The ugliness of the new economy.

[Mircea]

Originally Posted by wutitiz

Conditions were so bad in the warehouse that at one point amazon contracted with a local ambulance company to have paramedics outside on standby in case a worker was hurt or collapsed from over-exertion. Workers who could not keep up the pace were fired and escorted out on a regular basis, puttting the 'fear of Bezos' so to speak, into the rest of the crew.

Smells like yellow journalism to me.

Amazon has a warehouse just across the river from me. They are constantly hiring, because they use temporaries, which makes sense given the grotesque government interference.

Temporary companies make money on the "Warm Body Theory."

The theory is real simple: you can only make money if you can bill the client for hours and you can only bill the client for hours if you send a warm body to the client.

Things are "tough" and people are desperate for work and the temp agencies are probably thrilled that they have a higher ratio of better quality people, but still, some people are not suited for warehouse work.

The temp agencies send them anyway.

You claim workers were being fired and escorted out and that smells like temp workers, not union workers. If they are represented by a union that wouldn't be possible because it would require that Amazon go through a number of actions like, um, "constructive criticism" and retraining and the whole nine yards of other nonsense before they could actually fire a worker.

I also happen to know that Amazon contracts with the same firm that provides industrial engineering consulting to GAP Brands. Industrial engineers design processes, like order picking. As bizarre as it may sound, industrial engineers record every step, literally every foot-step and every movement they make during the process that they are designing (or evaluating). The whole purpose of paying an industrial engineer to design your process is so you know how much labor you need and what your production rate will be.

If an industrial engineer can do it, then I can do it, but I'm not so sure that a 300 pound bowling ball would be able to do it. Yeah, I'm talking about big fat people. Those people who can only walk 15 feet before they have to stop and rest because they're so big and fat probably have a difficult time meeting the production standards.

Originally Posted by Roadking2003

There is nothing new here. People have been working in hot warehouses for decades, if not centuries.

But it ain't hot. It's climate controlled. Those are books. Do you have any idea how humidity will damage books and other paper products? Even if they weren't books, humidity will damage electronics products, that's why electronics warehouses are also climate controlled.

Originally Posted by bobtn

Until the state version of OSHA comes after you,reconmark.

That's a really stupid comment. You are aware of the fact that I interned at [federal] OSHA, right?

I'll explain it to you so that you don't embarrass yourself any more.

The State versions of OSHA do not do enforcement inspections.

What are the purpose of the State OSHAs? It's a two-tiered approach. You pick up the phone and of your own free will call the State OSHA office to come out and inspect your facility. A State OSHA inspector will show up and inspect your facility then prepare a written report for you. That written report is CONFIDENTIAL. The only people who see that written report are you, the State OSHA inspector and the supervisor for the State OSHA office. The Federal OSHA is not allowed to see it. That report will remain on file for 1 year. It will contain an analysis of your facility's operations and tell you everything that is good, as well as those things that are OSHA violations, and it will also tell you those things which are not OSHA violations but are not necessarily good, and which could be better.

You have 1 year to take corrective action for any OSHA violations noted in the report, unless the violation is determined to be greater than a serious violation, which would require immediate correction. Some potential serious violations may require action within 6 months. If there is an accident, and it is beyond the 1 year corrective action period and if the accident listed as an OSHA violation in the confidential report, then the Federal OSHA is allowed to see the report, and the Federal OSHA will levy a fine if appropriate.

The State OSHA offices do not levy fines.

Your first clue should have been the Pennsylvania OSHA Consultation Program. All State OSHA offices are OSHA Consultation Programs. Why? Because under the 2-tiered approach, they function as consultants, not enforcement agents (which is the purview of the Federal OSHA).

Pennsylvania has one and only one State OSHA office and it is located at Indiana University (why does Pennsylvania have a university named "Indiana" -- I have no idea).

So, no State version of OSHA in any State will "come after you" unless you pick the phone up and call them or send them an e-mail or fax to come visit you, and even then they won't do anything except write a report.

[NHartphotog]

For those who think OSHA would put a stop to Big Business atrocities like this, I know for a fact that there is a way for a cut-throat corporation to get away with virtually ANY worker abuse. In my industry, whenever the government came in to "fix things," the result was MUCH worse for the worker. For instance, the ridiculous work hours everyone in the industry is expected to work--when the government decided the excessive hours were creating a safety concern, the company simply switched to UNPAID overtime. Then there was no record of the employee putting in 36 hours straight, or 90 hours in a week.

Without exception, in my life every time the government tried to interfere to "fix" things, the result was that the worker suffered.

Workers are treated like crap in this economy because labor has no value. We allowed all the wel-paying jobs to be sent overseas, and we kept open-door immigration so that there were always desperate workers willing to do anything for a few pennies. The only way businesses will treat their employees like human beings--let alone valuable assets--is when we again have a functional economy where labor has value.

Unfortunately, I don't see that happening in the next 20 years, if ever. Another life lesson for the youngsters: when things are GOOD, they are going to change almost immediately. When things are BAD, they will go on forever, or until you physically leave the entire dysfunctional system. In this case, unless you're already old like me, try a nation that is NOT at the end of its life cycle.

[bobtn]

Mircea:"So, no State version of OSHA in any State will "come after you" unless you pick the phone up and call them "


LOL, Mircea, we've had TOSHA visit, unannounced. (We were less than thrilled, but we had no major issues.)

You were saying? It is the state versions I am referring to, and not all operate in practice, in the same manner.

[t206]

I can't speak for the actual working conditions, but I probably shop at Amazon 2-3x more than the average person, and their customer service has been INCREDIBLE compared to other businesses that I shop at...like astronomically better, I can't imagine this would be the case if the working conditions were really that bad.

I'm typically a nightmare to most customer service people because admittedly if I dont get exactly what I want and what I expect, I'm a big baby and b*&thc about it...I've never even come close to having to worry about the type of service I get from them, they far exceed my expectations anytime I have to deal with them.

[lifelongMOgal]

Originally Posted by HappyTexan

Did you read that article thoroughly ? Those are UNION workers.

[bobtn]

lifelongMogal, It is SICK to get enjoyment via the mistreatment of others.

[wutitiz]

The Seattle Times has been doing a big investigative series on Amazon and part of it ws a story on the Amazon warehouse culture. Worth a read for anyone who is interested in labor economics and/or ugliness economics.
Business & Technology | Amazon warehouse jobs push workers to physical limit | Seattle Times Newspaper

[texdav]

Originally Posted by northstar22

Your post is a classic case of projection -- you take your own attributes and push them on your opponent. Liberals want solid incomes, good jobs, and fulfilling lives for everyone, especially the poor and middle class. The conservatives are the ones who wish the death of the poor and middle class, they are the ones who want neo-feudalism.

If your username is accurate ("working class"), I can guarantee you that your life would improve significantly under a socialist government and economy. The Republicans have you so brainwashed that they have convinced you to vote against your own best interests. They don't care about you, they want to suck you dry so they can transfer more wealth to their rich corporate masters.

The nwhy do they support people who want those kobs to disappaear and loan to new jobs that are controlled by their special interest. Remmebr Amazon is part of teh new economy liberals have beeen seeking since the mid 60's with wealth sharing. Gore and other have doen quite nicely.What is called wealth sharig has become a dropout rate of 505 and a ticket to the pulbic hosing for many that;s grand parents where in the middle class. Unions di a great job with the auot industry milkig iot dry ;then vote to cut everyhting for NEW hires i their greed.Perhaps they should have paid attention when the mob controlled them insetead of support people like Hoffa.

[freemkt]

This should hardly be a surprise, Amazon already has North Americans working for Third World wages.