Bon Air versus its neighbors (Carrick, Mt. Oliver, Knoxville, Beltzhoover, Brookline & Beechview) (Pittsburgh: top neighborhoods, rental)

[HarryRSpooner]

As a Yinzer-In-Training or a Y.I.T., I am trying to figure out how the City of Pittsburgh neighborhood "Bon Air" stacks up versus its immediate neighbors those being: Carrick, Mt. Oliver, Knoxville, Beltzhoover, Brookline and Beechview.

In your opinion where does "Bon Air" rank? From my own empirical research and expeditions to those various 'hoods I have come up with this: "Bon Air" is more desirable and safer than: Knoxville and Beltzhoover for sure. It's marginally or slightly "better" than some parts of Carrick and Mt. Oliver. But I'm not quite sure how it compares or contrasts to its larger neighbors: Brookline and Beechview. My other concern is given "Bon Air's" proximity to some less than savory areas, do they get some negative blow-back or exposure?

[I_Like_Spam]

Bon Air is peaceful, and I don't see it changing real quickly for the worse because its so isolated.

Mostly single family, owner occupied homes, there really is only one way in and out by automobile along McKinley Ave. Its surrounded on 3 sides by a large cemetery, a cliff going down to 51 and woods which are part of McKinley Park.



There really isn't any attractions back there, no retail, just an LRT stop.


It really doesn't compare to the other places, as it is strictly bedroom back there, as opposed to all of the commerce that goes on in Brookline, Carrick or Mt. Oliver.

[eschaton]

Originally Posted by I_Like_Spam

Bon Air is peaceful, and I don't see it changing real quickly for the worse because its so isolated.

Mostly single family, owner occupied homes, there really is only one way in and out by automobile along McKinley Ave. Its surrounded on 3 sides by a large cemetery, a cliff going down to 51 and woods which are part of McKinley Park.

The flip side though is Bon Air isn't the sort of place which would appeal to new city residents much. No local commercial district, with no non-blighted districts nearby. Minus a few nice houses right around Bon Air Avenue itself, it's a pretty unimpressive collection of 1950s/1960s housing. Local schools shared with northern Carrick and perceived as pretty bad. IIRC, it has one of the lowest percentages of residents with college degrees in the city.

Really, it's a mini-Stanton Heights without the convenience to the East End. The T stop is the big thing it has going for it, but it's a hike from the neighborhood itself (since it's down in a ravine). I'm not sure if it will decline into a ghetto (there aren't enough troublemakers in the southern hilltop neighborhoods for everything to keep heading downhill), but I see it continuing a long, slow decline in the same manner Lincoln Place has - somewhere there just aren't enough young people moving in to counter the old people dying off.

[ferraris]

Bon Air is one of the few non-East End neighborhoods that has retained direct transit to both Oakland and Downtown. And since downtown is via the T (even if a bit inconveniently located), I think that is a net positive compared to bus transit. It really is a pretty tucked away neighborhood though, so I think it is hard to predict the future of it as an outsider.

[HarryRSpooner]

Originally Posted by eschaton

The flip side though is Bon Air isn't the sort of place which would appeal to new city residents much. No local commercial district, with no non-blighted districts nearby. Minus a few nice houses right around Bon Air Avenue itself, it's a pretty unimpressive collection of 1950s/1960s housing. Local schools shared with northern Carrick and perceived as pretty bad. IIRC, it has one of the lowest percentages of residents with college degrees in the city.

Really, it's a mini-Stanton Heights without the convenience to the East End. The T stop is the big thing it has going for it, but it's a hike from the neighborhood itself (since it's down in a ravine). I'm not sure if it will decline into a ghetto (there aren't enough troublemakers in the southern hilltop neighborhoods for everything to keep heading downhill), but I see it continuing a long, slow decline in the same manner Lincoln Place has - somewhere there just aren't enough young people moving in to counter the old people dying off.

Interesting, a mini-Stanton Heights, that's extremely insightful and revealing. But wouldn't you say it's even a bit "safer" than Stanton Heights itself? The lack of a local commercial or business district is probably the main negative. Where can or do folks in "Bon Air" shop?

[Uptown kid]

How Bon Air compares to it's neighbors listed on the thread:
-Its safer beyond comprehension than: Beltzhoover, Northern Knoxville & Mt. Oliver Boro
-Its a notable degree safer than: Southern Knoxville & parts of Carrick
-IMO slight advantage over (although pretty much in the same category): Mt. Oliver (city)
-IMO almost undesirable to: Brookline & Beechview (these two are improving, while there's nowhere to go but down for Bon Air)

[HarryRSpooner]

Originally Posted by Uptown kid

How Bon Air compares to it's neighbors listed on the thread:
-Its safer beyond comprehension than: Beltzhoover, Northern Knoxville & Mt. Oliver Boro
-Its a notable degree safer than: Southern Knoxville & parts of Carrick
-IMO slight advantage over (although pretty much in the same category): Mt. Oliver (city)
-IMO almost undesirable to: Brookline & Beechview (these two are improving, while there's nowhere to go but down for Bon Air)

In other words you're bullish or long when it comes to Beechview & Brookline. See I can understand Brookline but isn't Beechview a bit sketchier? The more I think out loud the more I realize you are right: Bon Air isn't ever likely to have a business district. The only counter I can come up with is - doesn't Brookline proportionally have more renters? It looks like there are more "run down" homes in Beechview. Maybe I'm wrong. Maybe it's just because both neighborhoods are simply bigger.

[Uptown kid]

Well you're right Beechview definitely still has a lot of a gritt to the name, and you're right some streets have more blight & drug problems than others. Yet aparently as of late it's been attracting the hipster crowd under the radar, and to my knowledge it's in a notably better shape than it was 10, even 5yrs ago... So I see it as trending up.

[eschaton]

Originally Posted by JayTwila

Interesting, a mini-Stanton Heights, that's extremely insightful and revealing. But wouldn't you say it's even a bit "safer" than Stanton Heights itself?

Stanton Heights isn't really unsafe, minus the wacko who shot all the cops a few years back. I mean, it has a black side and a white side, but I've never heard anything about gangs or shootings in the black side of Stanton Heights - not even much about petty drug dealing and burglaries. I do think crime rates are nominally lower in Bon Air though - in part probably because it's a "dead end neighborhood" whereas you can at least cut through Stanton to get from East Liberty to Lawrenceville.

Originally Posted by JayTwila

In other words you're bullish or long when it comes to Beechview & Brookline. See I can understand Brookline but isn't Beechview a bit sketchier? The more I think out loud the more I realize you are right: Bon Air isn't ever likely to have a business district. The only counter I can come up with is - doesn't Brookline proportionally have more renters? It looks like there are more "run down" homes in Beechview. Maybe I'm wrong. Maybe it's just because both neighborhoods are simply bigger.

Both Brookline and Beechview have commercial districts with potential. The local public schools are about equal in quality. Brookline has superior houses, but Beechview has the T, which could become a real advantage. Beechview definitely has more sketchy people and drug addicts, but generally speaking the druggies are the first people to move out of a neighborhood once it starts getting pricier.

Don't look at rental rates as meaning anything - it says nothing about a neighborhood in Pittsburgh. Beltzhoover has one of the highest rates of home-ownership in the city - 73.5%. Squirrel Hill South is only 45.6% homeowner occupied, in contrast. The hottest neighborhoods in the city right now have even lower rates of home-ownership.

[HarryRSpooner]

Oh, I bet Beltzhoover has one of the highest ratios of free and clear home-ownership too.