one the town is too small and the culture is too one-dimensional.

I also prefer to live somewhere where people don't immediately write me off because I am not a native. I have never lived anywhere as unfriendly to transplants as OKC. If one didn't grow up here or at least attend OU or UCO, its extremely difficult to feel at home here.

To top it all off, I cannot get used to the frequency of extreme severe weather. I am sick and tired of constantly having to worry about tornadoes and damaging hail. This is simply no way to live life.

[Plutonic Panda]

Originally Posted by flyingcat2k

Here's a difference between OKC and Tulsa. Tulsa Chamber doesn't believe for a second that the new park will drive tourism (outside of our idiot mayor). Nobody goes to Dallas or any other city to see a park unless its where the zoo or museum is. It will drive some home sales possibly through QOL. OKC Chamber somehow seems to think that Devon Tower will drive tourism with the restaurant at the top?? Maybe someone from Lawton will drive in for that but not anywhere else. The new building will drive home sales as it increased Class A office space in OKC.

I didn't have such a foul feeling about OKC when I moved here in 2010. I read comments and articles by Steve Lackmeyer dogging Tulsa in 2012 through 2014, found out about the fiasco that is the American Indian Museum and OKC PS's opposition to more funding for schools. Now, I can't stand the place. Tulsa World's writers throw plenty of barbs at OKC but they are usually political in nature (well deserved too), not QOL or music/food scene related.

I have never seen where the OKC Chamber said they thought the Devon Tower will create tourism. Of course, I don't really follow them much, but that's hilarious if so.

I don't think many people will come visit Tulsa to visit the new park, but it sure is an incredible asset to living in a city that has such an amazing park to be able to go to.

[okie1962]

The biggest problem OKC and Tulsa faces, is that they are located in Oklahoma.

[okie1962]

Originally Posted by bawac34618

Utica Square is a very old shopping center and will always have more character than anything that could be built in OKC. However, retail in OKC is currently so terrible for a city its size it has nowhere to go but up. If this planned shopping center gets built it will be a huge boost to the retail scene in OKC and is also much nicer than anything that currently exists at this end of the turnpike.

bchris02, you will get bounced if CD finds out you have two or more profiles. Just saying.