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Nothing, it is just more double talk by those trying use fuzzy math to excuse not raising minimum wage. They admit very few people are actually getting minimum wage but then try and say the price of everythin will skyrocket, jobs will be lost, companies will fail because of a small raise for a few people. It is always been interestig that the right always fights minimum wage increases even if it has a been a decade since they were lasy increased, heck most of them want to end it all together, talk about being bought by big business. You can try and discuss the issue with them, just understand that they will just keep going over the same things already expalined to them until you come to the realization that they are not actually discussing anything. Good thing is no matter how much they whine on and on about it minimum wages will increase from time to time anyway.
Casper
Trying to explain the issue to anyone else who doesn't listen...
1. Raising the minimum wage increases the cost of doing business for anyone who has minimum wage workers. Primarily teens and young adults, menial jobs.
2. When the cost of doing business goes up, to balance the scale, overhead must be lowered, income must increase, or both must take place.
3. Translation, raise prices, reduce payroll, cut back on costs.
4. Now that you probably have done all three, unemployment goes up, the price of your goods and services have gone up, and you are trying to spend less, meaning people's business suffers the loss of goods and services you would normally be getting, and their costs associated with those goods and services YOU provide has gone up. This causes a chain reaction, round and round, till everything balances out.
ONCE a balance is achieved, then the task of growing begins, once growth begins, employment starts increasing, more goods and services, by both businesses and by individuals goes up, and the growth cycle begins to flourish.
BTW, not that the costs of all goods and services have gone up, in direct proportion to the increase in minimum wage, the people you tried to help, are in the same position, or worse than they were before, and everyone else, who's wages did not increase proportionately to the minimum wage increase, has found their wages deflated.
Smooth move, because the end result, a greater percentage of people were hurt rather than helped, and the increased minimum wage accomplished nothing.
Trying to explain the issue to anyone else who doesn't listen...
1. Raising the minimum wage increases the cost of doing business for anyone who has minimum wage workers. Primarily teens and young adults, menial jobs.
2. When the cost of doing business goes up, to balance the scale, overhead must be lowered, income must increase, or both must take place.
3. Translation, raise prices, reduce payroll, cut back on costs.
4. Now that you probably have done all three, unemployment goes up, the price of your goods and services have gone up, and you are trying to spend less, meaning people's business suffers the loss of goods and services you would normally be getting, and their costs associated with those goods and services YOU provide has gone up. This causes a chain reaction, round and round, till everything balances out.
ONCE a balance is achieved, then the task of growing begins, once growth begins, employment starts increasing, more goods and services, by both businesses and by individuals goes up, and the growth cycle begins to flourish.
BTW, not that the costs of all goods and services have gone up, in direct proportion to the increase in minimum wage, the people you tried to help, are in the same position, or worse than they were before, and everyone else, who's wages did not increase proportionately to the minimum wage increase, has found their wages deflated.
Smooth move, because the end result, a greater percentage of people were hurt rather than helped, and the increased minimum wage accomplished nothing.
"I want every one of my workers to be able to afford one of my cars."
-Henry Ford.
Possibly paraphrased, but I believe essentially correct. Ford wanted cheap production and high wages, to keep the economic engine roaring. It worked for decades.
The principle of low wages and high production does not seem to be doing so well. It appears to have run into trouble once the consumers access to easy credit ran out.
Businesses do not exist in a vacuum. They require customers as well as employees. Often with overlap. Increasing the disposable income of the customers is not bad for businesses.
It is interesting to note that the countries in financial trouble all appear to be countries that have tried to run a low minimum wage economy.
Because a person's pay is not relative to what someone else does.
Oh Really, If a person’s pay is not relative to what someone else does then why object to a higher minimum wage? If someone flipping burgers at Burger King is making more than you are then what is it to you? A higher minimum wage drives up the cost of those things done by minimum wage workers. They are better off and those people above minimum wage are worse off. But on average everyone is better off.
Quote:
Originally Posted by OhioIstheBest
If I work as an engineer should my pay be based on what the HR person makes or should it based on what I do?
If you work as an engineer watch out because your job may very likely be outsourced to India or some other place. Then the CEO will want a raise because he cut costs and you will be looking for a new job that doesn’t make as much money as your old one did. The minimum wage sets the floor that you can drop to. So tying minimum wage to what the CEOs are making protects the economy from this game.
Quote:
Originally Posted by OhioIstheBest
All the class envy crap is nonsense.
Tell that to the people that are cashing out the middle class in America and investing in the middle class in India and China etc.
Quote:
Originally Posted by OhioIstheBest
If income gap matters then please tell me how Bill Gates making billions affects my life? Or yours? It doesn't.
Well Bill Gates making billions affects my life by the value he added to the economy. He also did his work here and the people he employed worked here. If he were to move his operation to India to cut costs then he would be adversely affecting my life.
"I want every one of my workers to be able to afford one of my cars."
Quote:
Originally Posted by Grim Reader
-Henry Ford.
Possibly paraphrased, but I believe essentially correct. Ford wanted cheap production and high wages, to keep the economic engine roaring. It worked for decades.
The principle of low wages and high production does not seem to be doing so well. It appears to have run into trouble once the consumers access to easy credit ran out.
Businesses do not exist in a vacuum. They require customers as well as employees. Often with overlap. Increasing the disposable income of the customers is not bad for businesses.
It is interesting to note that the countries in financial trouble all appear to be countries that have tried to run a low minimum wage economy.
You have to pay your workers enough to be able to by your products. Before Ford it was cars for the rich. After Ford the middle class in America was rich.
Quote:
Originally Posted by workingclasshero
higher minimum wage = more pain for everyone
The collapsing personal debt bubble is painful for everyone. Higher wages will tend to stop the collapse of the personal debt bubble. So higher wages = less pain for everyone. Japan has been down the road we are on for 20 years and they haven’t seen the end of it yet.
Quote:
Originally Posted by workingclasshero
you CAN NOT set a FEDERAL (NATIONAL) minimum wage and have it fair to everyone..therefore it is unconstitutional to have a national minimum wage
When FDR set the first minimum wage it was set for the interstate transportation workers. That is within the powers of the national constitution. Why can’t you can you pleas explain to me why you can’t set a national minimum wage that is fair to everyone? We all get paid in US dollars. We all pay the same for gas as it is valued in US dollars. All of the raw materials are valued in USD. So setting a minimum wage can be fair for everyone.
I notice that you didn’t try and refute my points about cashing out the middle class in the US and investing in the middle class in China etc. If we are going to be doing that then we need to start investing in the working poor as they are who will be consuming the consumer goods. The best tool for doing that is the minimum wage law.
Trying to explain the issue to anyone else who doesn't listen...
1. Raising the minimum wage increases the cost of doing business for anyone who has minimum wage workers. Primarily teens and young adults, menial jobs.
2. When the cost of doing business goes up, to balance the scale, overhead must be lowered, income must increase, or both must take place.
3. Translation, raise prices, reduce payroll, cut back on costs.
4. Now that you probably have done all three, unemployment goes up, the price of your goods and services have gone up, and you are trying to spend less, meaning people's business suffers the loss of goods and services you would normally be getting, and their costs associated with those goods and services YOU provide has gone up. This causes a chain reaction, round and round, till everything balances out.
ONCE a balance is achieved, then the task of growing begins, once growth begins, employment starts increasing, more goods and services, by both businesses and by individuals goes up, and the growth cycle begins to flourish.
BTW, not that the costs of all goods and services have gone up, in direct proportion to the increase in minimum wage, the people you tried to help, are in the same position, or worse than they were before, and everyone else, who's wages did not increase proportionately to the minimum wage increase, has found their wages deflated.
Smooth move, because the end result, a greater percentage of people were hurt rather than helped, and the increased minimum wage accomplished nothing.
Same old arguement over and over, except in a list form. Sorry but the problem with your arguement is that history has proven that all that horror movie you keep trying to write nevers happens as you said.
Casper
you CAN NOT set a FEDERAL (NATIONAL) minimum wage and have it fair to everyone..therefore it is unconstitutional to have a national minimum wage
You're 1000% right but they can't hear you.
Min wage does not buy you the same in a high cost city/state as it does in a low cost city/state.
I can't fathom how anyone can live in California on min wage salaries.
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