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Is the politics of hate climate underlying cause of todays tragedy or is it an isolated incident?? What do you think??
Of course it had an effect, though it might be impossible to establish a direct, provable link. You can't pour poison into the political waters forever and expect it to have no effect at all. It just doesn't work that way.
The rhetoric of the Beck's and Limbaugh's IS poisonous because they don't recognize the legitimacy of the political opposition. Instead of accepting that others hold different opinions, and meeting those opinions in debate, they identify the other side as usurpers, illegitimate's and enemies, worthy only of scorn and whatever it takes to remove them. While sane, rational people can shrug off the hyperbole, such slanderous and evil talk doesn't just fall on their ears: it also falls into the ears of the unbalanced, the illiterate, the uneducated who can't distinguish between hyper-ventilated political rhetoric and a real call to arms. It's inevitable that some goofball, driven to paroxysm's of hate by the endless, relentless preaching of division, and frightened by the talking heads conspiracy theories, will do something tragic. What's surprising is that we haven't already seen this happen.
For those of us old enough to remember, what happened yesterday, and is likely to happen again, is the perfect counterpoint to the 1960's and early 70's.
Back then, the violent rhetoric of revolution and resistance came from the extreme left and it resulted in the creation of some really dangerous people who took the message to heart and acted. From the Weather Underground to the real Black Panthers, murder and mayhem spread, fueled by hate speech which questioned the legitimacy of the freely elected administrations of Johnson and Nixon. Why would anyone with any sense deny that the same kind of hatefullness and divisive language coming from the right wouldn't produce the same results today? Especially given the ease of communicating the message which the internet and 24 hour TV gives the purveyor's of disharmony and bigotry!
What's even more frightening than the actions of one deluded individual (or, possibly more) is that Beck, Limbaugh and their fellow traveler's are not stupid. They know what they're creating, they know what the likely outcome is, yet they go right on as if nothing has happened, as if all their blatherings about progressive conspiracies to destroy the nation don't mean anything and have no effect. But, they DO know and have known all along, so what's their motivation? What do they hope to achieve by throwing their brand of corrosive acid into the face of American politics? Were they trying to create things like yesterday? If not, why don't they stop now that anyone with half a brain can see the result?
Even more troubling is that so few people see the connection or, more likely, don't want to admit it. How many more must die before those who listen to and watch those fools rise up and reject their message of intolerance, bigotry and dangerous hatred?
So in one sentence you point out the ignorance of people who want to pin this event on some right-wing stereotype...
...and in the next you try to pin this event on some left-wing stereotype?
Do you understand the irony here?
You do realize that you're just as bad as the people you criticize...don't you?
Sorry but you can't have it just one way. You wanted so hard to find some reference to Palin or Beck in his life - and you could dance in glee thinking you could use it to destroy and censor the conservatives. Too bad because he turned out to be leftist. But suddenly now you don't want it pinned on politics?????
How two-faced can that be?
If he had ever attended a Tea Party, all of you liberals would insist that was what caused it, but when it turns out he hated the USA, hated God, smoked tons of weed, suddenly nothing has to do with his act, it was just an isolated act of a lunatic.
Of course it had an effect, though it might be impossible to establish a direct, provable link. You can't pour poison into the political waters forever and expect it to have no effect at all. It just doesn't work that way.
The rhetoric of the Beck's and Limbaugh's IS poisonous because they don't recognize the legitimacy of the political opposition. Instead of accepting that others hold different opinions, and meeting those opinions in debate, they identify the other side as usurpers, illegitimate's and enemies, worthy only of scorn and whatever it takes to remove them. While sane, rational people can shrug off the hyperbole, such slanderous and evil talk doesn't just fall on their ears: it also falls into the ears of the unbalanced, the illiterate, the uneducated who can't distinguish between hyper-ventilated political rhetoric and a real call to arms. It's inevitable that some goofball, driven to paroxysm's of hate by the endless, relentless preaching of division, and frightened by the talking heads conspiracy theories, will do something tragic. What's surprising is that we haven't already seen this happen.
For those of us old enough to remember, what happened yesterday, and is likely to happen again, is the perfect counterpoint to the 1960's and early 70's.
Back then, the violent rhetoric of revolution and resistance came from the extreme left and it resulted in the creation of some really dangerous people who took the message to heart and acted. From the Weather Underground to the real Black Panthers, murder and mayhem spread, fueled by hate speech which questioned the legitimacy of the freely elected administrations of Johnson and Nixon. Why would anyone with any sense deny that the same kind of hatefullness and divisive language coming from the right wouldn't produce the same results today? Especially given the ease of communicating the message which the internet and 24 hour TV gives the purveyor's of disharmony and bigotry!
What's even more frightening than the actions of one deluded individual (or, possibly more) is that Beck, Limbaugh and their fellow traveler's are not stupid. They know what they're creating, they know what the likely outcome is, yet they go right on as if nothing has happened, as if all their blatherings about progressive conspiracies to destroy the nation don't mean anything and have no effect. But, they DO know and have known all along, so what's their motivation? What do they hope to achieve by throwing their brand of corrosive acid into the face of American politics? Were they trying to create things like yesterday? If not, why don't they stop now that anyone with half a brain can see the result?
Even more troubling is that so few people see the connection or, more likely, don't want to admit it. How many more must die before those who listen to and watch those fools rise up and reject their message of intolerance, bigotry and dangerous hatred?
People will continue to die because the liberals continue to make this about their hate and vitriol long after it's already come out this freak was himself a liberal.
Get it???? He didn't follow Palin, Beck's book wasn't among his favorites, the Communist Manifesto however was.
The guy was a pot smoking leftist lunatic.
But maybe if you really wanted answers, you'd realize this has to do with mental illness. Like the liberal Columbine killers and liberal Charles Manson happened long before Palin or Beck.
Oh - but that doesn't help you exploit a tragedy for your agenda.
I think the Democrats have definitely created a climate of hate with their vitrol directed at those who are different from them (i.e. the rich, the religious, the conservative, or the hardworking)
reps to you, now this is amusing. On the point, yes, the Sheriff is right.
Is the politics of hate climate underlying cause of todays tragedy or is it an isolated incident?? What do you think??
I think the sheriff was right when he said unbalanced people are susceptible to it - it wasn't a "cause" per se, but it can be a pep rally for these types...
Though I hope this is the END of Sarah Palin and the idiot TeaParty, I am fearful there are still a few young men out there like this guy with a chip on the shoulder willing to "carry" out the 20 Pac initiative in the name of "taking back this country" and all too willing to PULL THE TRIGGER in the name of federalism....
Though I hope this is the END of Sarah Palin and the idiot TeaParty, I am fearful there are still a few young men out there like this guy with a chip on the shoulder willing to "carry" out the 20 Pac initiative in the name of "taking back this country" and all too willing to PULL THE TRIGGER in the name of federalism....
She may tone down a little, FOX is right now about to discuss what drove this guy to do this. It will be interesting to see if they acknowledge any culpability........
He is right. I live in AZ and I can say he is right. I am not at all surprised this happened. What surprises me is why more of it hasn't happened.
This place is crazy. I want out but that's another story.
This woman's office was vandalized for voting YES on healthcare reform and she'd received threats. Guns abound here. I could get a gun with very little trouble if I wanted to - not so where I lived before.
Anyway, he was tapping into something larger but, for some reason, AZ seems to be getting a lot of attention for being some microcosm of the craziness that has ensued in the US. I think AZ deserves it.
Oh, and this state is very right wing so of course you are going to get the Sarah Palin, Glenn Bleck supporting kind of hate crap.
Goodness me! I said the same thing before his press conference but was told I was being off topic. Arizona IS a mecca of hate and as you have said, I'm surprised it hasn't happened before.
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