Don't be homeless in Scottsdale (house, buying, tax)

[Bill-]

I'd hardly consider this a "Scottsdale" specific issue. I lived in Chicago for many years and dealt with the homeless people every day. They are routinely stepped over, avoided etc. At a certain point you become numb to them as a defense mechanism, you can't possibly help them all. I learned to look straight ahead, not make eye contact and go about my day. Most of them need substance abuse and or psychiatric help, not handouts from well meaning people.

[sablebaby]

Originally Posted by TurcoLoco

I hope you were trying to be funny because that comment is just as unfair as Nana to generalize the entire Scottsdale people on the account of a few bypassers!

This is a controversial topic and as others mentioned, far from being a Scottsdale-specific issue! This can and does happen everywhere!

What Nana did is commendable but let's keep it real, most people (including the ones here) would not be so compassionate either!

I present some additional controversional questions for you all to think about (if you already have not):
~ Why do people get alerted when a bum passes out on the street but not when he/she actually became a bum?
~ Do the bums stay that way thanks to kind-hearted people feeding them?
~ Is giving people like that water and food a solution or a 1-time fix which might be making the matters worse for all?
~ Should the society, the goverment or the individuals themselves be blamed for this?
~ He was capable enough to get beer but not water even though water can be obtained for free? Should he not be blamed for dehydrating his own dumb self by drinking beer in this weather if the water was not available?
~ Did Nana really saved that guy or just prolonged his parasitic life a bit longer?
~ What if he had some serious contagious disease and he passed it onto you when you where trying to help him up or give him water?

Don't get me wrong, I am not a heartless prick, I'd love to help those who are in need but when I see people who are seriously handicapped yet still working in various jobs and see this bum that has no apparent excuses to not work and be productive instead chooses to be a freeloader....I may not be so inclined to run for his help, so sue me.

Wow, I find this to be the worse of this thread.

Like someone else said, MOST americans are 1-2 paychecks away from being HOMELESS (NOT a "bum"). There are thousands of reasons why a person becomes homeless, we don't know the reasons, but some are quick to jump to conclusions that they are parasites. I think that perception, or belief, is very disheartening. Don't forget about the huge percentage who are mentally ill and have no one to help them with their illness. What a bunch of crap!

[sierraAZ]

Originally Posted by sablebaby

Like someone else said, MOST americans are 1-2 paychecks away from being HOMELESS (NOT a "bum").

Absolutely!

[azkylady2]

Originally Posted by TurcoLoco

I hope you were trying to be funny because that comment is just as unfair as Nana to generalize the entire Scottsdale people on the account of a few bypassers!

This is a controversial topic and as others mentioned, far from being a Scottsdale-specific issue! This can and does happen everywhere!

What Nana did is commendable but let's keep it real, most people (including the ones here) would not be so compassionate either!

I present some additional controversional questions for you all to think about (if you already have not):
~ Why do people get alerted when a bum passes out on the street but not when he/she actually became a bum?
~ Do the bums stay that way thanks to kind-hearted people feeding them?
~ Is giving people like that water and food a solution or a 1-time fix which might be making the matters worse for all?
~ Should the society, the goverment or the individuals themselves be blamed for this?
~ He was capable enough to get beer but not water even though water can be obtained for free? Should he not be blamed for dehydrating his own dumb self by drinking beer in this weather if the water was not available?
~ Did Nana really saved that guy or just prolonged his parasitic life a bit longer?
~ What if he had some serious contagious disease and he passed it onto you when you where trying to help him up or give him water?

Don't get me wrong, I am not a heartless prick, I'd love to help those who are in need but when I see people who are seriously handicapped yet still working in various jobs and see this bum that has no apparent excuses to not work and be productive instead chooses to be a freeloader....I may not be so inclined to run for his help, so sue me.

sorry to tell you if I seen someone laying in the parking lot half dead I would call 911 as well. Bum or no Bum, and most people I am sure would do the same, of course as you see there are a few that would step over a person to.

[TurcoLoco]

Originally Posted by azkylady2

Lucky for this man you were the one to pass by

Originally Posted by sablebaby

Wow, I find this to be the worse of this thread.

Like someone else said, MOST americans are 1-2 paychecks away from being HOMELESS (NOT a "bum"). There are thousands of reasons why a person becomes homeless, we don't know the reasons, but some are quick to jump to conclusions that they are parasites. I think that perception, or belief, is very disheartening. Don't forget about the huge percentage who are mentally ill and have no one to help them with their illness. What a bunch of crap!

Say what you will but do not hate me for bringing a realistic perspective on the issue! Or hate me for all I care.
The fact is, if you are homeless that is one thing and I can sympathize but you are a homeless who passes out on the street on a hot Summer day with a beer bottle in your hand-make no mistake my lady- you ARE a bum and a parasite.
We all may fall down but you choose to stay down with a beer bottle in your hand instead of looking for a way to get up you are SOL. If you have mental issues, well...isn't this something the city/state has to handle with our tax dollars?
When was the last time you gave some money to those so called 'homeless' who said they were starving for X amount of days and actually bought food with the money you gave them?
I offered to buy food to this "homeless" gave who insisted on receiving the $$ instead and when I insisted on buying him the food, he said thanks and walked away.
You are fooling yourself if you think you will end this problem or their suffering buy giving them some change or food/drink. If you are doing something more effective I'd love to know but if not, give me a flippin' break, ok?

[passnthru]

Good thing you were getting gas in Scottsdale and not 7th st and Roosevelt. Would have depleted three quarters of the Phoenix fire & police departments.

No offense, you are obviously well intentioned. But your thoughts are a bit on the naive side of things. Big city= Big city problems, this type of stuff will only get worse. It comes with the territory and no fire truck or cup of water will be able to make it go away.

[GirlinAZ]

Originally Posted by nitram

Nana, you need to be commended. You are a speciasl one of a kind.

Thanks. I try to not let the negative posters on here get to me. My intention was that I felt that this was something that shouldn't happen in a modern world. This isn't a third world nation. No one should ever walk over a body. I mean, this arrogance of people that think it could never happen to them, and that all you need to do is get a job makes me crazy. Life is different for everyone. I have been on hard times, and I have been wealthy. I have the breadth of experience so that I can speak of these things with experience. THIS CAN HAPPEN TO ANYONE. YOU ARE ALL ONE MAJOR ACCIDENT AWAY FROM THIS. BE BLESSED THAT YOU HAVE FAMILY IF YOU DO THAT WOULD HELP YOU. Not everyone is so lucky.

Originally Posted by AZ91

NanawaleJulie, too bad there isn't more people in the world like you.

If you feel that way-you must be one too. Be the change you want to see-that is how I live my life. I am sure there are good people out there. I think the hussle and bustle of daily life gets in the way sometimes. If we could all try to empathize with others a bit more, this world would be a much better place.

Originally Posted by chicagocarol

Nana,I have to agree, I would hate to think how long that man would have laid there or worse, had you not acted when you did! Y

I never meant this to say this is a Scottsdale only thing. I just wanted to make a point that there was so much money in that parking lot between the cars and the wallets, and no one could buy this man a drink of water. They looked at him like a piece of trash. It is disgraceful. Please everyone, open your hearts. It takes so little to do so much.

Originally Posted by Boatdrinks

This is not a Scottsdale-specific situation and while I personally wouldn't want to live there, I wouldn't lump everyone into one category.

Again, this is not supposed to say that this only occurs here. Many of the homeless people have some form of mental illness. Just because one person cussed at you doesn't mean that they were even in their right mind. I have never seen this man before and I live in this area. I know many of the homeless here. My point is that there shouldn't be homeless. There shouldn't be people walking over a near death person. There shouldn't be a lack of empathy for others as we are all one major catastrophy away from bankruptcy-I know first hand.
FOR EVERYONE HERE ON OUT-THIS IS NOT ONLY A SCOTTSDALE ISSUE-BUT WITH ALL THE MONEY THAT THERE IS HERE (and was in the parking lot today)-IT MADE ME ILL TO SEE THE LACK OF HUMANITY. THIS MAN WAS SKIN AND BONES. HE WAS RED FACED AND UNCONSCIOUS (SP?). IF HE DIDN'T HAVE A BEER IN FRONT OF HIM AND HE WAS IN A NICE SUIT-HE WOULD HAVE APPEARED TO HAVE HAD A HEART ATTACK. MY POINT IS----HELP OTHERS. STOP WALKING OVER PEOPLE.

Originally Posted by ivanabacowboy

apologies that my shift keys are broken on my laptop...

You have hit a lot of my points. It just sickened me. I am sick of people that have, not caring about the have nots. It pisses me off BIG TIME. And again, this happens everywhere.

[GirlinAZ]

Originally Posted by Boatdrinks

Great story! That young man sounds like a really kind hearted person.

I believe heavily in Karma. I never want to be homeless again. I will never forget what it was like. I will never forget not having food. I was raised with money. It can happen to anyone.

Originally Posted by azkylady2

Lucky for this man you were the one to pass by and not stumbilina or Bummer. Pay no mind to the few negatives here, you are the shineing star!

Those are the type of people that make me want to pack up and move elsewhere. They are always looking for the negative. My point was-1. don't walk over a sick man 2. think about others 3. the Scottsdale police and fire depts. are on top of things as crime is pretty low.
Everyone:
THINK ABOUT SOMEONE OTHER THAN YOURSELF. IT MAKES YOU FEEL GOOD ABOUT YOURSELF-AND IT HELPS OTHERS.

Originally Posted by kodiak14

After moving to Scottsdale from Peoria about 5 years ago, I've definitely endured the "holier/richer than thou" attitude here.

It is that attitude that angered me today. Every once in awhile I meet a nice person too. It just seems that the nice to not nice ratio is WAY OFF.

Originally Posted by AZ91

NanawaleJulie, too bad there isn't more people in the world like you.

We all can be whatever we want to be. By you saying such a thing makes me believe I am not alone. I am sure you would also have stopped to help this man. Spread the love.

Originally Posted by sierraAZ

Well, you don't wanna be homeless anywhere. And why are you surprised...? Isn't proof of insurance the first thing you're asked of in ER?! Vitals can wait... it's not that important.

True, but the arrogance of the rich makes me want to puke. I would definately agree with you on that one. You could be bleeding out of your eye sockets and they want their payment first. PATHETIC.

Originally Posted by TurcoLoco

I hope you were trying to be funny because that comment is just as unfair as Nana to generalize the entire Scottsdale people on the account of a few bypassers!

Where do I start with this one?
You are a heartless prick, as your use of the word "bum" rather than homeless or down on his luck. You do not have an ounce of empathy for others as your comment "his parasitic life" shows clearly. What disease is he going to give me by me passing a water to him? And calling for help? YOU ARE THE EXACT PROBLEM WITH THIS WORLD. Karma is something I have found to be very true. I would really worry if I were you, as you are due some really bad luck.

NOT EVERYONE IS THE SAME. NOT EVERYONE HAS THE SAME SKILLS/(DIS)ABILITIES. YOU CANNOT POSSIBLY LUMP EVERYONE INTO ONE CATEGORY. SOME PEOPLE ARE HIGHLY FUNCTIONING AND OTHERS ARE NOT. SOME PEOPLE ARE VERY SICK, YET LOOK HEALTHY. YOU CANNOT JUDGE A BOOK BY ITS COVER. PERHAPS PEOPLE THAT DO NOT HAVE EXPERIENCES THAT OTHERS DO, SHOULDN'T JUDGE. I CANNOT EVEN BELIEVE THAT I HAVE TO HAVE THIS CONVERSATION!! IF SOMEONE IS HURT-YOU DON'T WALK OVER THEM-NO MATTER WHO THEY ARE!! JESUS!

[GirlinAZ]

Originally Posted by Bill-

I'd hardly consider this a "Scottsdale" specific issue.

I never said this ONLY happened here.
I am also from Chicago.
The fact that most people do what you do-is exactly the problem.
If they have "substance abuse" or "psychiatric" problems-why wouldn't we help? Why shouldn't we help? If no one ever gives a hand out-and someone is truely disabled mentally (which I would put money on the fact that many of them are) are we just to have corpses to walk over? We are not a third world nation. We are the wealthiest country on earth. We have a duty to take care of our own.
As mentioned previously, we are all one major illness/injury away from financial ruin.
I will never give up on people. I will never walk over another human being to get my latte a bit quicker.
You all make me feel very sad for the state of things in this country.

Originally Posted by TurcoLoco

Say what you will but do not hate me for bringing a realistic perspective on the issue!

I didn't say he had a beer in his hands. It was on the ground. He was out cold. He could have suffered from heat stroke, a heart attack, an anurism, who knows? The point is you do not walk over another human being laying on the ground. You call for help.
Oh, and guess what? The homeless man without the legs that I helped out-he was given a big wad of money that he collected over several days. (mostly small bills) Want to know what he did with that money? He rented a hotel room for the night so that he could take a shower!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! He was out in 115 degree weather for the whole summer and only wanted to wash himself. You are jumping to conclusions. Perhaps that person had food stamps already and just needed a damn shower! People with mental illness often act angry and not normal. None of this shocks me. If you are telling me that I should have walked over this man, and not done anything-you need to take a good, long look in the mirror. Something is VERY wrong with you.

Originally Posted by passnthru

Good thing you were getting gas in Scottsdale and not 7th st and Roosevelt. Would have depleted three quarters of the Phoenix fire & police departments.

My point is that we don't have to behave this way. No one should walk over a stranger passed out cold on the street.

[ivanabacowboy]

i have never been homeless. and hope i never am. but just for the sake of bringing out what i think is important----pretend there was some catastropic event in your life. you were a very successful, well off individual. good paying job, nice house, a jaguar and bmw in the garage etc. you had entirely exhausted all of your savings, all of your stock options, your entire investment portfolio, cashed out your retirement savings, are months behind on your mortgage on the 7000 square foot palace you call home. you were at rock bottom. you have $3 in your pocket and whatever you can carry with you the day the lender evicts you from your foreclosed home and the repo guy carted off the jaguar and bmw and the irs attached your bank accounts. you have no family or friends who are in a position or willing to help you.

what would you do? some will say "dont be a bum go get a job". what if you couldnt? maybe employers werent hiring. and how would you get to those job interviews-you only have $3 in your pocket and the same clothes you have been wearing for 2 days. if you spend the money on bus fare to get to the interview, maybe stop in the gas station washroom to tidy up and hope even the minimum wage job comes through-->what will you eat that evening or until you get your first paycheck? where will you sleep?

so you being an upstanding citizen just down on your luck and a believer in individualism tell yourself "ok i can go hungry for a few days. i am in fairly good health. most people could live for nearly a month without food-i can handle a few days. i will pay the bus fare to get to the interview and just really impress them. i know i will get the job. it will get better."

so you ace the interview and get the job. but you spent your money on bus fare. how will you get to work to be able to get a paycheck?

you go the government route. SURELY they have programs that help people like me with all those taxes i avoided by taking a gazillion dollars in business write-offs. but you need more bus fare to get to the building where you have to apply for the assistance. (your wifi enabled laptop is gone so you cant do it online. your blackberry is shut off so you cant do it over the phone.) you decide to walk the x miles in 105' heat. you finally get there, tired, thirsty, nearly dehydrated. you are in a line of 100000s of other people. you wait. and wait. "ok we will help you and you will get a check and food assistance card in 7 days." you are elated! all you have to do is survive 7 days on the street and you are on your way back up! the clerk even tells you there is a shelter right near your job where you can stay for the 7 days, and they will feed you, and you can shower. "whew! so glad i solved this. just 7 days and it will be better."

on the way to work the first day, you trip and break your arm. you have no health insurance. you have no way to get to a public hospital. how can you work with a broken arm? so you call 911. you get to the hospital, get your arm set. but you have no way back to the shelter other than walking.

the next day you tell your boss about the accident. they fire you. you have no job. you only have a few more days left in the shelter.

you are disheartened. the shelter tosses you to make room for others. you have no job. you are hungry and the walk to any type of free kitchen is miles in the heat. days go by. you are hungry. dirty. and in arizona HOT. you are beginning to crack from the stress. you see no hope. its been days. the check you received from the public assistance was not enough money to get even a room for yourself. you received your food card benefit-but where do you cook the food since your subzero refrigerator and viking range are all in the foreclosed house you no longer own? if you have no room? and whatever food you buy you have to carry since you have no room. and it is over 110' today. you walk into the grocery with your few assistance dollars and see the nice cold 12 pack. "yeah maybe i will just have a few beers. just like when we had those parties out on the patio while relaxing in our outdoor kitchen and swimming by the pool and talking about our investment portfolios and what the fed will do to solve the economy for all those poor people that we looked down on. that will relax me." it will be an oasis of your previous life.

the next morning....nanawalejulie stops at the gas station at shea/scottsdale and sees YOU passed out on the sidewalk..........