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Last year our financial mess was the fault of Wall Street and financial managers. Now, it's magically shifted to the Unions and collective bargaining. You are sorely mistaken if you believe that occurred naturally. It is a planned, coordinated political attack by the real power elite, the money brokers. Not the working class of this country.
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First off lets stop talking about the Unionized Government Employees as the "Working Middle Class".......The Real Middle class are those people......most who are not union, who are struggling to make ends meet right now, who are footing the bill for these Unionized Government Employees who generally have a much better deal than they do!! Oh and you also forgot the politicians!
"...explains what the fight in Wisconsin is really about!"
Why do reactionaries claim that they are in possession of information that "really" explains some issue? As if by using "really" that it puts some stamp of authority on the information.
I once counseled by a old Boatswain's mate that any story that began with the tale's teller stating that "this is no ****" was a good indication that it was. I feel the same way when I read a story that begins with "really".
[quote=PITTSTON2SARASOTA;18085267]The problem here is many posters are capable of thinking for themselves and cutting through the Republican rhetoric....we all heard Walker's phone call and know what his true intent is(well I knew without the phone call). Would you like to hear what he's really trying to accomplish>>>>> To break the unions in Wisconsin.....hoping the trend will spread to other states and fuel his political ambitions by furthering the Republican AGENDA[quote] Of course. That's the point. to break unions for political control. It has nothing to do with fixing the economy. Breaking up the unions will not fix anything.
Since the posters in question love facts so much, I'm sure they've checked on the good professor's political history, his work in Massachusetts and the evolution of this attack on workers who happen to belong to unions.
First off lets stop talking about the Unionized Government Employees as the "Working Middle Class".......The Real Middle class are those people......most who are not union, who are struggling to make ends meet right now, who are footing the bill for these Unionized Government Employees who generally have a much better deal than they do!! Oh and you also forgot the politicians!
No, let's not. Your idea that Union members don't struggle in this economy is a fantasy. You're footing the bill - baloney. Union workers, the working middle class, pay taxes just like you do. Just like I do.
I was hoping for too much again, when I hoped your new found love of 'facts' would degenerate into another irrational rant with lots of exclamation points. !!!! I'm now suspicious you didn't even bother to read your own link.
You are probably a Democrat operative typing away here instead of being busy working your supposed small business.
If you were a small business owner you would be ragging on and on about the fees to start up, the stupid laws that make you file endless paperwork and of course the extra taxes you would pay for being in business for yourself.
I doubt what you say really, you sound NOTHING like a business person.
Government unions are a total monopoly that pay politicians to make them sweetheart deals in pay and benefits.
They are often way bigger than supposed big business.
In CA alone they put a couple of hundred million into election Brown, in exchange Brown has been hands off regarding unions regarding the balancing of the budget as the state sinks forever.
Big Government Unions are not the typical middle classes. they are the elite that get special deals the taxpayers who pay their salaries don't see in the real world.
Classic deflection--when you don't like the message, attack the messenger The truth--it kills you that people actually in business who aren't liberals don't agree with what the tea party is doing--it doesn't fit the little world you live in, so it can't be true, right?
If you're such an expert on my life, then I guess you'll know all about my repeated stands here for cutting the corporate tax rate to a level competitive with the rest of the world (and closing loopholes for big business) so that someone besides me actually pays taxes in this country--I pay out the nose. And guess what--out of the top 100 corporations in this country, +/- 80 pay NOTHING because of loopholes and tax breaks. Think that's fair?
The truth is that small business and working/middle class people take it on the nose in this country--and we're the ones who actually create jobs--while big business runs the show, and hides profits and creates jobs OFF SHORE. I don't want to live in a country where big business calls all the shots, and that's where we're heading. I also think we need a strong two party system in this country so the messages balance each other out, and government actually comes up with some common sense ideas. The republican party wasn't a party of radical ideologues when I was growing up--we were the party of business and reason--but I don't even recognize it anymore.
I don't think you get it--the R party IS NOT just the tea party. There are still moderates out there who are ticked off about where you're taking this country, and you're seeing that in Wisconsin. I grew up in a Republican union home (my mom was a teacher, and all my sibs are now). The far right R's made big promises last fall about the economy, but so far I haven't heard one word from them about supporting small business, and the infrastructure it needs, to support private sector job creation. Instead we're getting smoke and mirrors on union busting saving the states--it's all baloney.
As far as my business--I have 5 kids still at home. My husband is putting in 80 hour weeks right now on the larger business our family is also a partner in. I run my consulting business (and some special events--mainly fundraising events which are almost entirely before Christmas) from from my house, with seasonal and part time employees--I keep it flexible and limited because of my kids. Due to the nature of my work, I have really busy months (I wasn't here from early Nov-Dec) and I have months, like now, when I spend my time on the phone scheduling, writing drafts, and waiting for comments back. I take it you're retired or unemployed, because if I wasn't part-time with seasonal swings, I wouldn't be here either. My income is the college fund to put 5 kids through their undergraduate degrees, and hopefully advanced degrees as well.
I live in a right to work state, and there are all sorts of problems. First, there may be growth, but that growth comes with increased income inequality which harms the middle class, a middle class which owes its existence historically to labor unions. Second it pushes down wages, again this is good for large businesses that would be susceptable to unionization...but bad for having a middle class. Third it reduces job security, which in theory should increase productivity, but again is bad for having a stable middle class.
The end result is you end up trading a thriving middle class for some economic growth, almost all of which, is at the top. Essentially what you are doing is growing the economy slightly, increasing the % of rich people marginally, and substantially reducing the middle class. This is a tread America has been experiencing since the 1980s and it accounts for why we have such a large gini coefficient on part with Mexico and China.
Lets be clear about what really is happening here, a State that has long been a safe haven for Leftist ideals , saw the light this past November, now a new Sheriff is in town and he is doing what he said he would do and and the inmates are rioting in the Asylum..........Lets just go ahead and say he is trying to break the government employees union..........SO WHAT! Some one explain to me why they should have a better deal on the backs of the Working Class!
Lets be clear about what really is happening here, a State that has long been a safe haven for Leftist ideals , saw the light this past November, now a new Sheriff is in town and he is doing what he said he would do and and the inmates are rioting in the Asylum..........Lets just go ahead and say he is trying to break the government employees union..........SO WHAT! Some one explain to me why they should have a better deal on the backs of the Working Class!
No--lets tell the truth. Wisconsin elected a radical as governor on a wave of anti-incumbent sentiment over the economy--they want job creation. Now that they've figured out what they really got instead, they're not too happy. Polling that came out yesterday from Wisconsin shows he'd lose the election hands down today if the election was run again, 60% of the voters disagree with him both in the state and nationally (numerous polls) and in case you haven't been following the news--they had nearly 40 thousand people showing up at the capital before this even became national--now it's at the hundred thousand mark, and it's going on it's third week. Are you living under a ROCK?
Lets be clear about what really is happening here, a State that has long been a safe haven for Leftist ideals , saw the light this past November, now a new Sheriff is in town and he is doing what he said he would do and and the inmates are rioting in the Asylum..........Lets just go ahead and say he is trying to break the government employees union..........SO WHAT! Some one explain to me why they should have a better deal on the backs of the Working Class!
That is the wrong way to frame the question. The correct question is why shouldn't private sector workers have the same protections, and unionization opportunities as public sector workers. By busting up all unions all you do is decrease the size of the US middle class, for maybe a little productivity.
It is not about busting Unions.......you have to make the distinction between private and public employees. "How ironic that Wisconsin has become ground zero for the battle between taxpayers and public- employee labor unions."
If public employee unions constitute a significant portion of the unionize labor force which is does, then an attack on public unions is detrimental to unions as a whole.
It's not really a big leap once you have politicians that have political campaigns funded by corporate interests that are anti-union in power that after eliminating public employee unions that private industry related unions become the next target.
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The truth--it kills you that people actually in business who aren't liberals don't agree with what the tea party is doing--it doesn't fit the little world you live in, so it can't be true, right?
