NYT article on where college grads are moving (Pittsburgh, Scranton: rentals, loft)

[doo dah]

I guess that is what millenials want, Portlandia?

[Aqua Teen Carl]

Originally Posted by doo dah

I guess that is what millenials want, Portlandia?

No, I think you might be misinterpreting what "Portlandia" is vs. what young people want currently. Progressive/artsy/oddball type environments are not exclusively tied to hip businesses. You'll see gastropubby places in the middle of financial districts all over the US now.

[Der Schwabe]

Originally Posted by Aqua Teen Carl

The yuppification is only contained to one part of the city and thankfully there's a North, South, and a West part of Pittsburgh too. If you don't like that sort of culture it's easily avoidable, especially since we have so many physical separations between each area. What's unfortunate is that it's bumping the rents up (albeit slowly at times) in other parts of the city too.

But if you think about it, the whole country is trying to do the same thing with varied success. Even cities with lukewarm reputations are throwing up new apartments with $1600/month one bedroom rents and then "hip" businesses are opening up around them. Open up a restaurant/coffee shop/brewery with a mediocre product but give it a few Edison bulbs and suddenly you're in the middle of America's new attempt at a yuppie renaissance.

Some people get suc.... er... coerced into buying in on this. Others find out quick that paying big bucks for a place that isn't quite there yet (but pretends it is) is a raw deal.

I wish I could rep this. How could we expect any developer or business looking at at large premium for a few cheap cosmetic conceits not to seek this kind of market?

Some of the best "products" in this city are outside these areas because those businesses in less trendy areas aren't compromising their quality by paying out the nose in rent.

[gortonator]

Originally Posted by Aqua Teen Carl

No, I think you might be misinterpreting what "Portlandia" is vs. what young people want currently. Progressive/artsy/oddball type environments are not exclusively tied to hip businesses. You'll see gastropubby places in the middle of financial districts all over the US now.

ATC is right, and even more, you can find gatropubby localavore places in many more areas than just city financial districts. We stumbled on a good one in Leadville, CO at the weekend. Now that ain't a hip place. -8F and blizzarding for the record

Portlandia is caricature, remember - it certainly reflects elements of reality but is very, very far from the reality of Portland life for 99% of its inhabitants. It's a great city.

We have neighbors who moved here last year after living for 20 years in Portland. They say it's deja vu. They remember the Pearl District being slummy warehouses, the city's south river side being a desolate wasteland the downtown being deserted after hours. And look what happened. All the right ingredients are here in Pittsburgh to undergo such a transformation and create an unique 'Pittsburghia' . It's happening right before our collective eyes, right now, and if its maintains momentum, this place will look and feel very, very different in 10 years. Portland certainly was nothing like it is now 10 years ago - I know that from first hand experience.

It seems like some folks here expect major metropolitan transformations to happen overnight. They don't unfortunately. But they happen, and there's a very good chance one is happening here as I type.

[sealie]

Well, some people want change overnight and some people view any change as trendy snobby yuppification that must be stopped. But the reality is that if millennials all want to live in the same pocket of the EE, mostly north of Forbes and south of Penn, the high paid Googlers and doctors can outbid everybody else. Still lots of five figure houses south of 374 and north of the Allegheny though. Still some ways to get your foot in the door in a tech job if you can tell someone how to use MS Office or find bugs in software. The market is getting better for college grads with any skills. That's really what the article was about - new grads go where the jobs are (Houston. Austin. Denver. Minneapolis) not just where they can get the cheapest rent imaginable.

[gortonator]

Originally Posted by sealie

Well, some people want change overnight and some people view any change as trendy snobby yuppification that must be stopped. But the reality is that if millennials all want to live in the same pocket of the EE, mostly north of Forbes and south of Penn, the high paid Googlers and doctors can outbid everybody else. Still lots of five figure houses south of 374 and north of the Allegheny though. Still some ways to get your foot in the door in a tech job if you can tell someone how to use MS Office or find bugs in software. The market is getting better for college grads with any skills. That's really what the article was about - new grads go where the jobs are (Houston. Austin. Denver. Minneapolis) not just where they can get the cheapest rent imaginable.

I know 5 people who work at Google here. None live in the East End. All drive to work.

Hot neighborhoods get hot, then too hot, and then satellite areas come in to play, and then they get hot, too hot, and their satellite areas become attractive ... and so is the continuum of urban renewal. It happens in the same way everywhere. You can see it happening here.

And don't worry about SCR. When he is a successful business owner earning a 6 figure salary his views over yuppification and society will change. When you starting that business, SCR?

[theta_sigma]

The East End has always been the most yuppiefied (and most expensive) area within the city limits. I mean, those million dollar homes in Squirrel Hill and cutely painted townhomes in Shadyside and grand mansions in Highland Park did not just spring up 2 years ago.

[eschaton]

Originally Posted by Aqua Teen Carl

The yuppification is only contained to one part of the city and thankfully there's a North, South, and a West part of Pittsburgh too. If you don't like that sort of culture it's easily avoidable, especially since we have so many physical separations between each area. What's unfortunate is that it's bumping the rents up (albeit slowly at times) in other parts of the city too.

I think this is a gross oversimplification. The East End may be the center of gravity for Pittsburgh's gentrification. However, it's not as if barring East Liberty any majority-black neighborhoods in the East End are gentrifying. And it ignores the existence of the Lower North Side and South Side Flats. Really there are two gentrification bubbles - one surrounding Downtown, and the other in the East End (with East Liberty more or less the geographic center).

I do have to say since I've moved to Morningside, I've been sort of surprised at how different the neighborhood already is from my expectations. I thought it was a very "old Pittsburgh" neighborhood still, and yet most of the people I'm running into are professionals who moved to the neighborhood within the last decade from outside the neighborhood or region. Admittedly this may be a slanted sample, because it's mostly parents with small kids who I see out and about in the neighborhood. But it seems halfway to Highland Park already.

Originally Posted by theta_sigma

The East End has always been the most yuppiefied (and most expensive) area within the city limits. I mean, those million dollar homes in Squirrel Hill and cutely painted townhomes in Shadyside and grand mansions in Highland Park did not just spring up 2 years ago.

I wouldn't say always. It's more like since 1900. Before that the place the gentry lived in Pittsburgh was mostly Allegheny West, Manchester, and the Mexican War streets. Which admittedly are pretty much gentrified themselves again (though Manchester needs work).

Really, neighborhoods across the country gentrify for two reasons - undervalued historic housing stock, or great transit access and walkability. You can slot virtually all Pittsburgh neighborhoods into one or both of these categories.

[theta_sigma]

Why, it's almost as if people who have the ability to pay more for the things they value will do so when they find them! And those without that ability to pay will have to make due with what is left.

Ah, capitalism.

[Goodjules]

Originally Posted by eschaton

I think this is a gross oversimplification. The East End may be the center of gravity for Pittsburgh's gentrification. However, it's not as if barring East Liberty any majority-black neighborhoods in the East End are gentrifying. And it ignores the existence of the Lower North Side and South Side Flats. Really there are two gentrification bubbles - one surrounding Downtown, and the other in the East End (with East Liberty more or less the geographic center).

I do have to say since I've moved to Morningside, I've been sort of surprised at how different the neighborhood already is from my expectations. I thought it was a very "old Pittsburgh" neighborhood still, and yet most of the people I'm running into are professionals who moved to the neighborhood within the last decade from outside the neighborhood or region. Admittedly this may be a slanted sample, because it's mostly parents with small kids who I see out and about in the neighborhood. But it seems halfway to Highland Park already.



I wouldn't say always. It's more like since 1900. Before that the place the gentry lived in Pittsburgh was mostly Allegheny West, Manchester, and the Mexican War streets. Which admittedly are pretty much gentrified themselves again (though Manchester needs work).

Really, neighborhoods across the country gentrify for two reasons - undervalued historic housing stock, or great transit access and walkability. You can slot virtually all Pittsburgh neighborhoods into one or both of these categories.

Crafton is similar to Morningside in that homes are selling to younger families, generally the parents are college educated professionals. Since I bought my place in Dec 2012, five houses on my street have sold to this demographic. I would guess that this is the case all over Crafton. Reasonably priced big old houses, easy commute to downtown or Robinson, decent schools add up to an attractive place to live.