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I recently heard (Dennis Prager radio program) about a situation in SoCal, Orange County, I think....that makes me realize the self esteem movement has finally reached it's bottom.
Basically two kids baseball teams were playing. I think the kids were 10-12 years old and one team kept making homeruns. After the score turned to 20 - 1 (or something like that) the parents of the losing team asked that the scoreboard be turned to 0-0 for the rest of the game...SO THE KIDS WOULDN'T GET THEIR FEELINGS HURT. What is even more mind boggling is that the coaches had so little authority they had to go along with this insanity.
This trend is just hurting kids, IMHO. Lately, every kid gets a trophy during any competition...screw the kids that actually are the best and deserve the trophy. This creates a large pool of mediocre kids that act like entitled fools. If I run into another 17 year old "gifted" kid, that is anything but, whose parents have convinced them that they are brilliant (even though they have crappy grades and have no particular talents other than playing video games)...I may collapse.
What happens to these kids when they go to college? Nobody is going to care about their "feelings" or if they show up or not. And then later, in the work force....I guess their parents had better fix up the basement, because those "gifted" losers will never be able to compete in the market place and never be able to take care of themselves.
Okay, rant over. Anyone here experience this trend? Or do you think I'm imagining how prevalent the trend is. Also, what I'd really like is to hear from anyone that actually thinks this kind of thing is good for kids. Maybe I'm missing something.
You were much more polite about it than I would have been, so I congratulate you for being very moderate in your rant.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Elmonellie
...the self esteem movement has finally reached it's bottom.
It's been sitting on the bottom for a few years. The story about the game is typical of what I've been hearing for at least 5 years.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Elmonellie
Anyone here experience this trend? Or do you think I'm imagining how prevalent the trend is.
Good question --- is this really a trend, or are there just a few well-publicized isolated cases that makes us THINK it's a trend (like the "Summer of The Shark" which was a totally bogus media creation.)
My personal experience is that most people agree with YOU, Elmonellie. Regardless of their politics, I don't know anyone left, right, center, up, down, or inside-out who agrees with stupid garbage like protecting children from the concept of "winning" or "losing" a game.
HOWEVER: It is common in most little-leagues and other youth sports leagues to have a rule about sparing losers from humiliation. This isn't as extreme as the example you gave. It's a rule of common decency that allows the winning team to walk home triumphant, the losers knowing they lost, but they don't play the full 7 innings or 40 minutes (depending on the sport.)
Even in the NCAA, there are unwritten rules for most sports that say "don't run up the score." In other words, if you're a good sport then you take your win and you don't revel in humiliating your opponent.
This latter concept is about civility, not protecting children from reality (even though reality doles out a lot of humiliation.) What do you think about the general rule against running up scores?
Example --- every year, a major football program like UT or USC will play some podunk team that doesn't stand a chance of scoring more than 3 or 7 points. The stronger team could put all their best players on the field and probably run their tally up over 100 points, but they'd be scorned as grandstanding bullies who are "picking on the little guy." I'm personally undecided on this but tend to think it's a good rule, in general, not to humiliate the losing team unless you're in paid professional sports.
These are the same parents/teachers who want to do away with No Child Left Behind or change the test because their kids/schools can't pass the tests. You know, if it's too tough or "stigmatizes" their dumb kids, their bad teachers, them as parents or neighborhood school, they want to change the test so everyone can "feel good about themselves" rather than make their kids smarter.
281 schools in 30 districts in Washington State can't pass standardized testing in reading and math. What's their analysis - It's the test's fault or the standards for passing are too high. What's their solution? Lower the standards or change/eliminate the test, not educate their kids better. Read it, it's laughable:
281 WA schools, 30 districts missing No Child Left Behind goals (broken link)
You know these kids. They are all over the US. These are the same kids who don't have to take science and math for 4 years in school because it's too hard for them and then whine when they get older because foreigners are getting all of the high paying tech/engineering/science jobs.
I also think these are the same kids who will want to quit something when they know they aren't going to win like a war, maybe.
But I've got some bad news for you. They're already in the workplace.
I absolutely agree with your rant and your frustration. I have many past posts dealing with precisely this problem. Life is what it is, and we can't change that. Try to get away from all hurt feelings, and you instead are faced with no "good" feelings, either. Give the whole class an "A", and everyone is happy--except, of course, fot the kid who really EARNED his "A"...but heck, he's smart, and he'll get over it (we hope)---Want a non-judgemental, "anything goes" society? Fine; just remember that in an "Anything goes" society, ANYTHING really does "go"---sure that's what you want?----
Very on-target post ---
You were much more polite about it than I would have been, so I congratulate you for being very moderate in your rant.
It's been sitting on the bottom for a few years. The story about the game is typical of what I've been hearing for at least 5 years.
Good question --- is this really a trend, or are there just a few well-publicized isolated cases that makes us THINK it's a trend (like the "Summer of The Shark" which was a totally bogus media creation.)
My personal experience is that most people agree with YOU, Elmonellie. Regardless of their politics, I don't know anyone left, right, center, up, down, or inside-out who agrees with stupid garbage like protecting children from the concept of "winning" or "losing" a game.
HOWEVER: It is common in most little-leagues and other youth sports leagues to have a rule about sparing losers from humiliation. This isn't as extreme as the example you gave. It's a rule of common decency that allows the winning team to walk home triumphant, the losers knowing they lost, but they don't play the full 7 innings or 40 minutes (depending on the sport.)
Even in the NCAA, there are unwritten rules for most sports that say "don't run up the score." In other words, if you're a good sport then you take your win and you don't revel in humiliating your opponent.
This latter concept is about civility, not protecting children from reality (even though reality doles out a lot of humiliation.) What do you think about the general rule against running up scores?
Example --- every year, a major football program like UT or USC will play some podunk team that doesn't stand a chance of scoring more than 3 or 7 points. The stronger team could put all their best players on the field and probably run their tally up over 100 points, but they'd be scorned as grandstanding bullies who are "picking on the little guy." I'm personally undecided on this but tend to think it's a good rule, in general, not to humiliate the losing team unless you're in paid professional sports.
What you wrote is very interesting. I am not into sports (other than tennis) and know nothing about them. I had no idea that there was such a thing as "running up the score" and that it was common to not do it. I sure don't remember anything like that when I went to high school or college!
That is what is being taught and how it is being taught. I am sick of seeing the "My child is an honor student at ***". They get those because the child just shows up at the school and usually has nothing to do with real ability at all. I am sick of the excuse that any child goes bonkers because he/she was picked on by some bully. We had bullies at school and nobody in my schools shot the school up or anything. We also lost softball games. (Heaven forbid!!!!) I ran track and even lost many times. Children do not get self esteem from this typoe of behavior at all and in fact, all the parents are doing is teaching their child how to not have any personal responsibility and always blame the other person for one's problems.
This creates a bunch of people who will not handle criticism well, and will cry "its not fair" when things don't go their way. They will not have the mind set to make it better for themselves. When they confront someone who really is better at a particular skill or level and works harder gets more out of life then they do, they will become envious and jealous. To me an end result of this is the "class envy" which is common in America today. This doesn't teach kids to strive harder and reach for the stars which is the correct way to develop their self esteem. To me it's actually cheating. Kids must be taught that failure is part of life and to fail is natural. They need to learn the skills to deal and cope with failure and strive harder to reach your goal.
You see these lopsided scores a lot more now with kids these days because sports has turned into such an obsession in our society. Before they just divvied up the kids and play ball. Now even at Little League level you see a lot of parents getting their kids on the "ringer team" to groom them so they can be the next great pro athlete. I have read some unbelievable stories about changing zoning areas to accomodate certain kids on certain teams. It is ridiculous. Part of it also is because now they are televising highschool games and even little league games. So gamblers get involved. And all of a sudden what used to be a fun afternoon watching the kids play ball has been tainted. Very unfortunate.
In soccer we had a "mercy" rule.... if you made it to 7 - 0 or something like that, the game was simply called and everyone went home.
If you ask me, it's a practical thing. At a certain point, kids on sports teams see the writing on the wall, and simply stop putting the effort in because they know at 20-1, or 7-0 in soccer, it's just not worth it.
A lot of pee wee leagues etc. don't even keep score.
They should just have a slaughter rule and be done with it.
I really don't see why this is such a big deal.
I agree that a more serious issue is the academic tests where you can hide that you and your school just aren't getting the job done.
I tell you if my kids were turning in shaky grades (and they have on occasion) that they'd get an extra 1/2 hour of work on that topic each night until they got their numbers up.
The biggest determinant is the family, second is the school...the kids personality, natural gifts etc. fall somewhere in there too.
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Stupid Students Not Stupid Tests
