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Old 03-04-2011, 03:03 PM
 
11,944 posts, read 14,784,939 times
Reputation: 2772

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Quote:
Originally Posted by VTHokieFan View Post
Yes. I forsee a one party country because Democrats are doing such a great job
I think we already had a one party system going on since the beginning. The choice between candidates being who had the higher calling in mind, a better plan in their hand. No matter how you try to convince yourselves otherwise, we are one nation, not millions of discrete particles bumping around random chance.

If the higher calling got lowered, it's because the candidates themselves left us with lesser choices and lesser viable plans. Can you look again at the choice of candidates for parties and see something of core value missing/ absent from them all? Why is the better candidate, those with a higher calling in mind, shoved off stage?
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Old 03-04-2011, 03:05 PM
 
Location: the very edge of the continent
89,029 posts, read 44,840,107 times
Reputation: 13715
Quote:
Originally Posted by harborlady View Post
The origins of that budget deficit are what? What is it the people wanted believing somehow money grows on trees via gov't policy? Both parties, special interests, federal influence, irrational people-- each one of them animated in special interest worship. Your allegience to yourself, not your country. People are worshiping themselves, worshiping men, not their maker. Their loyalty is to money, not their country. Look at this and ask yourself how all this is working out for you. That budget deficit-- the money was spent on a big stupid boat empire far from our own shores. Blaming teachers for why your electric bill isn't paid doesn't wash. Blaming cops for the laws they didn't write is not the fault of cops.
Bad analogy. The teachers, by acquiescing to their union's control, have in fact caused property tax bills to increase. They do indeed deserve blame.
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Old 03-04-2011, 03:07 PM
 
Location: the very edge of the continent
89,029 posts, read 44,840,107 times
Reputation: 13715
Quote:
Originally Posted by harborlady View Post
Do you prefer an economy based on price fixing as Nixon tried? It succeeded for a while but harmed business. Collective bargaining wage negotiations have everything to do with keeping up with cost increases in the economy.
You do understand that the teachers would still be able to collectively bargain for salary increases, right?
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Old 03-04-2011, 03:38 PM
 
11,944 posts, read 14,784,939 times
Reputation: 2772
Quote:
Originally Posted by InformedConsent View Post
Bad analogy. The teachers, by acquiescing to their union's control, have in fact caused property tax bills to increase. They do indeed deserve blame.
Not true. If your electric rates go up is it because the cost of fuel went up or because the utility company executives have tried to bankroll it's own golden package for itself? That clearly is the case in corporatocracy. The math is blowing your theories out of the water. Union wages and benefits have steadily declined since the 50's due to government used as catspaw in service to oligarchy class- Koch, Bush family, Coors, Murdoch etc. They have been the ones installing every opinion you have. There is not a single original thought in your head. You have been brainwashed to view the world as a war on everything. Even in this moment you are angry at me. Look at yourself honestly. You're a black man blaming whites for the root of all evil. You're a man beating his wife because his boss disrespected him. Listen to yourself.

Presuming that teachers have anything to do with wrongful decisions made in all other government programs, some of which aren't even controlled or decided in the state of wisconsin directly, is making your argument foolish. Stop shooting at the cops, quit kicking at the pillars of the community and see it's not the building or the specific official you are angry at. It's the system policies creating so many illusions keeping people blind to their real choices. Dems want transparency and cannot achieve it until the influence of ALL special interest is cut from ALL parties. Meritocracy starts in leadership. Meritocracy got lost in special interest dollar might makes right. If Thomas Jefferson were alive today where would he be permitted to exist in this system? THINK!
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Old 03-04-2011, 03:56 PM
 
11,944 posts, read 14,784,939 times
Reputation: 2772
Quote:
Originally Posted by InformedConsent View Post
You do understand that the teachers would still be able to collectively bargain for salary increases, right?
By using shotgun language to make your point instead of pointing directly at a problem you see is in the way of health, you've declared wars on government, social security program, unions everywhere, the profession of teaching, the profession of cops.... all at the behest of Koch/ Coors/ Murdoch agenda. He means to see unions eradicated entirely. He means to see the abolishment of parties that fail to serve their corporate agenda. Those agendas have no allegiance to this nation or any sovereign. They can make a global scale mess and walk away with impunity. Please see the destructive force of global trade/ IMF on Jamaican economy. The same piracy is happening in America only it's too big to see.
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Old 03-04-2011, 04:08 PM
 
23,838 posts, read 23,127,661 times
Reputation: 9409
Quote:
Originally Posted by A_Lexus View Post
This man was silent during the Bush years, like all the rest of the Republicans. Where was the outrage to the spending that Bush was doing? Why ignore that reality and its collosal negative impact to slash the living daylights out of education? Education was ignored during the Bush years, now he wants to slash it, pretending as if the GOP didn't bring us to this mess? This is the beginning of the end to the GOP. I sense a total annihilation of Republican candidates come 2012. Way to eliminate yourselves, Pubs.

Wis. governor: Ax $900 million from education - U.S. news - Life - msnbc.com
Total annhilation?

LOL

Did you even pay attention to the mid-terms? Do you actually understand why the GOP trampled Democrats?

I'm guessing not.

And what does Bush have to do with anything?
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Old 03-04-2011, 06:11 PM
 
Location: the very edge of the continent
89,029 posts, read 44,840,107 times
Reputation: 13715
Quote:
Originally Posted by harborlady View Post
Not true. If your electric rates go up is it because the cost of fuel went up or because the utility company executives have tried to bankroll it's own golden package for itself?
Hmmm... you really can't make the connection that when teachers' salaries and benefits increases add costs to the budget, the taxes that are collected to fund the budget must increase also?
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Old 03-04-2011, 06:16 PM
 
Location: the very edge of the continent
89,029 posts, read 44,840,107 times
Reputation: 13715
Quote:
Originally Posted by harborlady View Post
By using shotgun language to make your point instead of pointing directly at a problem you see is in the way of health, you've declared wars on government, social security program, unions everywhere, the profession of teaching, the profession of cops.... all at the behest of Koch/ Coors/ Murdoch agenda.
You neglected to mention the WI property taxpayers. It's their agenda. That's why they elected Walker. They're FED UP with always being on the losing end of the war the unions have waged on them for DECADES.
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Old 03-04-2011, 07:12 PM
 
11,944 posts, read 14,784,939 times
Reputation: 2772
Quote:
Originally Posted by InformedConsent View Post
Hmmm... you really can't make the connection that when teachers' salaries and benefits increases add costs to the budget, the taxes that are collected to fund the budget must increase also?
Salaries and benefits "increases" do not mean they were keeping up with economic reality on the ground. Like everyone else struggling to afford health care, those costs have skyrocketed out of control and every union has steadily seen a decline in coverage right along with the rest of America's privatized insurance. The insurance companies have been dictating the terms to all from President to the lowliest Private.

The budget shell game is the thing I'm pointing at and you're refusing to believe it's there. You have to be willing to see it. If someone down the road wrote a check to buy a big boat and your name was signed even if you've managed your home finances soundly... should you be held libel? If you're running a small business and theft occurs in your store, does that negate your responsibility to pay employees the wages they worked for that week? Those employees were not tasked with guarding the store. Who was the guardian, or did you downsize & believe that role of guardian was unimportant?
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Old 03-04-2011, 07:16 PM
 
Location: Hoboken
19,890 posts, read 18,755,547 times
Reputation: 3146
Quote:
Originally Posted by harborlady View Post
Salaries and benefits "increases" do not mean they were keeping up with economic reality on the ground. Like everyone else struggling to afford health care, those costs have skyrocketed out of control and every union has steadily seen a decline in coverage right along with the rest of America's privatized insurance. The insurance companies have been dictating the terms to all from President to the lowliest Private.
LOL, not the public employees of Wisconsin. Their union owns it's own insurance company and forces the tax payer to pay a premium over private companies for the privaledge to enrich the unions!
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