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People are not equal and they will never be despite the amounts of indoctrination and legislation passed. This doesn't mean people can't get along because they don't have the same cognitive ability, skills, physical strength, and attractiveness, ect. Some people were meant to work at McDonald's, some become managers, doctors, scientists, teachers. Not everyone is capable of doing anything they want to do and nothing will ever change that fact.
You made the following comment on an earlier post:
I disagree, under equal conditions, there will be equal outcomes for different races, with the same variations withing each group of course. The remaining differences between ethnic groups have to do with things like religion. In a country where for instance Islam keeps half the population from getting an education, of course the result for society as a whole will be much worse.
I've skimmed this thread and if there has been an explanation about why the section in bold is likely to be true, I've missed it.
You never implied the section in bold was anything more than a hypothesis, but I don't know why you have that hypothesis. I agree that environmental factors are likely responsible for more than what race someone is a member of...but you seem to believe race has very little to do with any skills (aside from skills related to similar cultural experiences of members of a race), and I do not understand why.
and @red (I don't want to quote your long posts, waste of server space...)
It is my opinion, just like everyone states their opinion here. My opinion comes from my observations. There are no facts, contrary to what some people claim. People like to jump to conclusions, based on small bits and pieces of information or observations taken out of context.
Here for instance there is a considerable Gypsy minority. They are doing clearly worse socioeconomically and academically, not unlike blacks in the US. And they look different from native Portuguese. So one might conclude that they are less intelligent than the Portuguese. Do I think so? Not at all, I think they are just as intelligent. What those statistics don't say for instance is that they have a very different culture, with different values and goals. For instance they don't even try to become a part of regular society, they want to stay outside, they don't give a crap about education, almost all Gypsies end their education with HS graduation (HS is mandatory by law), many drop out even earlier, though. They don't care about their marks as they don't intend to attend college, have careers, etc. Their life is all about family, so they tend to get married at 15 or 16 and have kids as early as possible.
Regarding the word equal, it is not a synonym for identical or same. Equal refers to value, not expression, form, color, etc.
Indeed, while of course individuals are very different from each other with extremes on both ends no matter what the aspect, entire populations are more or less equal whereby 'more or less' depends on the sample size. The larger, the more equal. Thus with entire ethnic groups, the stupid and the geniuses cancel each other out, and that goes for all ethnic groups. The genetic potential of ethnic groups as a whole is more or less the same, that is my opinion, indeed. That is not the same as saying ethnic groups are the same, or individuals are the same.
Why do I think so? Mere logic for instance. The most ancient humans still alive are the San/Bushmen. From ancient people genetically very close to them all modern HSS are derived. Some people keep saying, there was natural selection for intelligence because people up north had a harder life. I don't share that view at all, life in the desert, jungle, etc. is just as challenging. Those people are intelligent and always have been, and since there was no selection for stupidity, why should people's average IQ have decreased over time? To the contrary, the San have a very complex language, and since they have a huge oral tradition, which is good for the brain as well.
Some people keep saying that people up north have invented agriculture etc., but when you look closer, you will notice that most Europeans and Asians never invent anything in their lives. Very few individuals have invented something and the overwhelming majority of people have just adopted it. A lot of knowledge has spread via writing, which is why some regions have a cultural lead. I bet as soon as Internet access becomes as common in Africa as it is in Europe or Japan, Africans will catch up very fast. One can already see the difference in Angola, where there is a very urban, sophisticated black population in Luanda that is very far ahead of the rest of the country. That change happened within just one generation, much too short for any genetic change.
Conversely, most of those 1.4 billion or so Chinese will never invent anything, they will never be anything special.
Another aspect that shows the weight of culture is that there are differences in the way different black populations are doing for instance in the US, i.e. traditional AA's (many of whom are even mixed-race), Caribbean and African immigrants (both usually not mixed-race).
Also, the fact that there are utterly intelligent black people shows that they have what it takes. Those are not some isolated IQ freaks with sudden mutations. Instead for some reason they simply manage to tap their potentials better than others.
Children with Downs Syndrome who are brought up in a home with their families usually have far more intellectual potential than those who are institutionalized.
There are far too many variables when it comes to intelligience. Mother's use of drugs and alcohol while pregnant, prenatal nutrition, infant stimulation, early childhood environment. A child left alone as an infant for hours in a quiet room won't do as well one who kept busy and involved with other family members.
Look at fetal alcohol syndrome. Prenatal hypertension of the mother can lead to low birth rate of the baby. And there are lead levels that you'd need to factor in.
And you'd have to actually define race with dna testing, I suppose you could eliminate all mixed ancestry people from the studies but since most people, especially blacks and hispanics are actually mixed ancestry, and socially the one-drop rule is still how people define race, what good would the studies do?
Excellent post. There is a failure of culture and mentoring in the black community these days. There is not a lack of intelligence. Every baby born of a health mother has the same chance of being a genius or an idiot regardless of race. The way God meant it to be.
That's one of the most absurd statements I've ever heard. You are born with a set IQ, it doesn't really change at all as we age, obtain knowledge etc.
I disagree, IQ does change. Each individual is born with a certain IQ potential range. Some factors such as malnutrition during childhood and education can reduce or increase intelligence forever, others like long holidays reduce it temporarily.
Cultures or subcultures that demand excellence in scholarship will generally produce individuals who do better on academics than others who don't.
Cultures or subcultures that demonize excellence in scholarship will generally produce individuals who do horribly on academics than others who don't.
Cultures in the middle will produce a more even distribution of individuals from one end of the spectrum to the other.
Since cultures that demonize scholarship are low on a lot of other socioeconomic indicators, I don't think dragging people down to boost the self esteem of the lowest of the low denominators is the best way to go.
Failing people and having them go to summer school or get left back is not the most horrible thing to do to them.
That's one of the most absurd statements I've ever heard. You are born with a set IQ, it doesn't really change at all as we age, obtain knowledge etc.
Nope:
Yes, your IQ can change over time. But [IQ] tests give you the same answer to a very substantial extent, even over a period of year. The older you are, the more stable your test score will be. The most volatility in IQ scores is in childhood, mostly in adolescence. Offhand I can't think of a reason why it would be, it just seems to be the case. 5 Experts Answer: Can Your IQ Change? | Intelligence Tests & IQ Scores | LiveScience
Our IQ or intelligence quotient is still reaching its peak in childhood because we are developing cognitively. Whatever IQ we've obtained by our mid-teen years is pretty much the IQ we'll have through the rest of our lives. Does Our IQ Change? | eHow
People are not equal and they will never be despite the amounts of indoctrination and legislation passed. This doesn't mean people can't get along because they don't have the same cognitive ability, skills, physical strength, and attractiveness, ect. Some people were meant to work at McDonald's, some become managers, doctors, scientists, teachers. Not everyone is capable of doing anything they want to do and nothing will ever change that fact.
And of course you would assign the best jobs and advantages in life to those who are the "highest" in cognitive ability, skills, attractiveness, etc., who of course are white. We've been through this racist bs before.
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