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Old 01-01-2011, 08:06 PM
 
Location: Dallas
31,290 posts, read 20,744,889 times
Reputation: 9325

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Quote:
Originally Posted by subsound View Post
NYT: South celebrates Civil War, without slaves - U.S. news - The New York Times - msnbc.com

The war has been re-branded as celebrations come up to drastically play down the role of slavery, and the fact it even happened. Instead many are making it all about "states rights" while the good ol' southern boys were defending their homes from the warring North.

Screw that one of the tantamount reasons to secession was to keep human beings as property I guess.

Only about 5% of Southerners owned slaves. It was about states rights, not slavery. Slavery was on it's way out, and could have been ended without war. Lincoln is a villain, and killed more Americans than anyone in history.
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Old 01-01-2011, 08:10 PM
 
56,988 posts, read 35,206,841 times
Reputation: 18824
Quote:
Originally Posted by Roadking2003 View Post
Only about 5% of Southerners owned slaves. It was about states rights, not slavery. Slavery was on it's way out, and could have been ended without war. Lincoln is a villain, and killed more Americans than anyone in history.
Whew...and thank goodness he did. Judging from the behavior of the South for the next hundred years after the war was over, he clearly didn't kill enough people.
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Old 01-01-2011, 09:56 PM
 
Location: Bradenton, Florida
27,232 posts, read 46,663,996 times
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If the Southern states would have been allowed to secede, where would the North have gotten its soldiers?

The South maintains a proud military tradition, even today.
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Old 01-02-2011, 10:02 AM
 
56,988 posts, read 35,206,841 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TKramar View Post
If the Southern states would have been allowed to secede, where would the North have gotten its soldiers?

The South maintains a proud military tradition, even today.
Yea..ok.Must be nice to be proud losers.

And we would have gotten our soldiers from the same place we got them in 1861. Didn't look like we had any problems getting soldiers back then, did we? Don't believe me? Go visit any Confederate Memorial...you'll see the proof.
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Old 01-02-2011, 10:16 AM
 
Location: Bradenton, Florida
27,232 posts, read 46,663,996 times
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Oh, right, same place you always got the military, from your lower classes.
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Old 01-02-2011, 10:19 AM
 
56,988 posts, read 35,206,841 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TKramar View Post
Oh, right, same place you always got the military, from your lower classes.
Yea, cuz all of those Confederate troops came from southern royalty.

Not to mention that most of them fought for a cause (slavery) that most of them couldn't even afford to participate in. Real braniacs those dudes were!
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Old 01-02-2011, 10:22 AM
 
Location: Bradenton, Florida
27,232 posts, read 46,663,996 times
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Admit it, most of your Northerners paid to get OUT of military service, back in the day...

And even today, the majority of the the military comes out of the South.

And we've told you--the issue was STATES' RIGHTS, not slavery at all.

Do we really need the feds running everything? No, they should be weak, and the individual states strong.
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Old 01-02-2011, 10:27 AM
 
56,988 posts, read 35,206,841 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TKramar View Post
Admit it, most of your Northerners paid to get OUT of military service, back in the day...

And even today, the majority of the the military comes out of the South.
The South LOST! Get over it. The Confederate Army couldn't care less about who paid what to get out of whatever. If they got beat by a bunch of underclass troops, then so be it. What that has to do with anything in 2011 goes completely over my head.

And frankly, i don't give a damn about where most of today's military comes from. If a large number of southerners want to race off to Afghanistan and Iraq, then bully for them! I don't think the Taliban cares about where they come from.
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Old 01-02-2011, 10:36 AM
 
Location: Bradenton, Florida
27,232 posts, read 46,663,996 times
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I think that they should secede again.

But they should do it quietly, and take over the military services as they stand today.

Slaughtering Yankees is fun.
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Old 01-02-2011, 11:04 AM
 
Location: Sango, TN
24,868 posts, read 24,392,645 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by desertdetroiter View Post
The South LOST! Get over it. The Confederate Army couldn't care less about who paid what to get out of whatever. If they got beat by a bunch of underclass troops, then so be it. What that has to do with anything in 2011 goes completely over my head.

And frankly, i don't give a damn about where most of today's military comes from. If a large number of southerners want to race off to Afghanistan and Iraq, then bully for them! I don't think the Taliban cares about where they come from.
The reason the south lost the war were two things.

1. The centralization of the rail system and industrial complexes of the north. Lincoln took over all of the production and rail systems of the north during the war, completely outside of the powers granted him by the Constitution, but it did win the war for the north.

2. Lee's stupid military moves of invasion of the north trying to end the war. The south had much more of a chance of winning a defensive war than invading the north. The failed invasion at Gettysburg is seen by most historians as the beginning of the end of the civil war.

Now the causes of the civil war are very relevant to todays world, IMO, and that of many others.

Put as simply as I can.

1. The government of these United States had legal slavery. Allowing anyone to purchase human beings of slavery as property.

2. Regardless of how one feels about the practice of slavery, it was legal, and people paid money for that property.

3. Northern businessmen wanted to buy up large swaths of land in the south from bankrupted slave owners who would have lost 75% of their monetary value if slavery was abolished. They didn't want the African slaves to move north, so they could care less about slavery. Like all wars, it was about money.

4. Southern businessmen wanted to protect their legally held property.

If people wanted to save the union, and preserve human lives they would have outlawed the importation and sale of slaves in the United States, and then purchased the freedom of each and every slave in the south. This didn't happen because, as I said, the war wasn't about slavery, it was about money. One side was fighting to take legally held land and property from another, the other side was fighting to keep their legally held land and property.

The reconstruction after the war and the blind eye to the civil rights of citizens by the north and the federal government after the war proves that they couldn't care less about the African slaves.

I think slavery was a terrible evil thing, and that owning human beings was one of the worst things that my country every participated in. But it was legal.

If the federal government came to your state with an army, and told you that you had to give them 75% of everything you own, with no compensation for that, you'd be ready to take a gun and fight them also. Several soldiers were interviewed during the war, almost all of them said they weren't fighting for slavery, they were fighting "because those damned yankees are down here trying to tell us what to do."
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