Phoenix experiencing one of nations biggest reductions in crime...

[twiggy]

Originally Posted by Rick Lee

So why then are you alarmed by a 20 yr. old report that shows the number people killed by "accidental" gun fire, when (no one had cell phones in1988) that number was around 2-3% of the number of folks killed in car accidents each year? 1500 people, while a tragedy, is still a very tiny number compared to the number of lives saved by guns. In fact, it's a tiny number compared to many other types of totally preventable, accidental deaths. I have several times as many guns as I have cars. Does that increase my chances of getting hurt? Why have I never come close to getting hurt with a gun, but have with a car more than once? I'm not that old either. Seems to me, the gun haters' attention would be better focused on things more likely to hurt people. Behavior, not inanimate objects, is what gets people hurt.

Well, I put the last 20 years until recent on there so I could show it's been a long standing problem of the "gun owning" community.
One they don't admit and don't seem to be working on that successfully.

And hey, open up a car accident thread and I will be glad to post on this as well. Totally agree. We should all ride horses.

There are accidental deaths everyday, from falling off a roof to gagging on a raisin but this is about guns.

It just seems to me gun owners are a little paranoid about people attacking them and always having to be ready to defend themselves and their families. I think this is a little ridiculous but it's just my personal opinion and I am paranoid about other things like scorpions so "live and let live". But, don't deny that people get accidentally shot by guns that are legally owned. They do, every year.

[Rick Lee]

Originally Posted by twiggy

Bummer. I guess the same stupid people who don't use the pin wouldn't use the rubber bullets either. Oh well.

Do you have any idea what these snap caps or "safe bullets" are? If you use them, you might as well keep the gun unloaded or use a trigger lock. They make the gun useless as a means of self-defense. That's fine for responsible folks with kids in the house, if those folks don't mind turning a self-defense gun into a paperweight. But folks who keep a chambered gun within reach of kids are already irresponsible and will not use any such safety device. So I really don't see why these devices are touted as some kind of panacea for accidental gunfire. Lots of other, far more common types of accidents are more easily preventable. But the main issue is one of personal responsibilty and that's not something anyone can legislate or invent something to make it universal.

FWIW, I don't have any kids and none ever visit my house. So my guns don't need to be childproofed. I keep one in the car, one in the night stand and a shotgun by the bed. They are all ready to go, since I don't want to have to fiddle with removing a snap cap or worry about my hands being too sweaty from fear to be able to rack the slide back if someone break into my house while I'm home.

Also, when I was growing up, my dad kept 1911 in the nightstand, but the magazine was hidden. I think I was probably 10 yrs. old before I was strong enough to rack the slide back on that gun. But by then I was an expert in gun safety and would never have even thought of touching a gun with my dad's permission and supervision. You can't legislate or invent that kind of parenting.

[twiggy]

One thing I am curious about is how many gun owners protect people with their guns.
Does anyone have that info?

I know my brothers just uses his to hunt, the other one used his riffle to blow a hole in his head, up in the woods of Oregon after his girlfriend left him. Needless to say, he is no longer hear to comment. I'm sure he would of found any method for this although this one worked very well.

I don't remember any real protection from them, although they commented on it like I hear on here but never really saw it in action. One was accidentally shot and one used it for suicide. But, neither for any real protection. I just wonder if the numbers match up, how many save lives with their guns compared to how many guns they own are involved in accidental deaths. I would like to see a comparison.

[Rick Lee]

You can read newspaper clips of various defensive uses of guns every month in any of the NRA's magazines. Don't attack the credibility just because it's the NRA. They don't comment on them, they just reprint the news clips from local newspapers. Most defensive use of guns cannot be put into statistics, because most such case are not reported to police. However, here in Phoenix there have been several justified shoots by homeowners in the six mos. I've lived here. The ones you hear about are the ones that get reported to police. Since I carry openly a lot, it would take an extra stupid criminal to bother with me. There are a lot more easier victims out there than me, so I can't say if any have been deterred. I know for sure that cops don't prevent home invasions once they're in progress. Cops show up later to clean up the bodies and take the report. In those cases, I don't know what else besides a gun would save your life. The criminal surely isn't gonna wait for you to call 911 and then for the 20-30 min. police response time.

I keep fire extinguishers all throughout my house, but I can't say they have prevented any fires. I just know that they'll likely prevent a small fire from becoming a big fire if I see it in time. It's better to have it and not need it than need it and not have it.