Worlds view of guns in America. (drug, death, military, terrorists)
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I'd like to offer some insight here, as an American, who ironically, is very interested in moving to Europe and leaving the US for good.
1) I think a good number of our gun related travesties are first and foremost indicative of how badly the US has failed in treating the mentally ill. These people should be identified and cared for BEFORE they can kill others. Instead, they, like most Americans are simply over-medicated and left alone. In fact, some of these medications can actually increase violent intentions! We can thank the ever-powerful drug lobby for that.
2) I posit another explanation for this is in the increasingly anti-social, almost sociopathic change in American culture. Europe far exceeds the US in developing social bonds (at least in my opinion), thus possibly explaining the more violent nature of US culture. We are socialized to win, dominate, and for god's sake BUY...We can thank the corporate lobby for that.
These two factors I believe need to be improved to limit at least some of the violence in the US. These, coupled with the nonsensical war on drugs can explain a strong majority of gun related deaths. Blaming the tools, and not the underlying causes of the violence does nothing to improve the situation.
Now, allow me point 3), why so many Americans love weapons. I am speaking of the law abiding folk who shoot nobody they do not absolutely have to!:
There is a growing sentiment that the US is transitioning to a police state. The founding fathers provided us the with the right to bear arms in an effort to prevent that from ever happening. I know when I talk about the US with my friends in Europe, they are shocked when I tell them about the provisions of the Patriot Act and the NDAA, about the use of militarized police in even routine law enforcement capacities, and in how protesters are treated here. I know of no other civilized country in the world where its own citizens can be whisked away for indefinite periods without due process. So while I understand that these facts will likely not dissuade you from your belief in gun control, I certainly hope you at least can see it from our perspective. Rational, decent US citizens are afraid of what this government has become over the last several years. Combine that with the fact the the Supreme Court even ruled that the police are not responsible for protecting citizens, but for enforcing the law. Who then will protect my family from harm?
Location: In a Galaxy far, far away called Germany
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Our perceived need for guns does seem strange to many in the world, but it isn't really an obsession more so than a historical mistrust of all governments (local, state and federal). Our 2nd Amendment guarantees us the right to bear arms (and that this is essential to a free state). This provision is not just for hunting and an opportunity to defend ourselves against criminals - but also the opportunity to defend ourselves against tyranny from our own government. This is unique to the world. But, our system is inherently mistrustful of government and as time has progressed (with relative peace) we are seeing two camps of people in our nation: those who trust government and those who don't. As a gun owner, I have a deep mistrust of government, but (like most of us) we are law-abiding regardless. The world hears about how guns are used to kill innocent people and not how they have given us the opportunity to defend ourselves (which is what we all want). Most of these killings are by people who get the guns illegally (either stealing them or buying them illegally without the background checks or license). There are those who do kill when they get the firearm legally - but then most of them should have never been allowed if a mental health check was done (I will get to that). The USA needs gun reform (absolutely). We need to close all loopholes in doing background checks and must start doing mental health checks (by law and mandatory) in every instance a firearm is sold/traded/bought. We need to make high quality gun safes and trigger locks mandatory in owning firearms (so that thieves, children, etc., cannot get to them, but if they do - they cannot be fired). Thirdly, and this is really outside of the gun control issue - we need an overhaul of our mental health system. We have been very negligent in that department. As for getting rid of our guns - that will not happen. The police show up to make an investigation into the burglary, crime, or murder and to zip up the body bags. Very rarely can the police be there as the crime is being committed (or before to prevent it) - that means we must have the opportunity to defend ourselves. This is guaranteed to us and we will not give it up. Guns, in the right hands - affords a properly trained individual the opportunity to defend themselves, their loved ones, their community (if not, then the police wouldn't carry them). As a gun owner, I have locks and I am well trained in its use. Most people I know are very careful and are also well trained in their use and safety. The world (and our media) will report only accidents or crimes, but they constitute only a small a small portion of legal gun owners. The vast majority of gun violence are by those who have firearms illegally (whether stolen or bought without a background check). By closing the loopholes, adding mental health checks, and mandatory high quality safes/locks, these measures will go a long way in reducing gun violence thru firearms LEGALLY obtained. It will do nothing about violence done by illegally acquired firearms. All we can do is try to catch them/stop them. More laws will not un-create the firearms. As long as they can be illegally obtained, we must insist on our right to legally obtain them for defence against them and a government that is becoming more intrusive upon our liberty.
Here is a YouTube clip of a woman who was at the Luby's Restaurant shooting (back in the early 80's) near my hometown. She is testifying before a Senate Committee about her ordeal and how her parents were killed. I think it sums up very well, the way many gun owners feel about this.
I moved here to the US last year. People here in general are paranoid, I met some who own more than 5 guns! Statistics show that most of the crimes here was by legal weapons. in my opinion I'm against civilian carrying or owning weapons, anyone can get psychologically screwed and go crazy here!
You guys are viewed as a joke. Which is Australian for "I cannot believe you are serious", not funny ha-ha. We are all "like, duh" and you are all "but it's our right!"
The attitude to guns makes me feel quite angry and sick. It's going to take a few more scores of dead children before the laws even begin to be adequately altered.
Whose kids will they be? Yours?
Our PM John Howard called it "the American Disease". The love of guns.
Dont worry the laws wont be altered one bit my aussie friend. Unlike your country we wont simply roll over and give up our rights so easily.
Location: In a Galaxy far, far away called Germany
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Salsa10
I moved here to the US last year. People here in general are paranoid, I met some who own more than 5 guns! Statistics show that most of the crimes here was by legal weapons. in my opinion I'm against civilian carrying or owning weapons, anyone can get psychologically screwed and go crazy here!
That is very wrong. The #1 reason people are shot in the USA (not including those shot by police) is due to gang violence/street violence. These guns are obtained, mostly illegally. There is a loophole in our background checking system (that needs to be closed) that allows a gun sale to occur without a background check if the firearm is bought from a private seller. Gun shows are a possibility depending on the state. These two loop holes need to be closed - and hopefully will. The USA isn't for everyone. But, for those who can handle it - welcome. But for those coming here - we aren't interested in changing into the country you just left.
As you're aware, there is currently a petition (with just above 75,000 signatories at the time of writing) calling for Piers Morgan to be deported back to the UK following his vocal advocacy of gun restrictions in the USA: Deport British Citizen Piers Morgan for Attacking 2nd Amendment
As noted by one Z/H adherent, Mike Vanderboegh puts the strongest and most succinct case for keeping Piers Morgan in the USA:
Quote:
Much has been made about the petition campaign to deport Piers Morgan. As far as I'm concerned, we need to keep him right where he is, reminding American firearm owners with his outrageous disarmament advocacy just exactly why we had a Lexington and Concord in 1775.
Piers is the best advertisement for citizen disarmament lobby I can think of -- from our point of view. He's ignorant, stupid, wholly uninformed, rude, and so full of himself that in his recent clash with Larry Pratt I actually thought he might explode. He can't fail to alarm and outrage American firearm owners every time he opens his mouth.
Thus, Piers is the best friend we've got in the national media, producing among traditional Americans a universal loathing and solidarity. We may disagree on finer points of liberty, but we all agree that Piers is a disgusting shill for American collectivist tyranny. He's too useful an idiot to send back to England.
As far as I'm concerned, Morgan is a poster-child for Dunning-Kruger ignorance among liberals. He should stay right where he is, and certainly not return to the UK. At least, if the Americans do decide to deport him somewhere, please send him somewhere ... remote. Thanks.
Last edited by Citizen401; 12-26-2012 at 03:04 PM..
You think Americans will need all these guns to some how take out their government through presumably armed insurrection?I shudder to think of the chaotic carnage that would be a consequence.
Dont worry the laws wont be altered one bit my aussie friend. Unlike your country we wont simply roll over and give up our rights so easily.
That is funny. Many Australians used to love guns until the government took most of them away.
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