What happened to the far East End neighborhoods? (Pittsburgh, Wilkinsburg: law, stores)

[selltheburgh]

Highland Park took a dip through the 80s and just recently recovered in the last 8 years or so.

In the mid 2000's there were more drugs being sold on Bryant St than much else. The owner of the market (junk food at the time) was shot in the face during a robbery.

The 800 & 900 blocks of many streets were overrun with drugs and gangs.

Highland Park was also where a lot of people fled to when other neighborhoods started to bottom out.


I don't know the history of N Pt Breeze, but my relatives in their 60s and late 80s refer to that area (Thomas, McPherson) as Homewood. They used to work there.

N Pt Breeze had a very stable middle class and a lot of owner occupants. It also had a strong community group that worked to promote home ownership.

[selltheburgh]

Originally Posted by ryanm3685

Someone I talked to said there's still an Italian food store, on Larimer Avenue near the bridge, that has some awesome sausage. Maybe I should learn some Italian, because I bet the Italians still in Larimer patronize this store.

Yes, and Stagno's bakery is still in Larimer as well driving the same bread truck from way back when.

[Uptown kid]

The middle class never fled in Highland Park/Point Breeze North. That might not be the reason. But it is foresure a reason.

[Hopes]

Originally Posted by ryanm3685

How did Point Breeze North and Highland Park manage to hold their own despite bordering those areas?

They didn't hold their own. They just didn't get as bad, and started to improve again. They're nothing near what they were yet, but they're heading in that direction.

Originally Posted by ryanm3685

Penn Hills should have taken a page from their books, and maybe Lincoln Park wouldn't have gone through as much hell as it did.

Penn Hills was unique because much of the city's white flight fled to Penn Hills. It was their nature to flee again.

[ryanm3685]

Originally Posted by Hopes

They didn't hold their own. They just didn't get as bad, and started to improve again. They're nothing near what they were yet, but they're heading in that direction.

I never knew Highland Park ever had any troubles. To me, it seemed like Highland Park, having some of the best built and largest homes in Pittsburgh, would have less population loss. Unlike Lawrenceville and Bloomfield, which had smaller houses (keep in mind families were often a lot larger during Pittsburgh max population time). In a way, I think areas such as Penn Hills and Shaler needed to expand, because the construction there was bigger and would give more breathing room to those bigger families. Since the Highland Park houses were big, people may have already been satisfied with their houses.

I was actually discussing the East End neighborhoods with one of my neighbors, who called Hamilton Avenue a "death zone." She says the south neighborhoods are better because there were less trouble spots from which to spill over.

Penn Hills was unique because much of the city's white flight fled to Penn Hills. It was their nature to flee again.

Did Penn Hills attract people who don't have balls? I would have fought for my neighborhood. It's a shame because I imagine there were a lot of people who moved there for good reasons, such as they needed bigger housing, or their old housing was dilapidated. But how do you tell them from people who moved there for the wrong reasons - the people I want to ask, why did you do that?!

Suburbanization wasn't bad per se. However, it could have been executed WAY better than it had been. It's when ethnic tensions came into this that I get upset.

This kind of stuff is unsettling, and I want to mourn.

[Hopes]

Originally Posted by ryanm3685

I never knew Highland Park ever had any troubles. To me, it seemed like Highland Park, having some of the best built and largest homes in Pittsburgh, would have less population loss. Unlike Lawrenceville and Bloomfield, which had smaller houses (keep in mind families were often a lot larger during Pittsburgh max population time).

I didn't say it became dangerous. It just sort of went slightly downhill for a while via some of those big houses turning into apartments, etc. They're not the well kept stately homes they were. Just drive down Negley and you'll see the yards aren't landscaped. Highland Park was a grand neighborhood back in its day. That's what I meant about it did go downhill. It just didn't go downhill like the dangerous neighborhoods. It's heading back up again so it managed to escape severe decline.

Originally Posted by ryanm3685

Did Penn Hills attract people who don't have balls? I would have fought for my neighborhood.

You missed my point. Most of the people who fled Penn Hills were the VERY SAME people who fled the city neighborhoods.

Originally Posted by ryanm3685

But how do you tell them from people who moved there for the wrong reasons - the people I want to ask, why did you do that?!

You can't ask them because they no longer live in Penn Hills.

[ryanm3685]

Originally Posted by Hopes

I didn't say it became dangerous. It just sort of went slightly downhill for a while via some of those big houses turning into apartments, etc. They're not the well kept stately homes they were. Just drive down Negley and you'll see the yards aren't landscaped. Highland Park was a grand neighborhood back in its day. That's what I meant about it did go downhill. It just didn't go downhill like the dangerous neighborhoods. It's heading back up again so it managed to escape severe decline.

Did Shadyside or Squirrel Hill go through this at all, considering that those neighborhoods have a decent student population, who are renters?

You missed my point. Most of the people who fled Penn Hills were the VERY SAME people who fled the city neighborhoods.

You can't ask them because they no longer live in Penn Hills.

Sounds like the kind of people who run from their problems, who are opportunists who use people and abandon them once they are done using them. Am I right or can you say something about them in their defense? Because it seems to me if they abandon not one but two or more neighborhoods, they strike me as cut and run.

[I_Like_Spam]

Originally Posted by ryanm3685

As of late, there's been some talk about Wilkinsburg - its history, good and bad areas, and hidden gems. I never knew exactly what caused sections of Wilkinsburg to go under. Was it just the fact that Homewood was nearby, because I've heard that the rivalry was so vicious that Homewood had to join forces with East Hills, and Wilkinsburg had to join forces with East Liberty, and those areas don't even like each other.

I also don't know too much about East Hills, Lincoln-Lemington, and Larimer. What caused those places to go bad? What kind of establishments did Lincoln Avenue have previously?
.

All neighborhoods change over time, and these areas are no different.

Larimer used to be filled with Italian immigrants- a few Italian merchants are still over there.

Upper Lincoln was mostly German, the large church on Lincoln and Campania used to be a German Catholic congregation- my great grandmother had her funeral there back in the day.

East Hills, they tell me, was a dairy farm. Post war suburban type housing as well as the East Hills projects and East Hills Shopping Center followed. The shopping center fell as new malls like Monroeville Mall were built and started attracting their shoppers.



Why did they "go bad"? Neighborhoods change over time, sometimes for the good and sometimes for the bad. Many of the original residents were tired of living in a densely populated community and moved to the suburbs because they were doing better economically after WWII and they had cars. The newcomers were largely tenants and not as well off, the places started to deteriorate. Deindustrialization in the area made the neighborhoods less inviting for industrial workers looking for convenience. Other causes like white flight, urban renewal also played parts.

[Hopes]

Originally Posted by ryanm3685

Did Shadyside or Squirrel Hill go through this at all, considering that those neighborhoods have a decent student population, who are renters?

I'm not old enough to answer that question. I don't think Squirrel Hill did, but I don't know about before my time. Shadyside was somewhat seedier prior to becoming trendy. Then it became super cool, and then it turned into yuppified chain businesses. Clearly it was a great neighborhood at the turn of the century so it definitely experienced some decline before it became trendy. It has decline now in the aspect that many landlords don't maintain the properties very well, but it's popularity keeps rent high.

[ccogp]

Originally Posted by ryanm3685

Someone I talked to said there's still an Italian food store, on Larimer Avenue near the bridge, that has some awesome sausage. Maybe I should learn some Italian, because I bet the Italians still in Larimer patronize this store.

Best Sausage I've ever tasted. I was born and raised down Larimer. It's been there since I was a little girl. I am now 60 years old.

Henry Grasso Inc.
716 Larimer Avenue
Pittsburgh, PA 15206
(412) 441-8126