Phoenix PD arrest pastor "swat style" for bible study. (how much, house)

[jimj]

I was kind of shocked (but not surprised) to see the news story of the Phoenix pastor who's house was raided by a rather large team of officers evidently for holding a bible study class allegedly without proper zoning. What kind of police state are we living in?
He's gotten 60 days in jail and a $12,000 fine for doing so.
Kind of outrageous I think, given everything else going on around here.
Here's an excerpt:

City officials state that Salman violated city code ordinances when he allowed approximately 20 people to enter his home to study the Bible. In addition to a 60-day jail sentence, Salman received a fine of $12,180 and three years probation. The city states that his Bible study was the equivalent of a church that they weren’t zoned for.

On July 11, 2012, Fox and Friends asked whether the punishment for a Pastor who was arrested for holding a Bible study in his home fit the crime. Response has been vast and the story of Michael Salman, who faces a jail sentence of 60 days following a Phoenix, Arizona arrest for hosting the home Bible group.
Social media ablaze after Arizona pastor arrested for home Bible study - National General Religion | Examiner.com

[Rick Lee]

Why do people mention Bible study in conjunction with this story? What he's doing in the unzoned bldg. has nothing to do with the charges. It's a zoning law issue, not a religious freedom issue. I know a cop who was holding CCW classes in his house and had about 20 people in each one. I don't know if he still does it, but the first thing I thought when I went to mine was that the neighbors must really get tired of all these strangers' cars always parked in front of his house. I wonder how much sympathy he'd have gotten, were he to face the same fate as this pastor.

[observer53]

It's hardly a Bible study. He sought and got approval to call it a "church" to avoid paying property taxes, and then refuses to comply with the safety requirements for a church or similar building used by the public. He can't have it both ways.

http://www.azcentral.com/community/p...g-dispute.html

[jimj]

Originally Posted by Rick Lee

Why do people mention Bible study in conjunction with this story? What he's doing in the unzoned bldg. has nothing to do with the charges. It's a zoning law issue, not a religious freedom issue. I know a cop who was holding CCW classes in his house and had about 20 people in each one. I don't know if he still does it, but the first thing I thought when I went to mine was that the neighbors must really get tired of all these strangers' card always parked in front of his house. I wonder how much sympathy he'd have gotten, were he to face the same fate as this pastor.

First off the story that was aired yesterday with the pastor's wife referenced bible study. Second, I agree if the people attending constantly parked on the street but they didn't, they were all parked on the pastors property unlike many of their neighbors (they stated) who have regular parties of one sort or another.

I'm not arguing if he broke some law as we're not privy to all the info, he probably did given all the laws on the books here. What I am concerned,interested,surprised about is how they went about it and the sentence. A bit heavy handed maybe?

As for religious freedom, a good question was raised by a friend of mine yesterday and that was "do you think they would've handled it the same way if it were a Mosque?"
Unfortunately I have to say given the current climate probably not.

On edit:
After digging into the story from several different sources it was reported the pastor has a history of gun violence. If that is truly the case I can understand the police response. I think there's two sides to this and while the city has put "their" version out there I'd bet there's way more to it than that. I still hold the opinion that the penalty is rather heavy handed.
It'll be interesting to see what the defense digs up with relation to other places around the area and how they were/are treated.

[Sco]

I can guarantee one thing, if the religion angle wasn't a factor it would not have taken the police 5 years to get around to arresting someone that had been openly violating the law and essentially thumbing their nose at the entire notion of any type of governmental authority.

The "pastor" has gotten away with his violations for years, no way a non-religious oriented business venture in a residential neighborhood would get that same type of treatment.

This case is perfect for bringing out the persecution complex in some Christians though.

[goolsbyjazz]

Initially, as a believer in Christ, it may look like persecution. However, a closer look at the facts reveal it to be a zoning issue clouded by the religious aspect. Have read conflicting reports on the matter (the pastor allegedly had a history of gun violence, the 4.6-acre property wasn't zoned for a "church", etc.,) and still am not sure what to make of it all. The penalty seems a little stiff, in my opinion, though. The real question is why would the city spend the time and resources to go after this one individual when there are so many other, more pressing, issues facing the city?

[Vinny536]

If the story was a Koran study we would be calling it a terrorist cell.

We have zoning rules to be sure that the structure is safe for the occupants and the surrounding neighbors. If there was some sort of emergency inside the building people could be killed trying to evacuate. The sanitation facilities may not be able to handle the waste and many other issues can occur in a building that is not built to handle the occupancy load.

[_Charles_]

I can guarantee one thing, if the religion angle wasn't a factor it would not have taken the police 5 years to get around to arresting someone that had been openly violating the law and essentially thumbing their nose at the entire notion of any type of governmental authority.

Yes that's correct. Phoenix police are selective in their responsiveness.

[ibarrio]

Originally Posted by observer53

It's hardly a Bible study. He sought and got approval to call it a "church" to avoid paying property taxes, and then refuses to comply with the safety requirements for a church or similar building used by the public. He can't have it both ways.

Phoenix preacher jailed in zoning dispute

that makes more sense. there is always a part of the story we don't hear. sounds like the guy is missing a few screws.

[43north87west]

I'm sorry, but this is a crock of garbage. This (ex-con) pastor has been basically taunting the city and neighbors since 2008, with his plans to build a church on his property that is zoned as residential.

He didn't acquire proper zoning, IIRC. He did build a church. He did not build it to code. He holds services in his church which he can't do because it's not zoned and it's not up to code. Now he is playing victim of religious persecution. Why is this hard for people to figure out?