Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
That piece is crapola. Why would any parent think that livingi n one state and working in another, requiring 12+ hour days is going to work. That isn't being a bad mother, its being a bad parent. Fathers should not choose positions that require being away from home that much during the formative years.
It isnt that women can't have it all, its that PARENTS can't have it all. And even in that piece the author still worked full time, she just made a CHOICE to be in a more family friendly position.
It is a strawman and afalse dichotomy that working is bad and staying home is good. Working at the RIGHT job is just as good as staying home, at the very least for school aged children.
Although I agree about generally choosing the right job for the family, I think that thousands of military members would disagree with you on your first paragraph..... As a leader, I watched many of my soldiers struggle with balancing their parenting and military duties and it could be really tough. I wasn't a parent during my 21 years in the military but I really respected the military families, especially when both family members were service members and couldn't always be stationed together or were deployed.
Generally speaking though, yes, it is important to have a good job fit for the family. I know that I would put my foot down if my spouse had to travel a good portion of his time or work even longer hours than he does now.
Although I agree about generally choosing the right job for the family, I think that thousands of military members would disagree with you on your first paragraph..... As a leader, I watched many of my soldiers struggle with balancing their parenting and military duties and it could be really tough. I wasn't a parent during my 21 years in the military but I really respected the military families, especially when both family members were service members and couldn't always be stationed together or were deployed.
Generally speaking though, yes, it is important to have a good job fit for the family. I know that I would put my foot down if my spouse had to travel a good portion of his time or work even longer hours than he does now.
If both parents are deployed or are traveling from M-F someone else is either doing the parenting (i.e. grandparents or the children are being neglected. Military parents are no exception.
If one parent is deployed, than the other is a de facto single parent and this debate has nothing to do with them.
If both parents are deployed or are traveling from M-F someone else is either doing the parenting (i.e. grandparents or the children are being neglected. Military parents are no exception.
If one parent is deployed, than the other is a de facto single parent and this debate has nothing to do with them.
Although I agree about generally choosing the right job for the family, I think that thousands of military members would disagree with you on your first paragraph..... As a leader, I watched many of my soldiers struggle with balancing their parenting and military duties and it could be really tough. I wasn't a parent during my 21 years in the military but I really respected the military families, especially when both family members were service members and couldn't always be stationed together or were deployed.
Generally speaking though, yes, it is important to have a good job fit for the family. I know that I would put my foot down if my spouse had to travel a good portion of his time or work even longer hours than he does now.
Agreed, and I apologize for not thinking of military parents when I wrote that I couldn't imagine a job taking a parent away from their family.
Although I agree about generally choosing the right job for the family, I think that thousands of military members would disagree with you on your first paragraph..... As a leader, I watched many of my soldiers struggle with balancing their parenting and military duties and it could be really tough. I wasn't a parent during my 21 years in the military but I really respected the military families, especially when both family members were service members and couldn't always be stationed together or were deployed.
Generally speaking though, yes, it is important to have a good job fit for the family. I know that I would put my foot down if my spouse had to travel a good portion of his time or work even longer hours than he does now.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Katiana
Agreed, and I apologize for not thinking of military parents when I wrote that I couldn't imagine a job taking a parent away from their family.
Thanks Kat and no worries. I was responding more to ikb0714 about fathers not taking positions that required being away from home extensively during formative years. Made me cringe a bit thinking of some military families out there. That is why I wrote my disclaimer about military families....
My husband's dad had two tours in Vietnam and it was tough for the family. I give military families a lot of credit, especially the dual military couples with kids. That is a tough juggling act since hours and responsibilities can be very unpredictable. You have to have a very strong family support plan in place. I'm relieved that our kids came along when I was a civilian. Anyway sorry to go a bit off topic.
Exactly! Just this thread is full of people who actually just set unrealistic expectations and putting unnecessary burden on themselves. Of course a good parent is not one who is away Mon-Fri and only get to see the children on weekends. However, that is also not the only career choice, and she should not be surprised by how difficult it is to make that work, if at all possible. But then we also have people here who say they would only work if they can give 150% to their careers, which if the math is done correctly, means working 12 hours while getting paid 8 hours. That is in addition to assisting the children for 4 hours to do their homework, or she becomes a bad mother?! Then the requirement to do all the errands and chores within the weekdays or their children cannot spend their weekends doing 100% fun!
If that is how people here are setting the bar, then of course it's stressful and something's going to break. But their own bosses and children are not the ones who set these expectations! There's the occasional overtime hours that one needs to spend, but there are many bosses that are happy if they work only 40 to 45 hours a week, as opposed to 60 hours a week? Also, I don't think doing 4 hours of homework is necessary in most cases, plus I don't know any children who despised their parents because they have to run errands and do some chores on weekends, and end up with one day instead of two days to have some fun! If your children complain that you have to spend some hours with them on the weekends doing grocery shopping, buying their books for class, getting their outfits for the school play, etc. Do yourself a favor and smack them right there! You're not being a bad parent, they're being sheltered brats!
This thread touches on one of the most difficult issues I know I have had to face as a parent. I never anticipated how hard it could be to pursue career goals, along with your hopes of being a good parent. I had a dream job when I had my first child. I did quit when she was born because I knew I could not be a great parent working the days and hours I worked. Before having kids, I worked weekends, holidays, overnight--whatever it took.
I have since transitioned in and out of the workforce into more flexible, though not necessarily as rewarding, jobs. I have found that there are many companies that offer flexible work schedules for all their employees. In the last decade-plus, neither my husband nor I have worked for a company that did not offer some flexible work arrangements. My husband does work long hours, but he goes in when he wants and leaves when he wants and can finish work from home if need be. His company has about 90-percent male employees, and yet this flexibility policy is vital to their success because the men also want the flexibility.
My last full time job was like this as well. I could work from home when my kids were sick or leave work to go to a special event at school. In this day and age, this kind of arrangement is generally possible in most jobs requiring some work on the computer. This is not to say it is ideal. I am not nearly as "marketable" as I was years ago because of the choices I have made. I really took myself off the "high powered" career track, but I know I would have been unhappy if I was missing my kids' events. It really is tough to make these choices, and I don't know if there are any good answers.
And that is exactly what I and others have been saying. If you want to succeed, if you want to be on a high powered career track, then think twice about having kids. Because you cannot do both. I am glad someone finally came out and said it: the more flexible the job, the less rewarding the job, the less marketable you are, the less advancement, etc.
And let's be frank. Do we women go to college, go to grad school, get into student loan debt just to have a "less than ideal" job or career? No we do that in order to climb the ladder. But moms can't keep climbing. Eventually they hit a rung where the kids force them to stop climbing.
This is exactly what the physician who posted a while back was saying. Why bother killing yourself with school to have that high powered career if when you have kids, you have to give it up?
Thanks for your input. Obviously, there are no easy answers, and I didn't realize this was as hot-button of an issue as the length and counterpoints in this thread clearly show. With technology, research and studies into topics like employee engagement, the brain drain and recruitment and retention, it's obvious that workplace flexibility in computer-based, mind-centered, white collar jobs is reasonable and possible in the 21st century. Companies that top lists for being good places to work commonly have flexible options in place for all or most members of their workforces.
In my position, I have the flexibility to start and stop my day at whatever time I choose; however, the full expectation is that I will be in a seat, in my office, for no less than 8-10 hours that day. I can also leave to attend appointments or events, but not in a way that is generally culturally approved or affirming. I can opt to work from home periodically, but not without my department having to lie about where I am, what I'm doing, etc., because there is no sanctioned companywide policy on this.
Right now, these covert limited notions of flexibility are no longer adequate for me. Right now, it's apparent that something is going to have to change.
Yes, I went to college and earned undergraduate and graduate degrees. Yes, my resume is pretty impressive. Yes, I have a good body of solid professional experiences and accomplishments. However, the world of work as it currently manifests in my life is not congruent with the needs of my family or the evolving demands of motherhood I had no idea were coming down the pipeline (with school-aged children, no less). If I cannot negotiate a new normal with my current employer, I am leaving.
I would hope to find some other part-time or home-based way to generate some income while I pursue other interests (as previously mentioned) and secure some freelance or consultant-based projects under a sole proprietorship. This would enable me to keep one toe in the working world and make some financial contributions to the household, but also provide the freedom and flexibility the rigid corporate world just won't provide.
And that is exactly what I and others have been saying. If you want to succeed, if you want to be on a high powered career track, then think twice about having kids. Because you cannot do both. I am glad someone finally came out and said it: the more flexible the job, the less rewarding the job, the less marketable you are, the less advancement, etc.
And let's be frank. Do we women go to college, go to grad school, get into student loan debt just to have a "less than ideal" job or career? No we do that in order to climb the ladder. But moms can't keep climbing. Eventually they hit a rung where the kids force them to stop climbing.
This is exactly what the physician who posted a while back was saying. Why bother killing yourself with school to have that high powered career if when you have kids, you have to give it up?
hautemomma, I hope you find something that works better for you.
sinatras, I said it upthread, but I'll say it again. Not everyone wants to climb the ladder. I went to college so I could get a decent paying job. That goes for men too. A lot of people are content to go to work, do their job, and have enough time left at the end of the day to see their family. Someone told me years ago, you work to live, not live to work. Wise words, I think.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
. As a leader, I watched many of my soldiers struggle with balancing their parenting and military duties and it could be really tough. I wasn't a parent during my 21 years in the military but I really respected the military families, especially when both family members were service members and couldn't always be stationed together or were deployed.
