If Phoenix is that hot, why do so many move there? (Scottsdale: best city, trains)

[BIG CATS]

Originally Posted by locolife

A suburban feel, sure. A small town feel? No way.

I never said PHX feels like a "small town". I said it feels more suburban than all the other big cities in the nation. Glad you agree.

[observer53]

Originally Posted by BIG CATS

I never said PHX feels like a "small town". I said it feels more suburban than all the other big cities in the nation. Glad you agree.

Many years ago, in a story about the Don Bolles murder, 60 Minutes referred to Phoenix as the "world's biggest small town".


That was an accurate characterization for many reasons then, and there's still a lot of truth to it, including for the reason you state.

[sexxxcblac]

Originally Posted by locolife

Yup, I worked in both Chicago and New York and I've been to LA hundreds of times. I wouldn't live in any of them but Phoenix has plenty of big city problems, this is not a place to go to escape that issue. Being smaller it doesn't have the problems to the extent of the 3 largest cities in the country that you chose to rattle off but we've got traffic, we've got crime, we've got gangs, we've got graffiti, all that fun stuff...

I've never met anyone who wanted a smaller city feel come to Phoenix and say, "yeah, this feels like a small city to me." It's usually quite the opposite, most of the clients and visitors we bring to town are surprised how big it is and how little of it they can see in just a few days.

I totally agree with this post .
I've lived in NYC, LA and Chicago and Phoenix feels every bit a large metropolis.
To call this place a small town is simply reckless.
But if feels great to be mentioned with the likes of the Big 3
Congratulations Valley !
When I would post stating how influential Phoenix Metro has become , my credibility and everything else was called into question. Isn't if funny more and more threads involving Phoenix in the conversation the Big 3 pops up there as well too.

[azriverfan.]

Originally Posted by sexxxcblac

I totally agree with this post .
I've lived in NYC, LA and Chicago and Phoenix feels every bit a large metropolis.
To call this place a small town is simply reckless.
But if feels great to be mentioned with the likes of the Big 3
Congratulations Valley !
When I would post stating how influential Phoenix Metro has become , my credibility and everything else was called into question. Isn't if funny more and more threads involving Phoenix in the conversation the Big 3 pops up there as well too.

It comes down to sky scrapers. Some only associated a big city with that. So that being said, the development of downtown will cause many to feel like we are a big city. Downtown Phoenix is so much more developed than it was even 5 years ago. In 5 years, it will be even bigger

[locolife]

Originally Posted by azriverfan.

It comes down to sky scrapers. Some only associated a big city with that. So that being said, the development of downtown will cause many to feel like we are a big city. Downtown Phoenix is so much more developed than it was even 5 years ago. In 5 years, it will be even bigger

100% true, but it's a silly argument in my opinion. I like the fact that in Phoenix there are several urban centers and were not all clustering to the same couple of cross-streets to hangout, work and live. All this does is cause ridiculous crowds, insane prices, long waits for everything, astronomical parking, jam packed subways.... if that's what you need to be a "big city" then I'll take a pass.

What I do love about Phoenix is that we are developing nice walkable areas where prices are still fairly reasonable, arts scenes are solid, there's a ton of entertainment, lots of unique dining options and it's continually evolving and growing.

I like skyscrapers but there's a lot of financial reasons why they don't always make sense, I'm sure if/when the time is right we'll get them but as places like Portland and Washington DC show, skyscrapers have little to do with making a city vibrant.

[locolife]

Originally Posted by sexxxcblac

I totally agree with this post .
I've lived in NYC, LA and Chicago and Phoenix feels every bit a large metropolis.
To call this place a small town is simply reckless.
But if feels great to be mentioned with the likes of the Big 3
Congratulations Valley !
When I would post stating how influential Phoenix Metro has become , my credibility and everything else was called into question. Isn't if funny more and more threads involving Phoenix in the conversation the Big 3 pops up there as well too.

We're moving on up... now if our local sports teams could just get with the program that would be the icing on the cake!

[Java Jolt]

Originally Posted by locolife

We're moving on up... now if our local sports teams could just get with the program that would be the icing on the cake!

Well-stated.

I have always bragged about Phoenix having all four professional sports franchises but I think it would be more meaningful if those teams could produce better results and win some championships.

[locolife]

[quote=BIG CATS;46575688]PHX is hardly "big" feeling/quote]

UHHH, if it's not big feeling then what is it? Small? Medium??

[locolife]

Originally Posted by observer53

Many years ago, in a story about the Don Bolles murder, 60 Minutes referred to Phoenix as the "world's biggest small town".


That was an accurate characterization for many reasons then, and there's still a lot of truth to it, including for the reason you state.

But why is Phoenix a small town?

1. Is it the existence of 4 pro sports teams, NASCAR stops, hosting multiple super bowls, the final 4, our regular big concerts, major performing arts centers?
2. Is it the existence of 16 fortune 1,000 companies within the metro region?
3. Perhaps having the 10th busiest airport in the US makes us a small town?
4. Is the exploding residential boom in downtown Phoenix and Tempe? That's a small town thing right?
5. Is it our 2.2M person labor force? That sounds small right?
6. Is it our $220B metro GDP, ranking above the likes of Denver, Pittsburgh, and San Jose?
7. Maybe it's being the 13th largest media market that does it?
8. Is it the 10,000 or so residential units under construction in downtown and central Phoenix?
9. Perhaps it's the presence of the largest university in the nation?
10. Is it our museums and cultural attractions that make us a small town? The Heard, Desert Botanical Garden(the world's largest collection of desert plants), Taliesin West, the Phoenix Art Museum (the Southwest's largest art museum), the Fleischer Museum, the Science Center, the Hall of Flame (featuring the world's largest collection of fire-fighting equipment), Pueblo Grande, SMOCA, MIM??

The old argument that Phoenix is a small town has gotten pretty tired. It's well past time to retire it and Reno loves the saying so much they even built signage proclaiming it's theirs, so lets let them own it huh? Plus it takes all but 5 minutes to realize there is nothing about the amount of opportunity, both economically and among personal interests, that is small about the Phoenix area.

People making this argument usually mean that Phoenix doesn't look like traditional cities, "wait a minute, where's the giant skyline like New York, Chicago, Boston, etc.????" We grew up different here, you left those places because you didn't like it. Try it out!

There's a lot of reasons why we grew how we did and there's some great perks to it, one being that horrendous traffic jams normally associated with a 5 million person region don't really exist here! I'm delighted not to spend 61 hours a year stuck in traffic jams like people do in Chicago, how about you?

But alas, it's easier to judge things based on what you've known, instead of taking the time to view things from a different perspective. Some people get it, others never will.

[ScottsdaleMark]

AZriverfan is correct. I honestly do believe it's the lack of skyscrapers and that dense, tall, urban core. A lot of people just can't get past that no matter how many millions more people flock to the Valley. It's a myopic viewpoint but I am convinced it's a common one.

When a lot of people think of a "city" they seem to think of "the downtown core of a city" ... when they think of Chicago they don't think of the many millions of people living in low-density, endlessly sprawling, freeway-traffic-choked suburbs, they think of the Loop and the lakefront and all the historic museums and the epic skyline. The reality that the Chicago metro as a whole is tremendously sprawling and in many ways more far-flung that Phoenix's suburbs and exurbs is irrelevant to them.

Similarly, most New York metro residents don't live in Manhattan but that seems to be what everyone thinks of, not the lower-rise homes and apartment blocks in Queens, the Bronx, or especially Staten Island or Long Island.

It's all about perception I guess...what can you put on a postcard and what do tourists do or see on a weekend visit?

Our postcard has a cactus or Camelback Mountain, not a famous skyscraper skyline, so for a lot of people that's as far as they choose to contemplate our reality.