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Here are some interesting numbers about bankruptcy... the number one reason (more than half!) for filing is now medical bills and 3/4 of the people had insurance at the beginning of their illness! Most of the people were considered "middle class" and more than 50% owned a home. Who do you think pays the costs for this in the end...
from the article...
"The paradox is that the costliest health system in the world performs so poorly. We waste one-third of every health care dollar on insurance bureaucracy and profits while two million people go bankrupt annually and we leave 45 million uninsured" said Dr. Quentin Young, national coordinator of Physicians for a National Health Program.
"With national health insurance ('Medicare for All'), we could provide comprehensive, lifelong coverage to all Americans for the same amount we are spending now and end the cruelty of ruining families financially when they get sick."
Here are some interesting numbers about bankruptcy... the number one reason (more than half!) for filing is now medical bills and 3/4 of the people had insurance at the beginning of their illness! Most of the people were considered "middle class" and more than 50% owned a home. Who do you think pays the costs for this in the end...
Perhaps I missed it, and if let me apologize - but, I do not find any reponse to my comment / opposition to COMPELLING (read Forcing) people to take your plan -
You support FORCING people into a health care program?
Here are some interesting numbers about bankruptcy... the number one reason (more than half!) for filing is now medical bills and 3/4 of the people had insurance at the beginning of their illness! Most of the people were considered "middle class" and more than 50% owned a home. Who do you think pays the costs for this in the end...
from the article...
"The paradox is that the costliest health system in the world performs so poorly. We waste one-third of every health care dollar on insurance bureaucracy and profits while two million people go bankrupt annually and we leave 45 million uninsured" said Dr. Quentin Young, national coordinator of Physicians for a National Health Program.
"With national health insurance ('Medicare for All'), we could provide comprehensive, lifelong coverage to all Americans for the same amount we are spending now and end the cruelty of ruining families financially when they get sick."
That's right. Most folks think that they are safe from such financial disasters because they have company-paid health insurance. The problem is, if you get seriously sick and can no longer work do you think your company is going to continue to pay your insurance? WRONG! As soon as your sick leave, vacation etc is up the clock starts ticking on your medical coverage. If you are LUCKY your will be eligable for COBRA and therefor ONLY have to pay the full group rate for your health insurance. If your company is paying 90% percent of your premiums and you are currently paying 10%, then you are looking at a 900% increase in the cost of your premiums. For me, that works out to $550/month - at a time when I would be on unemployment or disability - and thus probably already struggling a bit.
And that's the GOOD news. Once the COBRA period expires you'll be forced to pay the full (non-group) rate for your insurance - which will make COBRA seem a bargain (if you can even get it). At that point, unless your've got a LOT of financial resources packed away, you are headed for bankruptcy.
Now of course if you have a working spouse who has good work-sponsored medical coverage that covers you as well, then it's not such a problem. But it you are unmarried, or your spouse doesn't have coverage for you, you're in deep trouble.
Nearly everyone in America is at serious risk for this, they just don't know it until it too late.
well, that all goes back to holding the elected officials ACCOUNTABLE, instead of giving them a blank check... and this applies to all of them, from both parties.
Qualified applicants need not apply
We’re all sick to death of hearing about how tragically unqualified Mike Brown was when hired to lead FEMA. Yes, he was fired from the Arabian Horse job. We get it. But the reason it’s important to keep it in mind is that it fits into a pattern with this administration: when making hiring decisions, these guys just don’t care if you’re qualified.
Matthew Yglesias noted the other day that “this administration, run by a president who seems not particularly interested in policy, has never been big on the idea of qualifications.â€
It’s an important point. From Michael Chertoff, to Alberto Gonzales, to Treasury Secretary John Snow, to Labor Secretary Elaine Chao, to Condoleezza Rice, to HHS Secretary Mike Leavit, the president has surrounded himself with people who have no experience in the areas in which they’ve been placed. It is, Yglesias said, as if “Republicans are so convinced that government is inefficient and full of people who don’t know what they’re doing that it just doesn’t occur to them to do it any other way.â€
more here...
If you are arguing that this is the first administration (or that it will be the last) to exhibit marginal competency, you are mistaken. Think about the Carter White House (a Democratic admininstration). Think about who started the Vietnam war (JFK and Johnson, both Democrats); who ordered Japanese-Americans into internment camps (FDR); who ignored the FIRST World Trade Tower bombing (Clinton). I suggest that you get over your partisan short-sightedness and realize that the opportunies for mischief by politicians are increased manyfold each time another segment of our lives comes under their control.
Perhaps I missed it, and if let me apologize - but, I do not find any reponse to my comment / opposition to COMPELLING (read Forcing) people to take your plan -
You support FORCING people into a health care program?
Actually, yes, I do. Just as we force people to school their children. And we FORCE people that drive cars to have insurance. I think a lot of people are very short sighted when it comes to health care, and think they won't need it. You never know when you will need health care and I know a few people that don't have it, so they kept dragging their feet and did not seek medical help until the problem became MUCH bigger, in the end costing a lot more $$$$$ that they will most likely never pay for, so the cost gets added to our bills. I think EVERYONE should have at least some basic insurance. Growing up in Germany it was that way and as far as I know it never harmed anyone . Most people will complain about whatever system is in place, that is human nature, but when I am in Europe, people are appalled at the number of people without health care in this country. You mentioned earlier that a lot of the people without health care don't have it, because they chose not to. So why should those that are insured and pay their premiums, end up paying for those that chose not to have insurance? I think everyone should contribute to their ability to do so. It will be most interesting to see what happens here in MA in a few years!
Believe me, when I look at the amounts I pay every month for insurance, I would rather spend that money on vacations or gourmet food, but I would be taking a very large risk. The insurance is making PLENTY of money on me and my husband. We are both healthy and don't smoke, don't drink and eat a healthy diet and exercise. We never get what we paid in premiums back in payments. What if someone without insurance is diagnosed with cancer or needs heart surgery. These treatments can cost hundred's of thousands of $$$, who will pay for that? Shall we just let them die?
If you are arguing that this is the first administration (or that it will be the last) to exhibit marginal competency, you are mistaken. Think about the Carter White House (a Democratic admininstration). Think about who started the Vietnam war (JFK and Johnson, both Democrats); who ordered Japanese-Americans into internment camps (FDR); who ignored the FIRST World Trade Tower bombing (Clinton). I suggest that you get over your partisan short-sightedness and realize that the opportunies for mischief by politicians are increased manyfold each time another segment of our lives comes under their control.
please read my post, I said we have to demand accountability from all politicians of BOTH parties. I am bringing up Bush, because he currently occupies the White house.
I don't think I am the one that needs to "get over my partisan short sightedness.
[quote=katzenfreund;1945902]well, that all goes back to holding the elected officials ACCOUNTABLE, instead of giving them a blank check... and this applies to all of them, from both parties.
QUOTE]
Here is my post, in case you have trouble finding it
please read my post, I said we have to demand accountability from all politicians of BOTH parties. I am bringing up Bush, because he currently occupies the White house.
I don't think I am the one that needs to "get over my partisan short sightedness.
Forgive my misreading, then. All your post seemed to contain was references to Bush, and a highly partisan link.
Like I said, this is hardly the first screwball administration. And judging from the woeful choices we will likely have in 2008, it won't be the last: which is all the more reason to be highly skeptical of handing over healthcare to a bunch of liars and cheats.
Actually, yes, I do. Just as we force people to school their children. And we FORCE people that drive cars to have insurance. I think a lot of people are very short sighted when it comes to health care, and think they won't need it.
"Forced to school" our kids? Yes but, who chooses HOW to school them? Public school, private school, religious school, home school -
"Forced to have car insurance" - Yes, in most (not all) states, there is mandatory liability insurance. I have the right though to chose how much insurance, and from what company, and with what deductibles I want.
As for those who can afford, but do not have health insurance - many can afford their medical costs. Then, there are those who have a religious objection to insurance - I would have to assume you would also FORCE these people to go against their religions?
AND, you suggested that while you would FORCE some to have insurance (one size fits all) you would allow others to opt out and get what they want - would you FORCE them to get a certain minimum insurance or, could they choose not to get any at all?
For instance, I opted out of Social Security - I can never get it or medicare - and I'm better off - is this OK with you?
why do you keep harping on the UK system? There are plenty of other models out there, that work quite well. And we could have the option of coming up with our own system. I live in MA, just moved here, it will be interesting to see how the new mandatory insurance bill will work here and what it's consequences will be.
I harp on it because I used it and paid into it for many years. It's the socialized system that I am most familiar with.
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. Most people will complain about whatever system is in place, that is human nature, but when I am in Europe, people are appalled at the number of people without health care in this country. You mentioned earlier that a lot of the people without health care don't have it, because they chose not to. So why should those that are insured and pay their premiums, end up paying for those that chose not to have insurance? I think everyone should contribute to their ability to do so. It will be most interesting to see what happens here in MA in a few years!
