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Old 09-29-2012, 06:51 AM
 
4,738 posts, read 4,434,173 times
Reputation: 2485

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Man exonerated by DNA evidence after 15 years on death row - KSLA News 12 Shreveport, Louisiana News Weather & Sports

The above frightens me to the core. Just stabs me. . .it is the kind of thing I know is happening. How many people like this man went all the way?


In the above it reinforces my simple belief, that Death Penalty is not ethical. I'm not that concerned with cases like James Holmes. I am concerned by the 99% of cases not so easy to determine.
  • Not all murders are self evident and easy to solve
  • not every policeman is just
  • not every interrogation is truthful
  • not every district attorney is righteous, smart, and responsible
  • not every judge is impartial
  • Not every jury appropriately understands, weighs the evidence.
  • Not every defense lawyer is ready to defend their client
  • not every appeal is heard,
  • not every person executed is guilty
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Old 09-29-2012, 07:04 AM
 
Location: Murika
2,526 posts, read 3,004,515 times
Reputation: 1929
I have had my own struggles with the death penalty. However, after years of deliberation, I have come to the conclusion that I support it.

This support, however, comes with a caveat. I do NOT believe that a death sentence is applicable if the person is found guilty on the bases of circumstantial evidence. For me, a case needs to be absolutely self-evident: The perpetrator was caught red-handed, arrested by police on the spot, injured by the victim or by witnesses during the act (and hence, be easily identifiable), caught on camera while committing the crime, etc.

Our justice system reasons that guilt needs to be established beyond a reasonable doubt. If the death penalty is sought, I think the standard should be even higher.
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Old 09-29-2012, 07:13 AM
 
Location: Las Vegas
5,864 posts, read 4,979,129 times
Reputation: 4207
Quote:
Originally Posted by vamos View Post
I have had my own struggles with the death penalty. However, after years of deliberation, I have come to the conclusion that I support it.

This support, however, comes with a caveat. I do NOT believe that a death sentence is applicable if the person is found guilty on the bases of circumstantial evidence. For me, a case needs to be absolutely self-evident: The perpetrator was caught red-handed, arrested by police on the spot, injured by the victim or by witnesses during the act (and hence, be easily identifiable), caught on camera while committing the crime, etc.

Our justice system reasons that guilt needs to be established beyond a reasonable doubt. If the death penalty is sought, I think the standard should be even higher.
I support it in the a similar way to Bill Clinton's abortion mantra, "Safe. Legal. Rare." No electrocutions, no gas chambers, no hangings, etc. I don't think it should be used very often but it should be an option to be pursued at a DA's discretion.
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Old 09-29-2012, 07:23 AM
 
Location: Las Vegas
5,864 posts, read 4,979,129 times
Reputation: 4207
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisFromChicago View Post
Man exonerated by DNA evidence after 15 years on death row - KSLA News 12 Shreveport, Louisiana News Weather & Sports

The above frightens me to the core. Just stabs me. . .it is the kind of thing I know is happening. How many people like this man went all the way?


In the above it reinforces my simple belief, that Death Penalty is not ethical. I'm not that concerned with cases like James Holmes. I am concerned by the 99% of cases not so easy to determine.
  • Not all murders are self evident and easy to solve
  • not every policeman is just
  • not every interrogation is truthful
  • not every district attorney is righteous, smart, and responsible
  • not every judge is impartial
  • Not every jury appropriately understands, weighs the evidence.
  • Not every defense lawyer is ready to defend their client
  • not every appeal is heard,
  • not every person executed is guilty
I'd be a lot more concerned if the death penalty was something that only took a year or two to implement but this man sat on death row for 15 years, which is very common. Also a lot of people get caught up in these kinds of cases thinking everyone who has been "exonerated" is surely innocent. That's not necessarily the case. It sometimes just means that DNA evidence casts enough doubt on their guilt to free them but it doesn't prove that they're actually innocent. Also DNA evidence that is that old is rather unreliable so I'm not really sure what to make of this.
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Old 09-29-2012, 07:28 AM
 
Location: Murika
2,526 posts, read 3,004,515 times
Reputation: 1929
Quote:
Originally Posted by NorthGAbound12 View Post
I'd be a lot more concerned if the death penalty was something that only took a year or two to implement but this man sat on death row for 15 years, which is very common. Also a lot of people get caught up in these kinds of cases thinking everyone who has been "exonerated" is surely innocent. That's not necessarily the case. It sometimes just means that DNA evidence casts enough doubt on their guilt to free them but it doesn't prove that they're actually innocent. Also DNA evidence that is that old is rather unreliable so I'm not really sure what to make of this.
True - but that is the premise of our justice system: Innocent until proven guilty beyond a reasonable doubt. That, by default, does not mean that those who are found innocent are actually not guilty...Only that there is doubt.
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Old 09-29-2012, 07:48 AM
 
Location: Palo Alto
12,149 posts, read 8,417,223 times
Reputation: 4190
Quote:
Originally Posted by vamos View Post
I have had my own struggles with the death penalty. However, after years of deliberation, I have come to the conclusion that I support it.

This support, however, comes with a caveat. I do NOT believe that a death sentence is applicable if the person is found guilty on the bases of circumstantial evidence. For me, a case needs to be absolutely self-evident: The perpetrator was caught red-handed, arrested by police on the spot, injured by the victim or by witnesses during the act (and hence, be easily identifiable), caught on camera while committing the crime, etc.

Our justice system reasons that guilt needs to be established beyond a reasonable doubt. If the death penalty is sought, I think the standard should be even higher.
That's pretty logical and consistent with my thinking.
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Old 09-29-2012, 09:05 AM
 
Location: NJ/NY
10,655 posts, read 18,662,054 times
Reputation: 2829
Look at what happened to the West Memphis 3. It's one of the reasons I cannot support the Death Penalty. I think a life in solitary with no parole is way worse than death anyway
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Old 09-29-2012, 11:34 AM
 
Location: Houston
26,979 posts, read 15,886,908 times
Reputation: 11259
I agree with vamos that there should be a higher standard of guilt.
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Old 09-29-2012, 01:40 PM
 
Location: The Woods
18,358 posts, read 26,493,154 times
Reputation: 11351
Our "justice" system is far too imperfect to ever be trusted with the power to kill.

This person may have been saved from being killed, but he still lost 15 years of his life he can never get back.

I kind of like the system of justice/law the Inuit had in the past.
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Old 09-29-2012, 02:58 PM
 
33,387 posts, read 34,837,332 times
Reputation: 20030
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisFromChicago View Post
Man exonerated by DNA evidence after 15 years on death row - KSLA News 12 Shreveport, Louisiana News Weather & Sports

The above frightens me to the core. Just stabs me. . .it is the kind of thing I know is happening. How many people like this man went all the way?


In the above it reinforces my simple belief, that Death Penalty is not ethical. I'm not that concerned with cases like James Holmes. I am concerned by the 99% of cases not so easy to determine.
  • Not all murders are self evident and easy to solve
  • not every policeman is just
  • not every interrogation is truthful
  • not every district attorney is righteous, smart, and responsible
  • not every judge is impartial
  • Not every jury appropriately understands, weighs the evidence.
  • Not every defense lawyer is ready to defend their client
  • not every appeal is heard,
  • not every person executed is guilty
all good points, and good reason that justice moves slowly, especially in death penalty cases. i do support the death penalty, but i also support giving the person that receives the death penalty enough opportunity to either come up with new evidence that they are not guilty, or that extenuating circumstances would nullify the death penalty.

in the end our justice system isnt perfect, but it is far better than the rest of the world.
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