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"Catering" has a negative connotation, like you're doing non-smokers a big favor by not blowing smoke in their faces.
I guess it could have negative connotations, but technically it means bending one's personal choices/behavior to please another person... sometimes it does feel like a negative thing, other times it really doesn't.
For instance, I completely support "catering" to non-smokers in restaurants, since I find smoke & food to be a horrible combination. I don't understand people who enjoy smoking while eating, so I've never once complained about that rule. Also haven't complained about catering to smokers in airplanes, trains, etc, since again those places are just better left smoke free.
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The topic of this thread is not auto pollution.
No, but if people are going to use "air pollution" as an arguing point, it's only fair to bring up other sources... because while I agree smoke is a pollutant, it seems to be the only target on which some people focus. This is how a debate goes, and analogies are sometimes necessary to make a clear rebuttal.
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I believe you've said you're a non-parent. As such, you have no idea what parenting is like. Comparing parenting to dog ownership is ridiculous, and anyway, I'm not complaining about any dogs.
Again, it was just an analogy to make my point. And no, I do not have children, nor do I know what it's like to be a parent... but I do know what it's like to work with children, and to be around other people's children every single day. As such, I have every right to comment from the peanut gallery. I'm not telling anyone how to parent, just suggesting that the schools stop trying to meet everyone's needs.
Having been on the administrator's side, I can tell you this stuff becomes impossible and frustrating after a while. For crying out loud, I had a principal reject my idea for a "class snake" (in the library), because he was afraid a parent would complain their kid had allergies. Ummmm, please explain how anyone could be allergic to a SNAKE. I even said I'd use newspaper bedding, and only feed the snake on weekends, but his response was basically "it's just not worth the potential hassle."
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Your sarcasm had to do with "little Johnny". It was a poor word choice. "Mockery" would have been more accurate.
Sorry, that did come off a little snarky... but if you knew me in person, that's just how I talk! I didn't mean to be mocking anyone, it's just how I always refer to hypothetical children - as little Johnny and Susie, LOL. I love kids, and generally care a great deal about their well-being, so please don't think otherwise of me.
I was a landlord. I discriminated against smokers. I would not rent to smokers....even if they said they would smoke outside. This was perfectly legal.
There are some companies that will not hire smokers, even if smokers do not smoke on company premises.
Smokers are not a "protected class" as far as anti-discrimination laws.
I don't think they should be a protected class and completely support your right to run your business as you want to. The only thing I ask is you also support others to make their own choices on how they run their business.
I don't think they should be a protected class and completely support your right to run your business as you want to. The only thing I ask is you also support others to make their own choices on how they run their business.
That right there pretty much summarizes my views on this topic!
Is smoking a nasty and unhealthy habit? Yes. Do people have the right to enjoy shared public places without smoke? Sure. Should business owners have the right to ban smoking in their establishments? Absolutely. But if we agree on all of that, why can't we agree business owners should ALSO be free to allow smoking on their property? Dunno.
States legislate all kinds of legal substances and activities. Why should smokers be above regulation? Does tobacco impart some magical angelic quality to smokers that makes them special? 'Cause I gotta tell you, I'm not seeing it. Seriously.
Nobody is suggesting smoking is beyond regualtion. It's merely being suggested you let the owner of the business decide what they want to do.
I've asked this before and haven't gotten an answer, I don't expect one either. If I own a hotel/bar/restaurant and WANT to cater to smokers why should that be illegal?
I've asked this before and haven't gotten an answer, I don't expect one either. If I own a hotel/bar/restaurant and WANT to cater to smokers why should that be illegal?
Because the elected representatives of the state have passed a law making it illegal, having decided that it is in the best interest of the citizens who elected them to do so.
Your option is to elect people who would repeal that law.
Because the elected representatives of the state have passed a law making it illegal, having decided that it is in the best interest of the citizens who elected them to do so.
Your option is to elect people who would repeal that law.
If we had a majority of smokers and created a law that all public places had to allow smoking that would be right in your book? We're going to take this decision out the owners hands and say you cannot have a restaurant/bar/motel that doesn't allow smoking and this would be fine with you because it was passed by elected officials?
See how ridiculous your argument becomes when the shoe is on the other foot. You answer doesn't justify the reason for the law, we can create numerous laws for all kinds of activities the majority doesn't like. People like yourself will one day wake up and realize how wrong you are.
Michigan and Wisconsin have banned smoking in hotels. This happened last year. Jennifer Granholm is an anti-freedom slob and a left wing zealot. It's no wonder that Michigan elected a Republican this time for Governor.
My wife and I recently went on vacation down south. Coming back north we discovered that we couldn't get a smoking room at any hotel in WI or MI.
Why would these states discourage tourism? Tourism is one of Michigan's biggest industries. It's stupid.
If someone smokes in a hotel room -- IT WILL NOT KILL THE FAMILY IN THE NEXT ROOM. Get it Democrats?
Why is it that whenever LIBERALS are in charge ..... AMERICANS lose their FREEDOM?
I've been working in the hotel industry in MI for almost 5 years now, and the no-smoking policy hasn't hurt business one bit. I worked at a hotel that had smoking rooms before the bans, and hotels that have always been smoke-free.
The biggest issue people have with it is that these rooms SMELL BAD and it's hard to rid of that smell when it accumulates. Designating only x amount of smoking rooms doesn't really work when you have to deal with overflow and people have to be given smoking rooms. This is often lost revenue for the hotel because they have to make adjustments to rates and even give the room away for free when smoking is all that's left. Non-smoking hotel rooms are much more in demand.
The hotel I'm at will charge a guest $300 for smoking in a room. That's if there's evidence or a heavy smell. That they'll be charged for smoking is clearly in print on their keypackets. People still smoke in the rooms though. And when they do, the entire hallway will reek like smoke.
We've also had more than one complaint about cigarette smoke coming in through the vents in the bathrooms so yes, the smoke can travel to other rooms.
It costs more to clean these smoking rooms. Housekeepers have to spend more time cleaning a smoking room.
Are there ANY threads here anymore that aren't some sort of attack on "liberals/dems/neocons/repubs/bahblahblah"?
I do agree with those that say it should ultimately be the decision of the business owner.
(And I'm not a Democrat...but am an occassional smoker. I want to smoke, I go outside away from other people)
Last edited by annika08; 12-29-2011 at 03:52 AM..
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I even said I'd use newspaper bedding, and only feed the snake on weekends, but his response was basically "it's just not worth the potential hassle."
