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My wife was a private preschool teacher and my daughter is a private school teacher . No comparison to what the pay and benefits are from the board of ed
My wife was a private preschool teacher and my daughter is a private school teacher . No comparison to what the pay and benefits are from the board of ed
It's a pretty big myth that teachers make out like homeless First, they can generally start their career after four or five years of college at 22-23. (My sister did it in 3.5 and started at 21). After 30-35 years they get a generous pension and oftentimes other benefits such as medical, etc.
They also are on the calendar about 180 days a year and that would include I think in service, etc.
The profession also doesn't have as rigorous of entry requirements as, say, a Medical Dr., CPA, etc...I took the CBEST test in California so I could substitute teach while going to graduate school. I think something like 60% of the people who took it failed it. I think I missed one and I'm not a genius. It's at about the eighth grade level.
Before I get a lot of "hate" posts, it's a very honorable profession, but hardly one in which the market dictates that teachers should be paid a lot more than they are making. In CA, one can earn 90-100k after a number of years...plus, one can go higher and become an administrator, etc....no limit, really....
Private schools can recruit good teachers and pay them less than public school teachers so the market salary for teachers isn't higher (but is actually lower) than what most are being paid now.
I think this is why you'll find that most recent college education majors are unemployed. At least in the Northeast and on the west coast, union public education jobs pay really well. Tons of people got education degrees hoping to latch onto the gravy train. Unless it's in a failed school system where nobody wants the job, it's tough to find work as a new grad.
In my town, 20 years and a masters at the local teacher's college paid for by the school department pays $75K. It includes full benefits and a generous pension. That is for 180 teaching days plus another five in the summer. After you've taught for a couple of years, your lesson plan is pretty much on autopilot. Unless you're an English teacher grading papers, you can keep up with the work load in 8 hours if you're disciplined about your time. The teachers I know who complain about a horrible work load where they're working nights & weekends tend to be masters of procrastination. An elementary school principal pays 6 figures but that's both more responsibility and a lot more hours.
The median household income in the United States is a bit over $50K. That is typically for a married couple. Two married public school teachers are easily over that no matter where they live in the country. Where I live, a married couple who are both teachers with 10+ are comfortably upper middle class.
If you have the personality for the job, it's pretty good money for the hours you're logging.
I know teachers that started making 25-30k/yr as recently as 2 years ago. Was not aware that's a middle class income. That's the equivalent of 14.42/hr.
Using that same logic a couple living in Manhattan is middle class with a 450k/yr income and a couple working in the same building as them But living in New Jersey making 175k is also middle class.
One can always find a more expensive place to live and in these places owning the equivalent of a "middle class" dwelling can cost ten million dollars.
You would consider a teaching a working class or low class job?
I don't know the ins and outs of Orlando real estate, but it seems to have a very low cost of living. And, sadly, Florida is notorious for treating teachers (and education) poorly.
I get that, I was responding to the person who said a teacher is always in the middle class. This was in Orlando, FL.
My post (which you responded to) was partly in response to the poster who implied teachers making higher than the median income were above middle class. I have a really hard time accepting that teaching school is so vastly different in different parts that the teachers themselves (the actual human beings) fall on either end of the "social class" bell curve
Which goes to the point that middle class lifestyle (or social class) is not necessarily the same as middle class (or median) income. That's the answer to why so many people define themselves as "middle class." I would argue when people use the term "middle class" to describe where they fall on the social class spectrum, the far ends of lower-middle class (income and lifestyle) and upper-middle class (income and lifestyle) are being included. So when people define themselves as "middle class" they are not necessarily saying "my household income falls in the middle quintile of incomes according to the IRS" They're saying "I have middle class values and can identify with the vast majority of Americans"
So all the income examples being thrown around: $450K vs $150K, $85K vs $100K, doctor income vs teacher income, etc. Yeah, those can all be "middle class folks." Some upper-upper-middle, some might be lower-middle, but they have more in common with each other than with the fifth-generation trust-fund kid in the gated estate, OR the third-generation single-parent living on food stamps.
I think this is why you'll find that most recent college education majors are unemployed. At least in the Northeast and on the west coast, union public education jobs pay really well. Tons of people got education degrees hoping to latch onto the gravy train. Unless it's in a failed school system where nobody wants the job, it's tough to find work as a new grad.
In my town, 20 years and a masters at the local teacher's college paid for by the school department pays $75K. It includes full benefits and a generous pension. That is for 180 teaching days plus another five in the summer. After you've taught for a couple of years, your lesson plan is pretty much on autopilot. Unless you're an English teacher grading papers, you can keep up with the work load in 8 hours if you're disciplined about your time. The teachers I know who complain about a horrible work load where they're working nights & weekends tend to be masters of procrastination. An elementary school principal pays 6 figures but that's both more responsibility and a lot more hours.
The median household income in the United States is a bit over $50K. That is typically for a married couple. Two married public school teachers are easily over that no matter where they live in the country. Where I live, a married couple who are both teachers with 10+ are comfortably upper middle class.
If you have the personality for the job, it's pretty good money for the hours you're logging.
Your post is 100% right on. I think if I was to do it all over again, I'd go into teaching. I probably would have ended up begin an administrator, or some similar position and would have retired many years ago instead of Oct. 1. By the way using your same longevity figures above the California District I just moved from pays 95k plus. Hardly a pittance for 185 days of "work" a year. That's for a "teacher." Other positions can pay significantly more.
This is technically why everyone considers themselves middle class. Your comparison is always your neighbors and there will always be some that are struggling more than you and some that are doing signicantly better hence you are in the middle class of your peer group.
Mathjak,
It's more expensive to live in Manhattan than it is to live in New Jersey, so is a couple making 225k living in Manhattan middle class and a couple making 85k living in New Jersey middle class? They both work in the same city. One just lives in the most expensive part and the other lives in an area with a cheaper cost of living and a longer commute.
How much one makes doesn't mean a thing; it's purchasing power that counts. If it only costs me $50,000 in Cheapsville to buy what I should have to pay $100,000 for in NYC, in terms of our quality of life and purchasing power - we're even. Many 'Cheapsville' locations are more peaceful and scenic than NYC, if not as culturally sophisticated.
but nothing beats eventually selling the nyc place and taking all that dough eventually to cheapsville .
those that always live in cheapsville will likely never have that luxury .
the fact high cost areas take a lot more of your income at the end of the day to buy a house . eventually that forces a much larger forced savings on you . that becomes a bonus at the end if you relocate . generally high cost areas are high cost because of higher appreciating property .
i realized that when we owned a 2nd home in the much cheaper pocono's .
those locals never have that ability like we do coming from high cost high appreciation areas . we have long islander's all over who sold those tiny homes for as much as 800k and relocated to cheapsville . all the locals have at best is a 150k home and not much savings and not many areas to go to either because thy can't afford to move , or they still won't get a windfall out of it .
Last edited by mathjak107; 11-24-2015 at 04:32 AM..
but nothing beats eventually selling the nyc place and taking all that dough eventually to cheapsville .
those that always live in cheapsville will likely never have that luxury .
the fact high cost areas take a lot more of your income at the end of the day to buy a house . eventually that forces a much larger forced savings on you . that becomes a bonus at the end if you relocate . generally high cost areas are high cost because of higher appreciating property .
i realized that when we owned a 2nd home in the much cheaper pocono's .
those locals never have that ability like we do coming from high cost high appreciation areas . we have long islander's all over who sold those tiny homes for as much as 800k and relocated to cheapsville . all the locals have at best is a 150k home and not much savings and not many areas to go to either because thy can't afford to move , or they still won't get a windfall out of it .
I used to live in South Carolina and we had a lot of ex-New Yorkers. Many of them were from SC, but moved to NYC as young adults. They worked their entire adult lives in NYC, lived in places like Brooklyn, Queens, etc, and eventually decided to retire and sell their house/apartment and move back to South Carolina where they grew up. They had NYC-sized pensions and now a paid-off home, coupled with retirement in LCOL. It was a win/win for them.
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