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Well what do you know? A police officer got it right. The guy in the video is being a complete d-bag and yet the officer keeps it together and maintains professionalism. I guess they aren't all corrupt right guys and gals? I'd be interested in hearing your thoughts............
We had this pretty well covered in another thread last week.
Yep, even the OP acknowledges that it is a rare surprise when a police officer is caught on tape and the end result is not a citizen being beaten, shot or tazed. No dead dogs in this one either.
I think the cop is an idiot. He lets a man with a gun walk away without positively identifying himself?? How does he know that he's not a wanted felon who's prohibited from posessing guns? He doesn't even check to see if he has a legal permit....
I think the cop is an idiot. He lets a man with a gun walk away without positively identifying himself?? How does he know that he's not a wanted felon who's prohibited from posessing guns? He doesn't even check to see if he has a legal permit....
Why would you state this when you dont know what the laws in that state mIght be?
Its not illegal to open carry in most states. If he was doing nothing criminal then end of contact. Period. The citizen doesn't need a permit in most states to open carry. It was an unloaded gun. No harm no foul. Move along.
Yep, even the OP acknowledges that it is a rare surprise when a police officer is caught on tape and the end result is not a citizen being beaten, shot or tazed. No dead dogs in this one either.
Something about this video really irks me and I'm surprised no one else has commented on it.
In my opinion, the guy doing the filming is out looking to prompt a reaction to get it on camera. He's being an a-hole in an attempt to provoke the officer and I think thats completely pathetic.
The guy being jammed is a "California Open Carry" activist.
Contary to popular belief, carrying a gun is not illegal in California, but it is highly restricted. CCW's for citizens are very rare. However, the law does permit firearms to be carried on your person, so long as they are a) unloaded, and b) not concealed. You are also allowed to carry ammo, so long as it is away from the gun.
What most open carry practioners do is carry a handgun in a holster on one hip, and an ammo pouch on the other. In an emergency, the gun can be loaded and used in a second or two.
Ca Penal Code section 12031(e) authorizes peace officers to detain a subject openly carrying a weapon, and inspect the gun to make sure it is not loaded. The officer may also run the serial number, if it is in plain view (anything beyond that is a "search", which requires PC, consent, or a warrant)
There is divided opinion as to whether the officer can request ID, in order to make sure the subject is authorized to have a gun in the first place (not a convicted felon, or on probation for drugs or Domestic Violence, etc). Current case law permits the inquiry, but the subject stopped is not obligated to give his name (that's why the guy in the video declined to ID himself).
Open carry activists in Ca are not happy with the current law. They are pushing for a more liberal CCW, or at least to be allowed to carry the weapon loaded.
For now, they exercise their right to bear arms, to the extent the Ca law allows. They believe 12031(e)- the so-called "e check"- is unconstitutional. They tape their contacts with peace officers to document the encounters. The activists aren't trying to be a-holes by video-taping the cops (usually), they are just protecting themselves (and hoping maybe to make new case law, or at least a good Youtube video).
I'm not an open carry activist BTW. I'm a retired Ca cop, who had to deal with these guys occasionally. It's an educational experience-you'd be surprised how many Cailfornia cops are totally unfamiliar with their own state's firearms laws. Maybe because they're fifty pages long, and contradictory as hell.
While my personal politics are to the left of Trotsky, I am a (conditional)2nd Amendment supporter.
I think the cop is an idiot. He lets a man with a gun walk away without positively identifying himself?? How does he know that he's not a wanted felon who's prohibited from posessing guns? He doesn't even check to see if he has a legal permit....
Open carry of an unloaded firearm does not require a permit, even in California.
If the individual practicing his Constitutional right to "open carry" was not committing a crime or violating a city ordinance the officer has no legitimate reason to detain him. We are not to the point in this nation where police can demand "papers please".
Is that really what you want where no reasonable suspicion exists?
hmmm... I agree with everyone that the police officer was exceptional. Seems like a great guy.
but I dont think the guy he stopped was such a dirtbag. Clearly he was looking to find a cop to stop him. But as far as experiments go, that isnt a bad one. I for one am happy there are people out there challenging the powers that be and insuring our rights still exist.
He was polite and compliant with all lawful requests. Nothing untoward about the exchange.
I think the cop is an idiot. He lets a man with a gun walk away without positively identifying himself?? How does he know that he's not a wanted felon who's prohibited from posessing guns? He doesn't even check to see if he has a legal permit....
You don't need a permit for open carry in Ca. And the cop is far from an idiot- he handled this situation very well.
As to the officer asking for ID, current case law is split. There is one decision that says in an investigation, the detainee has to ID himself. But there is some doubt as to whether an "e check" (examination to determine if the gun is loaded, per 12031(e) PC) is an investigation. Our LACO DA guideines recommended we don't push it if the subject refused to ID himself.
And the open carry activists almost always refuse- they are trying to create new case law where the request itself is unlawful.
The guy being jammed is a "California Open Carry" activist.
Contary to popular belief, carrying a gun is not illegal in California, but it is highly restricted. CCW's for citizens are very rare. However, the law does permit firearms to be carried on your person, so long as they are a) unloaded, and b) not concealed. You are also allowed to carry ammo, so long as it is away from the gun.
What most open carry practioners do is carry a handgun in a holster on one hip, and an ammo pouch on the other. In an emergency, the gun can be loaded and used in a second or two.
Ca Penal Code section 12031(e) authorizes peace officers to detain a subject openly carrying a weapon, and inspect the gun to make sure it is not loaded. The officer may also run the serial number, if it is in plain view (anything beyond that is a "search", which requires PC, consent, or a warrant)
There is divided opinion as to whether the officer can request ID, in order to make sure the subject is authorized to have a gun in the first place (not a convicted felon, or on probation for drugs or Domestic Violence, etc). Current case law permits the inquiry, but the subject stopped is not obligated to give his name (that's why the guy in the video declined to ID himself).
Open carry activists in Ca are not happy with the current law. They are pushing for a more liberal CCW, or at least to be allowed to carry the weapon loaded.
For now, they exercise their right to bear arms, to the extent the Ca law allows. They believe 12031(e)- the so-called "e check"- is unconstitutional. They tape their contacts with peace officers to document the encounters. The activists aren't trying to be a-holes by video-taping the cops (usually), they are just protecting themselves (and hoping maybe to make new case law, or at least a good Youtube video).
I'm not an open carry activist BTW. I'm a retired Ca cop, who had to deal with these guys occasionally. It's an educational experience-you'd be surprised how many Cailfornia cops are totally unfamiliar with their own state's firearms laws. Maybe because they're fifty pages long, and contradictory as hell.
While my personal politics are to the left of Trotsky, I am a (conditional)2nd Amendment supporter.
Wow. How differently things are here in the south. I do believe that to be able to lawfully carry a conceled, loaded, weapon all one has to do is apply for a conceal carry permit and take a firearm safety test.
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I'd be interested in hearing your thoughts............
