considering buying in a fringe area in East End- is it safe? (Pittsburgh: for sale, crime rates)

[SteveinRaleigh]

In talking with a Pittsburgh friend about my upcoming relocation back to Regent Square, he suggested I look on the edges of Regent Square where I could purchase a home for a lot less $ than in the heart of the Square. It would be great to find a 3BR house for under 100K.

Ideally I want to be able to walk to Braddock Ave and Frick park within 10 minutes.

Our kids are grown so schools are not an issue. My primary concern is safety. I want to be able to walk the dog after dark and more specifically, want my wife to be able to do so.

Area to consider:

1. The area bordered by Penn Ave, Braddock Ave, Forbes Avenue and the East busway (sort of behind the McDonalds on Penn).

2. The streets around Hay/Biddle.

3. The streets at the other end of Wilkinsburg up near WTAE and Ardmore Blvd. He said there were 2 decent homes for sale on Shelbourne for under 50K. These prices are really appealing, but the distance to walk to Frick is pretty far.

4.What about Meade Street and the Point Breeeze streets just on the other side of Penn getting closer to Homewood?


I did some searches for Wilkinsburg houses under 50K and there were a lot on the other side of Pennwood and the busway. Is is safe there now? When I left the Burg in 2006, I avoided those areas after dark.


Any thoughts or recommendations?

[squarian]

First of all, a caveat: Many of the areas you're asking about are in, or include parts of, the Borough of Wilkinsburg. Wilkinsburg has a bad reputation in the area, and many people on City Data and elsewhere in the region will give you opinions based on an impression derived from central Wilkinsburg, the borough as it was 20 or more years ago, and/or how it appears in the local news, rather than actual knowledge. Mostly these opinions are worthless. Almost uniformly, anyone who actually lives in Wilkinsburg now (as I do) will have a different opinion.

Second caveat: Realty people like to describe every area you've mentioned (and then some) as "Regent Square" - this is balderdash simply designed to pique interest and inflate prices.

Here's a map of Wilkinsburg neighborhoods for reference: http://i53.tinypic.com/344v0oy.jpg

Originally Posted by steveinfl

1. The area bordered by Penn Ave, Braddock Ave, Forbes Avenue and the East busway (sort of behind the McDonalds on Penn).

You're describing Park Place - google the "Greater Park Place Neighborhood Association" and find the archives for their newsletter to get a sense for the neighborhood. Look up my past posts here, and search "Park Place", for helpful discussion - there have been several threads recently.

Short version: it's an up-and-coming area, there is some crime overflow from adjacent neighborhoods (central Wilkinsburg, Homewood), but mostly property rather than violent. Good value, likely to increase, but be aware of where the Wilkinsbg-Pgh border lies, especially if public schools matter to you.

2. The streets around Hay/Biddle.

Known as the Whitney Park neighborhood. Almost anything true of Park Place is also true of Whitney Park, especially regarding crime: i.e. minimal but present, particularly property crime, theft, etc. Main differences from Park Place:

1) unlike PP, which is divided between City of Pgh and Borough of Wilkinsburg, WP is entirely within Wilkinsbg. Therefore: a) public schools are appalling; b) wage tax is lower than Pgh; c) property tax is higher.

2) unlike PP, which has a main thoroughfare (S. Braddock Ave), WP has very little traffic.

3. The streets at the other end of Wilkinsburg up near WTAE and Ardmore Blvd.

Beacon Hill & Blackridge neighborhoods. I'm not as well-informed about the east end of Wilkinsbg, but in many respects it resembles the adjacent boroughs of Forest Hills, Churchill, etc. Nice houses, crime rates similar to Rgt Sq, Park Place, Whitney Park - i.e. exists but is mostly property, rarely violent. I'll leave it at that, since better-informed people are sure to give you the details.

4.What about Meade Street and the Point Breeeze streets just on the other side of Penn getting closer to Homewood?

Again, I'll have to pass - but in my opinion, that area is much more "fringe" or marginal than the others you've listed.

the other side of Pennwood and the busway. Is is safe there now? When I left the Burg in 2006, I avoided those areas after dark.

Hamnett Place is the beneficiary of some serious development, and IMO is likely to improve greatly in the next 5-10 years, but it's still distinctly marginal. It's worth considering, depending on your tolerance, but I'd regard it as "urban pioneer" territory, while Whitney Park & Park Place are not really the frontier now. I personally would pass on every other area between the MLK busway and Beacon Hill.

[Uptown kid]

I don't know North Point Breeze (NBP) that well, but I do know people who live there. Similar to parts of Wilkinsburg or Sugtop (Upper Hill) NPB's crime is mainly commited by thugs from fough near by neighborhoods. While NBP's is Homewood, the worst possible near by hood! Yet over all its as safe as the other areas OP mentioned.

[Craziaskowboi]

No, the East End is not safe. That's where they test the atomic bombs.

[stburr91]

I think the best bang for the buck if you want to be close to "The Square" is the Whitney Park neighborhood. Barnes and Hampton streets have some very nice homes that are going for very reasonable prices (compared to Regent Square). With many people being priced out of Regent Square, it's a safe bet that the prices of the nicer homes in Whitney Park are going to start to really climb soon, so now would be a great time to buy there.

The Park Place/Peebles Square area could come back and be pretty nice, but still has a way to go yet.

Hamnett Place is still very rough, and you'd have to be willing to take quite a bit of risk, but could also see the biggest turnaround.


Whitney Park = Almost a sure bet to see real increases in home values.

Park Place/Peebles Square = Will likely become nicer, but not for another 5-10 years.

Hamnett Place = May or may not come back within 10-15 years.

[SuburbanPioneer]

Originally Posted by Gnutella

No, the East End is not safe. That's where they test the atomic bombs.

I've heard some opinions that it would have been a very safe area if they actually did .

[Uptown kid]

Idk Hammlet Place was n question. For some reason I keep confusing HammLet Place with Bacon Hill... Hammlet place is for the most part to be AVOIDED!

[BrianTH]

I'd note that in the areas north of Regent Square and Whitney Park and south of Penn, things change as you are moving east from Braddock to the Busway. From Braddock to just short of Peebles, you are in the heart of Park Place and that area has already been revitalizing. That's now spreading to areas on the other side of Peebles, but I'd call it more transitional on that side, and the closer you get to the Busway the less redevelopment you are likely to see.

[BrianTH]

Originally Posted by Uptown kid

Hammlet place is for the most part to be AVOIDED!

I don't agree with this blanket statement. I do agree that Hammnet Place at the moment requires a bit of urban pioneer spirit, but there are lots of positive developments in that area and I think on the whole the people who have moved there recently have felt good about their decision.

[Craziaskowboi]

Originally Posted by SuburbanPioneer

I've heard some opinions that it would have been a very safe area if they actually did .

Well, a few low-grade nukes around the Shuman Correctional Center might do the trick.