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Old 06-24-2013, 08:29 AM
 
69,368 posts, read 64,182,122 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fiyero View Post
Marriage provides federal benefits, thus it's not a purely state's rights issue. The SCOTUS has already declared marriage a Constitutionally protected right.
Once again, there isnt a dam thing in the Constitution dealing with marriage. The Supreme Court has declared it protected by the Delcaration of Independence pursuit of happiness clause.
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Old 06-24-2013, 08:30 AM
 
Location: Michigan
12,711 posts, read 13,492,467 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mathguy View Post
If they support the laws then states will be allowed to keep making DOMA type laws.

If they strike it down as unconstitutional, then it would make all the state laws regarding such unconstitutional.

In short:

1) States can make own laws.

or

2) Those laws are null and void throughout the US thus you would be able to have US legal gay marriage.
No, there is also 3) States may write their own laws except that they must recognize marriages contracted in other states, as per the U.S. Constitution. That's the one I'm laying my money on.
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Old 06-24-2013, 08:31 AM
 
Location: University City, Philadelphia
22,632 posts, read 14,959,626 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by djacques View Post
If DOMA is struck down, states would have to recognize same-sex marriages that were solemnized in other states. They would not be required to perform same-sex marriage themselves.
Not necessarily.

It depends on whether the Supreme Court issues a "narrow" or "broad" ruling on Windsor V. The United States. The court may decide to rule only that the US Federal Government must recognize legal same-sex marriages in only those states where it has been legalized so far. In other words, Ms. Windsor will get back the approx. $350,000 in tax money she paid when her female spouse died.

If the court issues a very broad ruling - which is not likely - then it will require other states to recognize all same-sex marriages performed in a state where it is legal.

Of course the court may uphold DOMA, but I think that is not likely either.
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Old 06-24-2013, 08:32 AM
 
69,368 posts, read 64,182,122 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by djacques View Post
No, there is also 3) States may write their own laws except that they must recognize marriages contracted in other states, as per the U.S. Constitution. That's the one I'm laying my money on.
Which still means some states will legalize it and if you reside in a state that doesnt, you can simply travel to one for a wedding and get married.. Its still coming now matter how it gets worded.
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Old 06-24-2013, 08:34 AM
 
Location: University City, Philadelphia
22,632 posts, read 14,959,626 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pghquest View Post
its not going to be slapped down. The Supreme Court has long has a position that marriage, is protected by the pursuit of happiness clause in the Declaration of Independence.
The Declaration of Independence is a magnificent and wonderful document - take it from someone who lives within a walking distance from where it was drafted, debated and signed - BUT it has no legal standing whatsoever.
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Old 06-24-2013, 08:36 AM
 
Location: Michigan
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pghquest View Post
Once again, there isnt a dam thing in the Constitution dealing with marriage. The Supreme Court has declared it protected by the Delcaration of Independence pursuit of happiness clause.
The Declaration of Independence is not considered binding law. However, in 1923 the Supreme Court did incorporate the concept "pursuit of happiness" in a decision referring to the due process clause of the 14th Amendment.

Quote:
The problem for our determination is whether the statute as construed and applied unreasonably infringes the liberty guaranteed to the plaintiff in error by the Fourteenth Amendment:
'No state ... shall deprive any person of life, liberty or property without due process of law.'
While this court has not attempted to define with exactness the liberty thus guaranteed, the term has received much consideration and some of the included things have been definitely stated. Without doubt, it denotes not merely freedom from bodily restraint but also the right of the individual to contract, to engage in any of the common occupations of life, to acquire useful knowledge, to marry, establish a home and bring up children, to worship God according to the dictates of his own conscience, and generally to enjoy those privileges long recognized at common law as essential to the orderly pursuit of happiness by free men.
Meyer v. Nebraska
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Old 06-24-2013, 08:38 AM
 
Location: Michigan
12,711 posts, read 13,492,467 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pghquest View Post
Which still means some states will legalize it and if you reside in a state that doesnt, you can simply travel to one for a wedding and get married.. Its still coming now matter how it gets worded.
Absolutely true.
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Old 06-24-2013, 09:31 AM
 
Location: Phila & NYC
4,783 posts, read 3,305,774 times
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Another possibility yet to be mentioned is the Court could simply punt on DOMA and not render a decision. If that happens then it is up to the lower courts. The 1st and 2nd circuit courts have already ruled DOMA unconstitutional. So Federal Marriage Benefits would only be accessible to same sex couples married in those states that fall under the jurisdiction of those circuit courts.
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Old 06-24-2013, 10:30 AM
 
Location: New York City
4,035 posts, read 10,303,251 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jazzy jeff View Post
Another possibility yet to be mentioned is the Court could simply punt on DOMA and not render a decision. If that happens then it is up to the lower courts. The 1st and 2nd circuit courts have already ruled DOMA unconstitutional. So Federal Marriage Benefits would only be accessible to same sex couples married in those states that fall under the jurisdiction of those circuit courts.
The court could punt on Prop. 8, but it’s unlikely on DOMA.

Prop. 8 is a state law so its affect can be limited to California. However piecemeal enforcement of a federal law, like DOMA, would create a mess of litigation and send it right back to the court.
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Old 06-24-2013, 10:59 AM
 
Location: Phila & NYC
4,783 posts, read 3,305,774 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tpk-nyc View Post
The court could punt on Prop. 8, but it’s unlikely on DOMA.

Prop. 8 is a state law so its affect can be limited to California. However piecemeal enforcement of a federal law, like DOMA, would create a mess of litigation and send it right back to the court.
I hope they do strike down DOMA. However even if they do, we are still going to see future litigation. Things like will Fed marriage rights be based upon state of residence or state of celebration, what happens to Fed benefits when a couple moves across state lines where their marriage is not recognized?
From what I have been told, currently the only Federal Marriage laws that are based on place of celebration are Veterans benefits and Immigration sponsorship.
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