Amazon HQ? (Philadelphia: unemployed, restaurant, store)

[phillies2011]

Originally Posted by Janszoon

Since my comment got lost in the great purge, I just wanted to say again that I don't think Amazon coming to Philly would be a good thing. I'm not a fan of the control they seem to want exert in the places they set up shop.

[Janszoon]

Originally Posted by phillies2011

Are you of the opinion that we simply must have Amazon?

[phillies2011]

Originally Posted by Janszoon

Are you of the opinion that we simply must have Amazon?

Haha what? Of course not. I'm just not about to turn my nose up at tens of thousands of jobs and a big boost to the economy because of some nebulous fear mongering.

[Janszoon]

Originally Posted by phillies2011

Haha what? Of course not. I'm just not about to turn my nose up at tens of thousands of jobs and a big boost to the economy because of some nebulous fear mongering.

And I'm not about to buy into a bunch big promises just because a mega corporation makes them. So I guess it's a draw.

[phillies2011]

Originally Posted by Janszoon

And I'm not about to buy into a bunch big promises just because a mega corporation makes them. So I guess it's a draw.

You don't buy the big promises? Lol so... what then exactly? You think this is a big charade and they're not going to move jobs to the city that wins HQ2? Seems unlikely.

You think they don't deliver on 50,000 jobs? Ok. Reasonable enough, I'm sure they're estimating on the high end to increase anticipation. But then even if they only brought 10,000 jobs they'd be one of the 10 biggest private employers in Philly. That would still be a big deal.

But you don't want those jobs or the larger economic impact they'll bring because... why exactly? Oh yes. Because of the "control they seem to want to exert." As brilliantly constructed as that argument is, some might say it lacks substance.

[Janszoon]

Originally Posted by phillies2011

You don't buy the big promises? Lol so... what then exactly? You think this is a big charade and they're not going to move jobs to the city that wins HQ2? Seems unlikely.

You think they don't deliver on 50,000 jobs? Ok. Reasonable enough, I'm sure they're estimating on the high end to increase anticipation. But then even if they only brought 10,000 jobs they'd be one of the 10 biggest private employers in Philly. That would still be a big deal.

But you don't want those jobs or the larger economic impact they'll bring because... why exactly? Oh yes. Because of the "control they seem to want to exert." As brilliantly constructed as that argument is, some might say it lacks substance.

The bolded made me laugh. Thanks.

I'm not postulating some grand conspiracy here, I'm just saying they're painting a rosy picture of the situation. I don't think it's controversial to suggest that people who are selling something do this, it's pretty much a given.

I realize people get excited by the idea of a high profile company setting up shop in their city and bringing a whole bunch of jobs. What I'm saying is be careful what you wish for. Growth is good, but this kind of growth can be problematic. Philadelphia is already a rapidly gentrifying city, Amazon coming to town will likely slam the gas pedal to the floor on that. That's what happened in Seattle—it went from being one of the most affordable cities on the west coast to being one of the priciest in a short span of time. So now poor, working class, and even middle class people are being priced out. Homelessness shot up. Landlords gave priority to tech workers, again pushing other people out. The pace of construction couldn't keep pace with demand so even the people who could afford it struggled to find places to live.

I guess I can see why the issue of Amazon's level of control over where they set up camp could seem sort of nebulous to you. What I'm talking about is the way they've taken over Seattle, which is probably a good indicator of how they'd operate elsewhere. They are the largest landowner in that city at this point, I believe, and they own some crazy percentage of the property downtown. That's not just their office space. They're the landlord to a lot of other businesses and they dictate what kinds of restaurants open up, for example, and what their hours are. They're deciding on the kinds of people that they want to attract to downtown Seattle, how it looks, what its character will be. I don't know, to me it's undesireable to have a corporation laying claim to the heart of a city like that.

[kyb01]

Originally Posted by Janszoon

The bolded made me laugh. Thanks.

I'm not postulating some grand conspiracy here, I'm just saying they're painting a rosy picture of the situation. I don't think it's controversial to suggest that people who are selling something do this, it's pretty much a given.

I realize people get excited by the idea of a high profile company setting up shop in their city and bringing a whole bunch of jobs. What I'm saying is be careful what you wish for. Growth is good, but this kind of growth can be problematic. Philadelphia is already a rapidly gentrifying city, Amazon coming to town will likely slam the gas pedal to the floor on that. That's what happened in Seattle—it went from being one of the most affordable cities on the west coast to being one of the priciest in a short span of time. So now poor, working class, and even middle class people are being priced out. Homelessness shot up. Landlords gave priority to tech workers, again pushing other people out. The pace of construction couldn't keep pace with demand so even the people who could afford it struggled to find places to live.

I guess I can see why the issue of Amazon's level of control over where they set up camp could seem sort of nebulous to you. What I'm talking about is the way they've taken over Seattle, which is probably a good indicator of how they'd operate elsewhere. They are the largest landowner in that city at this point, I believe, and they own some crazy percentage of the property downtown. That's not just their office space. They're the landlord to a lot of other businesses and they dictate what kinds of restaurants open up, for example, and what their hours are. They're deciding on the kinds of people that they want to attract to downtown Seattle, how it looks, what its character will be. I don't know, to me it's undesireable to have a corporation laying claim to the heart of a city like that.

You bring up good points(again) but there was already a massive discussion about the possible downside of them coming here up thread.

Tbh, I don't think they're coming here. I think it will be metro dc so maybe you should calm down a little.

[Janszoon]

Originally Posted by kyb01

You bring up good points(again) but there was already a massive discussion about the possible downside of them coming here up thread.

Tbh, I don't think they're coming here. I think it will be metro dc so maybe you should calm down a little.

LOL. I'm already calm, I'm not sure there's much further down I can go from here.

I don't think they're coming here either, by the way. My guess is they'll go to Atlanta.

[MarketStEl]

Originally Posted by Janszoon

LOL. I'm already calm, I'm not sure there's much further down I can go from here.

I don't think they're coming here either, by the way. My guess is they'll go to Atlanta.

Based on what Kevin Gillen at Drexel said to me early on, my money's on Austin.

But since (as he put it) this whole game was designed to "let the head of the A.V. club play" before the cheerleader went to the prom with the quarterback of the football team, there's always an outside chance that the A.V. club guy put on a more impressive show than the cheerleader thought he would.

I do think that Philly's initial presentation to Amazon was strong enough to put the city in the role of that A.V. club guy, and we check off all of Amazon's stated boxes. But then the boss'-residence factor comes into play. That metro has three finalists in the 20. That to me signals something too.

[Leps12]

Originally Posted by Janszoon

LOL. I'm already calm, I'm not sure there's much further down I can go from here.

I don't think they're coming here either, by the way. My guess is they'll go to Atlanta.

Oof. The traffic impact alone, if city wasn’t already bad enough, I think is enough to DQ them.

The quantity and quality of schools and universities in the Northeast Corridor that pertinent to Amazon’s needs simply cannot be matched. DC to Boston is an education superhighway, and it is extremely important to Amazon to have a strong local talent pool. Chicago isn’t too shabby either but I still think pales in comparison to anywhere in BosWash.

Honestly I cannot envision other cities checking off all of the boxes of quality education, major international airport, and real urban environments with good mass transit options. It’s BosWash, Chicago, or Toronto if Amazon wants the total package. And I’d be ready to eliminate NYC because of expense, Newark, NoVa, and MontCo, MD because they are edge cities and not primary cities, and also eliminate DC because of expense and the fact that Bezos already has the Washington Post based there.

I think it’s Boston, Chicago, Philadelphia, or Toronto. Bezos can buy another house. It’s chump change for him. No worries there.

As for an impact on Philly, the city once held 2.1 million people. Now it’s around 1.6. If Amazon delivers on the 50K Jobs, let’s assume some are bringing families and SO’s, while others are single, many of whom recent college grads. I’ll peg it at 100K people potentially impacted. The city still won’t be anywhere near it’s all time high. Areas will be revitalized, but I can’t foresee a housing crisis that ends up forcing out massive swathes of people. Not everyone will move to the city anyway. Some of that 100K, particularly those with school age children, will live in the burbs. And some of that 100K will already be living in he area to begin with.

Amazon would be a great thing for Philly. More development will radiate around University City if they choose Schuykill Yards. It won’t even come close to reaching all corners of the city. It will be a big positive change, but even with all of that, there will still be lots more room left for improvements throughout the city, and I think any worries about Philly turning into the next NYC, San Francisco, or Seattle are overblown.