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Everyone has an opinion. Phoenix isn't for everyone. That being said, you were only here for 3 months. This is a large city and it takes years before you can really see the entire city. I'm sure you've been to parts of Paradise Valley but PV is fairly large and differs incredibly depending on where you are in PV. I love PV but I agree there are parts of PV that astonished me as well and looked run down. I think Scottsdale is beautiful and it looks different as well depending where you are. South Scottsdale is older and more urban. North Scottsdale is more "desert-like"
Having lived in the South, it did bother me that we have so many cookie cutter homes. That isn't limited to Phoenix, I hope you know that. If you go to Southern California, the same thing exists there. That being said, there are many beautiful custom home neighborhoods. I do think the homes in the South are beautiful but there are pretty seedy areas of Atlanta and Charlotte as well. It's true, we have many cookie cutter homes but cities like Atlanta and Charlotte have shanties that look like slums in a third world country; Phoenix really doesn't have that element. But yes, I prefer brick homes to the stucco that we have here.
With regard to diversity, it depends on what type of diversity you are referring to. Phoenix has a lot of geographic diversity. People in the Valley are from all over the country and I truly appreciate that as opposed to cities in the South where you have generations of people attending the same high schools and college and aren't really hospitable to outsiders. We also have a vibrant Latin community and a growing Asian population. Sure, we don't have a lot of African Americans and people from the South are used to that. Our AA community is growing as well.
And while there might be diversity in the South, that doesn't mean there is acceptance. The South still has a lot of racism and apartheid. Sure, it's not South Africa but when you have certain areas of the city essentially segregated by race, it can feel that way. And the Evangelical Christian element in the South is not very tolerant toward people of other faiths, homosexuals and people who reject organized religion and don't attend church regularly. And their thinking goes beyond race and religion. Even with regard to things like acupuncture, yoga, alternative forms of healing etc, they are very closed minded about those issues whereas in Arizona and the West Coast in general, they are much more receptive. My wife is a vegetarian and was often ridiculed in the South and made to uncomfortable if we went to a restaurant and asked them to hold meat or order dishes with no meat. I also don't care for the excess fried food, country music and generally unhealthy lifestyles; I've never seen more fat doctors in my life than in South and I'm referring to cardiologists!
Finally, with regard to lack of greenery, I disagree. Many share that opinion but I don't agree. It's not the Pacific Northwest but it's not brown dirt everywhere either. There is plenty of trees and grass. Sure, it might be manicured and it's not bountiful but I've never found it difficult to find a home with grass, trees and plants.
As for my personal experience, this is also completely false. I was never treated badly as a so-called minority in Phoenix, but I also felt always welcome in Charlotte and Atlanta by, all races. Matter of fact, having come from the Northeast (where I experienced more racism than anywhere else), I was expecting the worst and found most of what people say aabout the south is a myth. The south has changed! If it were not the case you better believe that I would not still be living in this part of the South!
As for my personal experience, this is also completely false. I was never treated badly as a so-called minority in Phoenix, but I also felt always welcome in Charlotte and Atlanta by, all races. Matter of fact, having come from the Northeast (where I experienced more racism than anywhere else), I was expecting the worst and found most of what people say aabout the south is a myth. The south has changed! If it were not the case you better believe that I would not still be living in this part of the South!
Everyone's experience will be different. My experience is no more false than yours. I will never live in the South again for the reasons I stated and am very happy here.
I've lived in all three cities and South Phoenix is as much or more "third world" than anything I saw in Atlanta or Charlotte (especially Charlotte). also, the long, long stretch along Jefferson going east is one of the worse eyesores I have ever seen. Don't know if they cleaned that up though since I moved away.
Sorry Steele Creek in Charlotte makes South Phoenix look like Scottsdale. And Atlanta, don't even get me started; you have both trailer parks and ghettos. I'll take boring cookie cutter over not having to deal with that.
Sorry Steele Creek in Charlotte makes South Phoenix look like Scottsdale. And Atlanta, don't even get me started; you have both trailer parks and ghettos. I'll take boring cookie cutter over not having to deal with that.
Again, my experience and perceptions are totally difference from yours. But that's what makes the world go round, right. Peace.
Azriver. Thanks. The point I was really trying to make is that every city, especially as large as the three we've been discussing, has the good, bad and the ugly sides. And every person places aesthetics value differently. Therefore there is no need to bash one city to build up the other (which too many on C-D are rpone to do).
I absolutely, positively enjoyed my two years living in Phoenix. I thought that most of the city was very clean and beautiful. I even thought I would stay for a long time but duty called , and plus I did'nt adjust very well to the two summers I spent there. Even though humidity is much worse in the Southeast, I do better in humid weather with lower temps. But my wife is the opposite.
I've lived in all three cities and South Phoenix is as much or more "third world" than anything I saw in Atlanta or Charlotte (especially Charlotte). also, the long, long stretch along Jefferson going east is one of the worse eyesores I have ever seen. Don't know if they cleaned that up though since I moved away.
There are good and bad parts of every city, not just Phoenix and it sounds like you did not get out much when you did live there. We just drove through Phoenix today and it could not have been more beautiful with the clouds and sprinkling of rain. Made us glad we chose this place.
There are trade-off's no matter where you chose to live in this country.
Greenery, yea....none of that in the desert.
Brick homes? Not many but you can find them if you wish....I have seen a ton of them in the custom home neighborhoods near me.
I do agree with you about Scottsdale...apparently people have this idea that when they enter Scottsdale they will see billion dollar homes and that can be true in some parts but North Glendale actually has more expensive homes per capita than scottsdale so the hype about scottsdale sometimes does not live up to itself. It is a legend in its own mind lol.
PV and the Biltmore area are nice but yes, old. They have been around for quite a while so many of the buildings are older but, to me, beautiful.
Heat is better than snow for many, that is the trade off. We do not have to wake up an hour early every morning to shovel our cars out of snow or clear the driveway so we can pull out. We have amazingly beautiful weather in the winter months so that is the trade off.
Foreclosures, yes...our housing economy was hit pretty hard but the nicer area's will hold their value. No diversity?? I feel we have the opposite....tons of diversity. My neighbors just moved here from London.
Quote:
Originally Posted by abad
My turn to narrate my story. Moved here 3 months back from NC. Big change.
U will not see greenery
no upscale brick homes, they all stucco.
Don't know whats so great about scottsdale. Just clean roads with old buildings.
Even the best area like they call Paradise Valley, Biltmore don't know whats so special there. Compare it with Ballantyne/ South Park in Charlotte or Buck Head in Atl. Paradise Valley looks old and run down compared to them.
Climate n heat is Ok.
There are lot of foreclosures and deals in so so areas. Home are still expensive in the desirable areas.
No diversity.
I might be wrong on my comments please forgive me. This was my opinion.
Everyone has an opinion. Phoenix isn't for everyone. That being said, you were only here for 3 months. This is a large city and it takes years before you can really see the entire city. I'm sure you've been to parts of Paradise Valley but PV is fairly large and differs incredibly depending on where you are in PV. I love PV but I agree there are parts of PV that astonished me as well and looked run down. I think Scottsdale is beautiful and it looks different as well depending where you are. South Scottsdale is older and more urban. North Scottsdale is more "desert-like"
Having lived in the South, it did bother me that we have so many cookie cutter homes. That isn't limited to Phoenix, I hope you know that. If you go to Southern California, the same thing exists there. That being said, there are many beautiful custom home neighborhoods. I do think the homes in the South are beautiful but there are pretty seedy areas of Atlanta and Charlotte as well. It's true, we have many cookie cutter homes but cities like Atlanta and Charlotte have shanties that look like slums in a third world country; Phoenix really doesn't have that element. But yes, I prefer brick homes to the stucco that we have here.
With regard to diversity, it depends on what type of diversity you are referring to. Phoenix has a lot of geographic diversity. People in the Valley are from all over the country and I truly appreciate that as opposed to cities in the South where you have generations of people attending the same high schools and college and aren't really hospitable to outsiders. We also have a vibrant Latin community and a growing Asian population. Sure, we don't have a lot of African Americans and people from the South are used to that. Our AA community is growing as well.
And while there might be diversity in the South, that doesn't mean there is acceptance. The South still has a lot of racism and apartheid. Sure, it's not South Africa but when you have certain areas of the city essentially segregated by race, it can feel that way. And the Evangelical Christian element in the South is not very tolerant toward people of other faiths, homosexuals and people who reject organized religion and don't attend church regularly. And their thinking goes beyond race and religion. Even with regard to things like acupuncture, yoga, alternative forms of healing etc, they are very closed minded about those issues whereas in Arizona and the West Coast in general, they are much more receptive. My wife is a vegetarian and was often ridiculed in the South and made to uncomfortable if we went to a restaurant and asked them to hold meat or order dishes with no meat. I also don't care for the excess fried food, country music and generally unhealthy lifestyles; I've never seen more fat doctors in my life than in South and I'm referring to cardiologists!
Finally, with regard to lack of greenery, I disagree. Many share that opinion but I don't agree. It's not the Pacific Northwest but it's not brown dirt everywhere either. There is plenty of trees and grass. Sure, it might be manicured and it's not bountiful but I've never found it difficult to find a home with grass, trees and plants.
Good points, I agree. I have relatives in the south and have a heck of a time with the church ladies when I visit my sister. I never have that problem here.
...U... can find greenery everywhere, but the geography of the area is what it is, a desert; not the Smoky Mountains.
Quote:
Originally Posted by abad
no upscale brick homes, they all stucco.
Same reason that you don't see many big upscale stucco or pueblo style homes in South Carolina or Georgia. Different climate, different history, different materials, different city, different age.
Quote:
Originally Posted by abad
Even the best area like they call Paradise Valley, Biltmore don't know whats so special there. Compare it with Ballantyne/ South Park in Charlotte or Buck Head in Atl.
Paradise Valley looks old and run down compared to them.
The southwest is nothing like the South. People who prefer big southern homes constructed before Arizona was a state, placed on stately green southern lots surrounded by southern trees and southern vegetation, and owned by people who are connected by a thread to someone who fought in the Civil War, may have some problems adjusting to western states. That's all it amounts to
Quote:
Originally Posted by abad
Home are still expensive in the desirable areas.
Desirable areas for Phoenix, or areas that have that "Dixie" charm? The southern version of desirable is ubiquitous. Big tall homes on big green lots with big shrubs dividing the big properties. Not the same here. There are plenty of good values on desirable homes.
Quote:
Originally Posted by abad
No diversity.
Or perhaps just not your preferred brand of diversity?
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