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View Poll Results: Will Zimmerman be convicted of murder
Convicted 116 40.42%
Acquitted 171 59.58%
Voters: 287. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 06-05-2013, 08:24 PM
 
Location: Long Island
1,147 posts, read 1,899,102 times
Reputation: 438

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Quote:
Originally Posted by golgi1 View Post
In an absolute sense, that is correct (the bolded line). It can never be said, absent a video recording, that anyone knows the exact events of anything that was not witnessed (and even then, witnesses can lie). This is why we are morally bound to rely on evidence for judgment. The evidence supports that Martin initiated the attack (no evidence of Zimmerman punching him - but evidence of Martin punching Zimmerman). As a society, we have a moral obligation to rely on the probability of what the evidence infers to judge a man's life. Otherwise, we have gone astray as a society and only very bad things will result. This racial hustling and ignoring of the evidence is very bad for both race relations and the justice system. Justice can never be emotionally implemented.

It supports that he was winning the flight, not that he started it.

 
Old 06-05-2013, 08:25 PM
 
3,846 posts, read 2,384,804 times
Reputation: 390
Quote:
Originally Posted by golgi1 View Post
You are ignoring the relatively overwhelming evidence that Martin started the fight. I should remind you all that if you were to get into a fight with your neighbor and were winning, even if he started it, you would be the one hauled off to jail because the law generally takes the view that the person doing the beating is the one continuing the violence and likely started the violence. Ask any cop for verification. It's true, and this is what I know from speaking to a lot of cops that I know and not in the context of this case.
Zimmerman was on Martin's property.

Zimmerman trespassed.
 
Old 06-05-2013, 08:26 PM
 
7,300 posts, read 3,397,248 times
Reputation: 4812
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nonarchist View Post
One, acted at all times offensively.

And another, acted at all times defensively.

Your take is offensive to reason, logic and common sense.
First, your syntax is too difficult to parse. I don't understand it. Please write in complete sentences.

Two, given your other posts which I will soon comment on, you are the very last person in this discussion who has authority to judge what constitutes reason, logic, and common sense. Your posts are filled with emotional projection, conjecture, telling people to put a strap on their mouth, and irrational theory. Your last sentence is so laughable that it damns any credibility that you had left.
 
Old 06-05-2013, 08:26 PM
 
Location: LEAVING CD
22,974 posts, read 27,011,790 times
Reputation: 15645
Quote:
Originally Posted by golgi1 View Post
You're the one who began claiming technical details when you claimed that Zimmerman could not have drawn while being straddled by Martin, which is false. You then call a technical rebuttal (by a gun owner) to your technical reasoning "immaterial, irrelevant, and nonsensical". This type of irrational hypocrisy is a large reason why the country is so emotionally split on this case.
Many wouldn't be so irrational or emotionally split if they'd drop the fact that T.M happened to be black and 17.
Make him an adult of the same race as G.Z. and it'd be considered another accident. Add in the two things mentioned above and it suddenly becomes a heinous calculated murder.
 
Old 06-05-2013, 08:27 PM
 
Location: Stasis
15,823 posts, read 12,465,032 times
Reputation: 8599
Quote:
Originally Posted by golgi1 View Post
In an absolute sense, that is correct (the bolded line). It can never be said, absent a video recording, that anyone knows the exact events of anything that was not witnessed (and even then, witnesses can lie). This is why we are morally bound to rely on evidence for judgment. The evidence supports that Martin initiated the attack (no evidence of Zimmerman punching him - but evidence of Martin punching Zimmerman). As a society, we have a moral obligation to rely on the probability of what the evidence infers to judge a man's life. Otherwise, we have gone astray as a society and only very bad things will result. This racial hustling and ignoring of the evidence is very bad for both race relations and the justice system. Justice can never be emotionally implemented.
The probability is that the guy who stalked Martin for two blocks in his car and then chased him into a dark alley tried to detain him until police arrived. The alternative is that Zimmerman was like a dog that doesn't know what to do once it catches the car.
 
Old 06-05-2013, 08:30 PM
 
3,846 posts, read 2,384,804 times
Reputation: 390
Quote:
Originally Posted by katzpaw View Post
The probability is that the guy who stalked Martin for two blocks in his car and then chased him into a dark alley tried to detain him until police arrived. The alternative is that Zimmerman was like a dog that doesn't know what to do once it catches the car.
And, since Trayvon may have told him he had no reason or authority to detain . . .
 
Old 06-05-2013, 08:33 PM
 
Location: Stasis
15,823 posts, read 12,465,032 times
Reputation: 8599
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimj View Post
Many wouldn't be so irrational or emotionally split if they'd drop the fact that T.M happened to be black and 17.
Make him an adult of the same race as G.Z. and it'd be considered another accident. Add in the two things mentioned above and it suddenly becomes a heinous calculated murder.
Zimmerman wouldn't have been following Martin if he was a non-black adult. Zimmerman had a history of reporting 'suspicious' black kids to the police.
 
Old 06-05-2013, 08:33 PM
 
Location: LEAVING CD
22,974 posts, read 27,011,790 times
Reputation: 15645
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nonarchist View Post
And, since Trayvon may have told him he had no reason or authority to detain . . .
Why didn't he "have authority to detain"?
 
Old 06-05-2013, 08:34 PM
 
7,300 posts, read 3,397,248 times
Reputation: 4812
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nonarchist View Post
You're probably right.

I'm more hoping there would be more scrutiny of legally-acceptable brain altering drugs, and more support for self-medicative use of pot.

Remember what kills people?
The drug user, who by his nature and admission prefers to "alter his brain", attempts to admonish me on logic, common sense, and reason as he continues to attempt to keep up in a discussion that by it's nature demands a sober view of reality?!? Maybe smoke some more pot and see if you can't come full circle to the place where you can again judge a murder case dispassionately. This is an example of the person that demands that this country waste it's emotional and fiscal energy, and a serious amount of its racial relations capital on? That is really, really sad.
 
Old 06-05-2013, 08:36 PM
 
Location: LEAVING CD
22,974 posts, read 27,011,790 times
Reputation: 15645
Quote:
Originally Posted by katzpaw View Post
Zimmerman wouldn't have been following Martin if he was a non-black adult. Zimmerman had a history of reporting 'suspicious' black kids to the police.
Wow, someone from the psychic friends phone line is in our midst.
If,if,if. Doesn't it ever get tiring repeating the word "if"?
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