[mcompton1973]

I am going to be working for a company out of Tulsa that sells roofs after hail storms etc. I do this now in Nebraska, and I'm relocating further south because of easier winters and my wife has horses etc....even more things down there than up here for her.

Right now we are looking at property that has a Wagoner address but is near Ft Gibson Lake and almost just as close to Muskogee. Obviously Muskogee has all the shopping opportunities, but as I read some outside sources it has lots of good things to say. Good shopping, rising property values, some growth but not booming (booms eventually bust) a diverse economy etc. On this forum I hear about high crime rates...although I don't see statistics so I don't know if that is perception or reality. The other concern that I have is that the test scores at the schools in general are fairly poor according to the states school report cards. Is this the result of more minorities and generally a poorer area, or a result of poor schools and teaching? M daughter is going into 5th grade.

Thanks for any input.

[StillwaterTownie]

Bear in mind that Oklahoma schools are denied much support from the state. That is reflected in how state funding for schools is still below the high level achieved around 2008. So schools have to get much of their support at the local level by getting voters to fund bond issues. If voters always approve of bond issues to advance the schools in a given locality, I think you can judge they got decent schools in that locality.

[flyingcat2k]

ST's post is true for other Western states but not OK. In OK, the state pays the teachers and the bonds pay for the school and facilities. Thus, in high bond areas like Tulsa and OKC, you have really nice facilities but crappy education with underpaid and demotivated teachers in the average school, particularly rural ones. I would recommend looking at the compentency scores in the Tulsa World or Oklahoman to judge the level of education. Between those two papers, the state should be covered.

Tulsa does have incentive and performance pay but I do not know how large this program is and how much more teachers can earn based on performance. I realize that there is a lot of "teaching to the test" with this but some area local schools still make "Best of" lists in spite of this set up.

[okie1962]

Your family will probably find themselves going to Broken Arrow and Tulsa more often to shop than Muskogee even though Muskogee is much closer. My folks live near Checotah and drive through Muskogee to go shopping in tulsa. They rarely shop in Muskogee unless they just need to get some a Lowe's.

I'm just going to be brutally honest and say Muskogee is probably one of the most run down and tired cities in Oklahoma. While other cities in NE Oklahoma have seen growth Muskogee is losing population. Big sections of Muskogee have neighborhoods that are rundown and look as if there is no hope of them ever coming back to life.

[StillwaterTownie]

I would suggest a real big hailstorm hit Muskogee. The insurance claims would hopefully get people to fix up their homes and businesses. Hail worked wonders in 2009 to make Stillwater look less runned down.

Until the 1950s, Muskogee was the 3rd largest city in Oklahoma. It pretty much went stagnant after that.

[eddie gein]

It seems as though that Ft Gibson has basically become the "elite" suburb of Muskogee. I've heard Wagoner isn't bad but it is one of the few places in Oklahoma that I've never been.

Whatever, that area of Oklahoma is accessible to most of the really wonderful outdoor stuff in the state and our winters are so much milder than Nebraska that you can be outside most of the winter. I think you would enjoy that area.

[Rubi3]

Originally Posted by okie1962

Your family will probably find themselves going to Broken Arrow and Tulsa more often to shop than Muskogee even though Muskogee is much closer. My folks live near Checotah and drive through Muskogee to go shopping in tulsa. They rarely shop in Muskogee unless they just need to get some a Lowe's.

I'm just going to be brutally honest and say Muskogee is probably one of the most run down and tired cities in Oklahoma. While other cities in NE Oklahoma have seen growth Muskogee is losing population. Big sections of Muskogee have neighborhoods that are rundown and look as if there is no hope of them ever coming back to life.

I rarely travel to Tulsa or BA for anything. It would be unusual not to find whatever is needed in Muskogee. Imo, 100% of what okie1962 has posted about Muskogee is false and is almost identical to posts he/she has made in the past about Muskogee. I have no idea what drives her resentment about Muskogee, but, something does.

[teakboat]

I like the town of Wagoner, and I like the landscape / outdoors in that area. It is probably the best part of the state for the outdoors. And the land is nice around Wagoner. Don't know about the schools around there though.

[okie1962]

Originally Posted by Rubi3

I rarely travel to Tulsa or BA for anything. It would be unusual not to find whatever is needed in Muskogee. Imo, 100% of what okie1962 has posted about Muskogee is false and is almost identical to posts he/she has made in the past about Muskogee. I have no idea what drives her resentment about Muskogee, but, something does.

Well, I have lived in and around Muskogee most of my life. It would seem you must not get out of Muskogee very often if you are not able to see the problems in that city. Maybe you think most cities in Oklahoma are falling in and around themselves like Muskogee. So I will throw this out there, can you name any other Oklahoma city over 30k, that is as run down as Muskogee?

[swake]

Muskogee has a few nice areas but for the most part is pretty bad. Gangs, bad schools, mostly poor, lots of run down areas.

Wagoner is a pretty nice small town. Ft Gibson is an even smaller and even nicer small town. Lots of good stuff around the lake. Commuting from this area to Tulsa would be kinda rough but not undoable.