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Costs of services is the problem...not little Billy with no insurance.
I tend to agree with you ... on the "costs of services" comment. For ever so long, spanning decades during which both parties controlled the White House, and houses of Congress, the issue of runaway healthcare costs has remained unaddressed/unresolved. Do physicians, hospitals, pharmaceutical companies and the corporations which profit substantially from these high costs want cost control? I doubt it. "little Billy" is a contributing factor to higher costs when those people fail to care for their health except in cases of emergency when they show-up at a hospital Emregency Room where the cost to provide services is so high.
Well...there really is an important difference between Americans and Europeans in this area. I used to think you needed to have lived in both countries to notice it, but it becomes clearer the more healthcare threads I read:
In America not having health care is a realistic fear. It happens to people, and if you are unlucky or plan poorly, it could happen to you or your dependents.
In Europe it is not a realistic fear. In hundreds of threads, maybe ten thousands of posts, I've never seen a European even contemplate it. Ever. It is like fearing Goblins or Vikings, something people was afraid of in the Dark Ages, but not something of the modern world.
And its all over Americans posts.
That about covers it. Health care is not something people really discuss here in England. They feel sick, they go see their doctor. If seriously ill, they go to the hospital. It is just there..... The level of worry and fear I read in threads like this doesn't exist here. America will do what it wants to do concerning health care. I just wish I didn't read things like 'socialist medicine' and' death panels.' It is done deliberately to frighten people, and is not right. I hope an answer can be found to this somewhere down the line. All I can say to Americans regarding health care in Europe is, don't believe everything you read in newspapers, and see on television. There are people in powerful positions lying to you to ensure things remain the way that suits them, and their agenda.
Yes, when things go wrong within the NHS, it is exposed, and put under scrutiny. As you say, nothing is perfect. The NHS is a massive organisation. But, most of the people working within it, do good work.
I would guess, the best of American health care wouldn't be topped anywhere in the world. But, it seems more and more people can't afford to pay the premiums to receive it. It seems to be a rag bag of different organisations dishing out care. America is obviously a massive country, with many folks living in areas many miles from a large hospital. This is not so in England, so it is a very different situation in the US than here.
But surely, tinkering at the edges isn't working for many Americans. Surely, people in Government with far more knowledge than me, could find a way to give good health care to all Americans, and cheaper than the cost now. It just needs the will and desire to do it. It must seem such a massive task, with so many people making money from the system as it is, that top politicians just give up before they start.
You have, perhaps inadvertently, just highlighted the most crucial benefit of any Universal Healthcare program: the ability to target one entity for improvement that goes across the board, instead of the piecemeal approach of tying to improve the same problem existing in any number of states and insurance schemes one at a time.
The flaws in a countrywide universal system are far easier to track and address.
Well...there really is an important difference between Americans and Europeans in this area. I used to think you needed to have lived in both countries to notice it, but it becomes clearer the more healthcare threads I read:
In America not having health care is a realistic fear. It happens to people, and if you are unlucky or plan poorly, it could happen to you or your dependents.
In Europe it is not a realistic fear. In hundreds of threads, maybe ten thousands of posts, I've never seen a European even contemplate it. Ever. It is like fearing Goblins or Vikings, something people was afraid of in the Dark Ages, but not something of the modern world.
And its all over Americans posts.
So Americans worry about not having healthcare because it does happen. And people who have a health care setup which is working for them are dubious about risking it on the hope that it'll become better for other people.
Fear of medical bankcrupsy exists even if you have insurance, and fear of not being able to afford health insurance keeps many from early retirement. For an early retiree, the cost health insurance can be as much as all other monhly expenses put together (assuming your house is paid off).
Lol! Talk about deflecting!! What does cardiac catheterization in Canada have to do with patient dumping in the US? Anything? Anything at all?
This fail is all yours.
It has to do with the fact that spending less money on healthcare does not equate to healthcare costing less.
When the Canadian government spends less than what healthcare actually costs, people die on waiting lists.
Delay, Denial and Dilution: The Impact of NHS Rationing on Heart Disease and Cancer
IEA Health and Welfare Unit (London)
12% of kidney specialists in the UK said they had refused to treat patients due to limited resources (same source).
One study showed that patients accepted for dialysis stacked up this way.....
65 patients per million population UK
98 patients per million population in Canada
212 patients per million population in the US
That's also proof that spending less does not equal costing less.
Tell us why Canada doesn't have the money to ensure Canadians have access to dialysis treatment.
Quote:
Originally Posted by weltschmerz
Mircea, I hate to break it to you, but 13 doesn't come before 9 and 10.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mircea
So?
I lived in Queen's Park. Whooopty-doo.
You get to be Fail #13.
I'll bet the reason you can't address the issues is that you were a deckhand on the HMS Friday.
Historically...
Mircea
Learn to count. Fail.
Wow.....one has to wonder what kind of dim-witted person cannot make the connection between "13" and the HMS Friday and being a "deckhand" and "Historically..."
Are you going to address the points or continue to deflect?
That is my main problem with ACA. When you allow the government to run your healthcare, you open the door to them telling you what you can and cannot eat or drink, how many hours you must sleep, how many miles you must run...it would be like having an overbearing parent all up in your business. That is not something I am willing to accept. And if they decide how much they are going to spend each year, at the beginning of the year, will they decide who is, and who is not, worth treatment when they are getting low on money? I'm not willing to accept that, either.
Does Medicare, a government run healthcare system, tell seniors that? Where are the seniors who are complaining that a government run health care system tells them how many hours they must sleep or how many miles they must run? There is no doubt in my mind that when you and other Republican talking points here turn 65 you will all RUN to Medicare to take advantage of U.S. government issued health care.
Health care is not something people really discuss here in England.
Well, Brits didn't discuss their murderous colonization program either.
Quote:
Originally Posted by English Dave
You're right, the NHS is paid for out of taxation. The budget for it, including the wages of the 1.7 million people who work within it for 2012/13 was £109 billion (approx $163 billion). This serves a population of just over 60 million people.
Explain how it served these people......
Lung cancer treatment waiting times and tumour growth.
Therefore, 21% of potentially curable patients became incurable on the waiting list.
This study demonstrates that, even for the select minority of patients who have specialist referral and are deemed suitable for potentially curative treatment, the outcome is prejudiced by waiting times that allow tumour progression.
It has to do with the fact that spending less money on healthcare does not equate to healthcare costing less.
When the Canadian government spends less than what healthcare actually costs, people die on waiting lists.
Delay, Denial and Dilution: The Impact of NHS Rationing on Heart Disease and Cancer
IEA Health and Welfare Unit (London)
12% of kidney specialists in the UK said they had refused to treat patients due to limited resources (same source).
One study showed that patients accepted for dialysis stacked up this way.....
65 patients per million population UK
98 patients per million population in Canada
212 patients per million population in the US
That's also proof that spending less does not equal costing less.
Tell us why Canada doesn't have the money to ensure Canadians have access to dialysis treatment.
Wow.....one has to wonder what kind of dim-witted person cannot make the connection between "13" and the HMS Friday and being a "deckhand" and "Historically..."
Are you going to address the points or continue to deflect?
Still waiting....
Mircea
The problem is with what healthcare ACTUALLY costs.
Americans aren't paying what healthcare ACTUALLY costs. We pay more.
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