Who's afraid of a Beltway? (Pittsburgh, York: real estate, subsidized, property tax)

[Craziaskowboi]

Originally Posted by bmantz65

Well this is decent news, bringing I-70 out of the stone age: Interstate 70 modernization projects to move highway into 21st century | TribLIVE

It is an adventure riding narrow I-70 among all the tractor trailers.

It's great to see PennDOT modernizing its Interstate system, and it's long overdue for I-70, which is another one of Pennsylvania's many pre-Interstate Interstates. It's basically like the Parkways East and West in a rural area, with no shoulder between the interior lanes and the median barrier, and several dangerously short on- and off-ramps with poor geometry. And they finally got rid of that dangerous loop ramp from I-79 northbound to I-70 westbound, replacing it with a two-lane flyover.

I've heard that plans for upgrading I-83 in the Harrisburg area are moving forward as well.

[ferraris]

A "commuter tax" on employees who work in the city (even if they don't live in the city) would be much easier to implement than a toll system. There'd be no technical obstacles other than payroll and you wouldn't have to get state or federal entities on board with adding toll road infrastructure.

[pman]

Originally Posted by ferraris

A "commuter tax" on employees who work in the city (even if they don't live in the city) would be much easier to implement than a toll system. There'd be no technical obstacles other than payroll and you wouldn't have to get state or federal entities on board with adding toll road infrastructure.

a toll would hit all users even if they were" just passing through." Philadelphia's commuter tax, the only city in the nation afaik with such a tax except Detroit, is blamed for that city's weak job position. I think if you implemented a commuter tax and kept the highways it might be easier to implement but it wouldn't be effective at doing anything other than dispersing jobs out of the city. (you would need to get the state on board to allow it).

[ferraris]

I don't know if they are as rare as you think; I know my hometown Toledo has a commuter tax as well (not that Toledo is some shining example of what to emulate). Sandusky also has one, likely due to the tourism industry around Cedar Point.

Philly's commuter tax is a crushing 3.495%. That's way too high. Pittsburgh could do well with something like New York's "mobility tax" of 0.34% that goes straight to the MTA. A small tax like that going straight to PAT could do a lot towards expanding transit, and indirectly helping alleviate traffic.

[SammyKhalifa]

Isn't that what RITA is for?

[ferraris]

Originally Posted by SammyKhalifa

Isn't that what RITA is for?

Is that the official name of the $52/year tax?

[SammyKhalifa]

Originally Posted by ferraris

Is that the official name of the $52/year tax?

Sorry, no it's the Cleveland thing (which I was mistaken in thinking is a broader general term) that coordinates a bunch of the region's municipal taxes. I've never dealt with it myself but understand that you pay the higher amount of the income tax where you live and where you work, with the difference being split appropriately by the authority.

Of course, that opens a whole other can of worms about the different municipalities in our area, and we've all gone around and around about that here; so haha, never mind.

[Lost_In_Translation]

Commuter tax punishes businesses and puts burden on them, toll puts burden on person in car and promotes mass transit from surrounding communities. Also diverts truck traffic because the parkway is no longer a free path from east to northwest, so trucks either take turnpike or go to 79.

I'd also like to see any expansion of parkway include HOV/tolls to allow bus traffic dedicated inbound/outbound lanes and also allows for federal funding. If traffic moves a little slower (can hardly get much slower anyway), it will adjust people's attitudes to using the roads in the city and encourage an understanding of true infrastructure costs.

[pman]

Originally Posted by ferraris

I don't know if they are as rare as you think; I know my hometown Toledo has a commuter tax as well (not that Toledo is some shining example of what to emulate). Sandusky also has one, likely due to the tourism industry around Cedar Point.

Philly's commuter tax is a crushing 3.495%. That's way too high. Pittsburgh could do well with something like New York's "mobility tax" of 0.34% that goes straight to the MTA. A small tax like that going straight to PAT could do a lot towards expanding transit, and indirectly helping alleviate traffic.

they are pretty rare and where they do occur (philadelphia, toledo, detroit) it is often not something you want to emulate. it is also a business tax rather than a road fee for use of the road. you'd pay the tax regardless of whether you walked, rode your bike, or drove. there are other benefits to tolling in addition to congestion reduction, enough money for proper road maintenance.

[Craziaskowboi]

I still believe that tolls are the most equitable way to pay for all Interstates, but maybe there can be a compromise in which Interstates between urban areas are maintained and upgraded by state taxes while Interstates within urban areas are maintained and upgraded by tolls.