What are some ways Phoenix could develop to stand out from the crowd? (real estate, rent)
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Phoenix already stands out from the crowd on weather.
What other city can be this beautiful in February without having to be wrapped up like a mummy and dealing with freezing rain, snow, wind, and bitter cold?
Well I take this some of this back because California cities can be this nice in the winter if there aren't floods, mudslides, fires, or earthquakes getting in the way.
One way Phoenix could stand out from the crowd and not copy LA so much is have things more centralized. As it is now everything is scattered about and requires so much driving.
There's a lot of talk about what kind of things are needed to be built in Phoenix to make it a world class city.
That's definitely a concern sure, but I think what everyone is missing is the stigma and how Arizona in general appears to the rest of the country. Arizona is a known conservative stronghold and most people associate that with old, Christian, gun-loving right-wingers who wants to keep the status quo and reject change. That is NOT the image you want to project if you want to increase any sort of interest in the state besides financial ones (like low COL). It makes the state look very stubborn from the outside and people won't be interested to move here nor will the investment come to invest money into the state.
All of the major cities talked about in this thread are not known to be this way. They're known to have a huge diversity of culture that's open and willing to adopt changes to make society better for everyone. If you pit this up against the image of Arizona? Hell why would anyone want to come here? If anyone wants to come here, it's definitely not because "omg PHX is awesome!".
When I last visited Phoenix, I really liked all the canals and Tempe Town Lake. Imagine if Phoenix built lots and lots of new canals lacing through the city and lined them with vibrant retail and new buildings and parks. It could be like the San Antonio riverwalk, but on a citywide scale. There could be water busses and waterside dining and it would all be very nice.
When I last visited Phoenix, I really liked all the canals and Tempe Town Lake. Imagine if Phoenix built lots and lots of new canals lacing through the city and lined them with vibrant retail and new buildings and parks. It could be like the San Antonio riverwalk, but on a citywide scale. There could be water busses and waterside dining and it would all be very nice.
If we had the water supplies to do that it would be pretty cool. Although I agree that some of the urban canals should've been accentuated instead of hidden. Scottsdale had the right idea with the waterfront.
There's a lot of talk about what kind of things are needed to be built in Phoenix to make it a world class city.
That's definitely a concern sure, but I think what everyone is missing is the stigma and how Arizona in general appears to the rest of the country. Arizona is a known conservative stronghold and most people associate that with old, Christian, gun-loving right-wingers who wants to keep the status quo and reject change. That is NOT the image you want to project if you want to increase any sort of interest in the state besides financial ones (like low COL). It makes the state look very stubborn from the outside and people won't be interested to move here nor will the investment come to invest money into the state.
You couldn't be more wrong. While AZ leans conservative, it's definitely not the Bible Belt, and most people are aware of this. And besides, don't you think Phoenix is big enough to stand on its own? With your reasoning, Atlanta should be suffering from the stigma of being located in the Bible Belt, and in a state that's even redder than AZ ... however, Atlanta is home to 16 Fortune 500 companies, and their airport has the most passenger traffic in the world! Our lack of national/global HQs has nothing to do with outsiders seeing AZ as too conservative. It has to do with the fact that the Phoenix area still focuses too much on things like snowbirds, retirees, mountain views, and sunny weather as economic indicators.
Quote:
Originally Posted by man4857
All of the major cities talked about in this thread are not known to be this way. They're known to have a huge diversity of culture that's open and willing to adopt changes to make society better for everyone. If you pit this up against the image of Arizona? Hell why would anyone want to come here? If anyone wants to come here, it's definitely not because "omg PHX is awesome!".
So what are we going to do to make Phoenix an awesome city: keep whining about what Phoenix lacks while being opposed to things like skyscrapers, theme parks, etc.? Talk is cheap, and NIMBYism has definitely caused Phoenix to fall behind on quite a few things. As far as diversity, I think Phoenix is pretty diverse as it is. Maybe it's not as much as NYC or San Francisco, but it's more so than what it used to be.
Quote:
Originally Posted by JGMotorsport64
If we had the water supplies to do that it would be pretty cool. Although I agree that some of the urban canals should've been accentuated instead of hidden. Scottsdale had the right idea with the waterfront.
We already do have the supplies. Enhancing the canals wouldn't put any strain on the water supply. It's something that I think Phoenix should have capitalized on long ago. As it stands now, many of the areas where the canals are tend to be junky and unattractive. The city should encourage private development along the canals, or even do a public/private type of beautifying project to make the canal areas more appealing. They could even be something like San Antonio's River Walk if enough interest and effort was put into it.
On one hand you want Phoenix to strive to be like Los Angeles but on the other hand you're against Phoenix shunning the southwestern culture to be like California?
Pardon my confusion but this reads like double talk.
I thought it was pretty clear that I was talking about PHX striving to be like LA (economically speaking). I mean, if you couldn't gather that from my post then I don't know what to say.
You couldn't be more wrong. While AZ leans conservative, it's definitely not the Bible Belt, and most people are aware of this. And besides, don't you think Phoenix is big enough to stand on its own? With your reasoning, Atlanta should be suffering from the stigma of being located in the Bible Belt, and in a state that's even redder than AZ ... however, Atlanta is home to 16 Fortune 500 companies, and their airport has the most passenger traffic in the world! Our lack of national/global HQs has nothing to do with outsiders seeing AZ as too conservative. It has to do with the fact that the Phoenix area still focuses too much on things like snowbirds, retirees, mountain views, and sunny weather as economic indicators.
So what are we going to do to make Phoenix an awesome city: keep whining about what Phoenix lacks while being opposed to things like skyscrapers, theme parks, etc.? Talk is cheap, and NIMBYism has definitely caused Phoenix to fall behind on quite a few things. As far as diversity, I think Phoenix is pretty diverse as it is. Maybe it's not as much as NYC or San Francisco, but it's more so than what it used to be.
You're missing the point I was trying to make. It's the cultural image you're trying to project by being conservative. Being conservative by definition is all about preserving the status quo and resisting change. I don't really care about how many HQs or how many people walk through airports. It won't matter until you change the fundamental culture of a state/city is when you get people and companies interested. WE as a state need to make Arizona different, appear different, and make it desirable culturally to live in and make people look beyond the dollar amount we can sell you a house for and that involves thinking outside the box (i.e dare I say it, be a liberal for once), and if we need to flip the system of government we have upside down to accomplish this, then so be it, but you have to be willing to do it is the key. In addition, if you think Phoenix is "diverse" but even consider "maybe" it not as much as NYC or San Francisco, I seriously question if you've visited those cities before and went to all of the major neighborhoods. Phoenix is no where near as diverse as those 2 cities culturally and demographically as well as historically.
If it was all economic reasons, why do companies continue to set up shop instead of leave for example California especially Silicon Valley? It's jammed, highways are a mess and falling apart, taxes are high, tons of regulations, COL is through the roof but they still set up shop there when they can easily come here or any other state. We'd see a massive migration pattern but very rarely do we see that. You'll get the one or two once in a while that'll leave but the majority will stay. Why do you think this is? Why do you also think so many people want to move to California even though it's so expensive as shown by the demand of housing? Demand is through the roof for everything in California and it has never showed any signs of slowing down. Do you think it's the money that keeps people from going where they find some place desirable? It's the culture of the state, being willing to give the middle finger to the status quo if things change is the difference.
You couldn't be more wrong. While AZ leans conservative, it's definitely not the Bible Belt, and most people are aware of this. And besides, don't you think Phoenix is big enough to stand on its own? With your reasoning, Atlanta should be suffering from the stigma of being located in the Bible Belt, and in a state that's even redder than AZ ... however, Atlanta is home to 16 Fortune 500 companies, and their airport has the most passenger traffic in the world! Our lack of national/global HQs has nothing to do with outsiders seeing AZ as too conservative. It has to do with the fact that the Phoenix area still focuses too much on things like snowbirds, retirees, mountain views, and sunny weather as economic indicators.
I think Arapaio hurt Phoenix's reputation as well, and very much so. To the point that some people are simply afraid to travel there, lest they get snatched off the street KGB-style and thrown into Tent City (with pink underwear and green bologna), for something petty like jaywalking. Or more banally, he made Phoenix looks like an unenjoyable place, where anything beyond the straight and narrow is a serious crime.
For a point of contrast, think of New Orleans or Tampa. Both of those cities are in red states, with strict laws on petty crime, and yet, both are viewed as fun destinations.
ASU and U of A have very good programs in selective fields. For example U of A has one of the best IT programs in the country. U of A's IT program ranks consistently in the top 3 or so through our business school. But even if we did there's nothing to keep those graduates here, they would just take that talent elsewhere.
I'm not so sure this is true. Outside of AZ, no one really talks about U of A or ASU. In the Bay Area, people look at Stanford, CMU, MIT, Berkeley, and then other CA schools. Even SJSU and the CSU schools are regarded more highly than U of A and ASU and I say this to you as a graduate who was lucky to find a job in the SV. A friend of mine was at an IT job fair in SF recently and everyone else there had gone to a superior school from what he could tell looking at others' resumes.. He's an ASU graduate with a PhD. He didn't get any call-backs.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MillennialUrbanist
I think Arapaio hurt Phoenix's reputation as well, and very much so. To the point that some people are simply afraid to travel there, lest they get snatched off the street KGB-style and thrown into Tent City (with pink underwear and green bologna), for something petty like jaywalking. Or more banally, he made Phoenix looks like an unenjoyable place, where anything beyond the straight and narrow is a serious crime.
For a point of contrast, think of New Orleans or Tampa. Both of those cities are in red states, with strict laws on petty crime, and yet, both are viewed as fun destinations.
Good point. Whenever I talk up Phoenix, the first question people ask is "but isn't Arizona conservative?" It seems many people are bothered by AZ's political reputation much more so than other red states.
I'm not so sure this is true. Outside of AZ, no one really talks about U of A or ASU. In the Bay Area, people look at Stanford, CMU, MIT, Berkeley, and then other CA schools. Even SJSU and the CSU schools are regarded more highly than U of A and ASU and I say this to you as a graduate who was lucky to find a job in the SV. A friend of mine was at an IT job fair in SF recently and everyone else there had gone to a superior school from what he could tell looking at others' resumes.. He's an ASU graduate with a PhD. He didn't get any call-backs.
Good point. Whenever I talk up Phoenix, the first question people ask is "but isn't Arizona conservative?" It seems many people are bothered by AZ's political reputation much more so than other red states.
That sort of regional bias is true in all metro regions. Do you think anyone outside of the Bay Area talks about San Jose State? (As an aside, maybe times have changed but traditionally it hasn't had much of a reputation at all, including in the Bay Area.)
You get familiar with what's nearby and where you're seeing graduates come from. Yes, a few schools have nationwide cachet but most schools all blend together or get easily forgotten. Do you think someone in Arizona has any real knowledge of whether Iowa or Iowa State is better? Do you imagine that someone in Alabama could tell you which SUNY school is better? It's true all over the country.
If you don't have much occasion to see those resumes or interact with people from those schools, you're not going to have much of an opinion.
Is this a disadvantage to someone from ASU applying for jobs in the south bay? Sure. Just like it'd be a disadvantage for someone to come down here with a degree from a regional California school and expect it to be fairly valued. People know what they know and regional bias is a real thing.
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