Turkish PM: Muslims discovered America, not Columbus (conspiracy, Obama, claim)

[Huckleberry3911948]

if that were so, we would have many slaves and our jails would be empty and so would our court docket.

[chuckmann]

Originally Posted by nickerman

Didn't Europeans discover Turkey before the Turks?

Actually they did. The Seljuks and later the Ottomans were insignificant little tribes roaming around out in the boonies when the Greeks and later the Romans ruled what is now Istanbul and both sides of the Bosporus.

[Protege]

Originally Posted by RecentlyMoved

good grief. a youtube video will surely put into question documented historical facts.

as for my anti Turkey posts - it's called news. maybe someone should tell them to start acting like civilized humans

That YouTube video explains the reason behind the relocation orders. As many as 200,000 Armenians took up arms against the Ottoman Empire both to sabotage its defense efforts while also joining the invading Russian army. That's more than the number of troops the US has ever had in the recent Iraq War.

Over half a million Ottoman Muslims were killed by Armenians and Russians and there are records for these people. Most Armenians died from starvation and disease, the same factors that killed most of the nearly 3 million Ottoman Muslim deaths during WWI. This is because the Entente Powers placed a blockade on the already bankrupt Ottoman Empire.

[Vacationmacation]

Originally Posted by Protege

That YouTube video explains the reason behind the relocation orders. As many as 200,000 Armenians took up arms against the Ottoman Empire both to sabotage its defense efforts while also joining the invading Russian army. That's more than the number of troops the US has ever had in the recent Iraq War.

Over half a million Ottoman Muslims were killed by Armenians and Russians and there are records for these people. Most Armenians died from starvation and disease, the same factors that killed most of the nearly 3 million Ottoman Muslim deaths during WWI. This is because the Entente Powers placed a blockade on the already bankrupt Ottoman Empire.

Completely inaccurate....

[chuckmann]

Originally Posted by chicagogeorge

Erdogan has been smoking too much of that Turkish hashish.....


And actually stone age Europeans might have arrived here before the Amerindians


Stone-age Europeans 'were the first to set foot on North America' - Telegraph

There is evidence, albeit disputed, that the earliest signs of human habiation in the Americas dates back some 40 thousand years.

[Mircea]

Originally Posted by RecentlyMoved

Soon we'll be hearing how the US is occupied Islamic land

You should file a claim against your moving company. Have them go back to your old residence and look for your intelligence, because apparently it got left behind.

Originally Posted by Old Gringo

From the link:

"Contacts between Latin America and Islam date back to the 12th century. Muslims discovered America in 1178, not Christopher Columbus," the conservative president said in a televised speech during an Istanbul summit of Muslim leaders from Latin America.

conservatives...

Always on the wrong side of history.

Originally Posted by victimofGM

While I believe it possible muslim explorers made it to North America, the author needs to provide real proof. We have physical proof Vikings and Columbus made it here. Pre-Islamic Egyptians may have also made it to North America as evidenced by the tobacco used in mummification. What physical proof is there that Muslims set foot on North America prior to Columbus?

Originally Posted by T-310

And the Vikings beat Muslims (if they even came here) them by several hundred years.

There is no physical evidence to suggest Muslims founded the New World.

Originally Posted by Enigma777

How does anyone discover a land that is already occupied by human beings?

Originally Posted by chicagogeorge

Erdogan has been smoking too much of that Turkish hashish....

For the sake of the uneducated and uninformed, there is evidence, and the Turkish PM's comments are reasonable in light of that evidence.

Admiral Piri Re'is had a map showing the east and west coasts of North and South America, plus the Antarctic (which wasn't allegedly discovered until 1820 by the British).

It's known that Re'is and Cristobal Colon had met on more than one occasion. Some of the evidence also points to Re'is --- as a young naval officer -- serving aboard Colon's ships at various times.

The notations on Admiral Re'is' map are an old Turkish dialect and depending on how translated, says that Colon had a copy of the map, or had seen the map. There is no doubt that Colon knew exactly where he was going.

It isn't possible for Colon to discover something that someone else had already mapped.

Everybody grow up and get over it already.

Re'is wrote he got the map from another Turkish naval officer, who had acquired it from a Persian.

I seriously doubt it was a Persian. Most likely, it was an ethnic Greek from the Seleucid Empire.

Anyway, that map shows the correct geographic locations for mountains, rivers and lakes in Antarctica.

Note that in US schools up through 1958 it was taught that mountains on Antarctica were an impossibility due to the glaciers.

American myths were shattered again in the 1990s when space shuttle missions using ground-penetrating radar proved the existence of rivers and lakes.

Originally Posted by chicagogeorge

And actually stone age Europeans might have arrived here before the Amerindians

That's what the evidence shows.

Originally Posted by Erobrer

weird, I always thought the Native Americans first discovered the Americas long before Islam ever existed.

Originally Posted by caribdoll

The Amerindians were here before Columbus, period.

I guess you thought wrong. The oldest known skeleton in the Americas is that of a Negroid woman circa 25,000 BCE. She was found in a cave system in Brasil. Her DNA is too deteriorated for extensive testing, so one can only guess that she came from West Africa or more likely from Micronesia/Melanesia.

When you consider that Melanesians had settlements in what is now Chile on the South American west coast, she is probably originally from Australia/Indonesia.

Originally Posted by muleskinner

All kidding aside,I honestly do not think we will ever really know who was here first..Rune stones that pre-date Columbus have been found etc etc..

Damn near everyone was here before he was.

Originally Posted by RecentlyMoved

the Armenian genocide is not up for debate, or your opinion. it is a matter of historical fact.

No, it is not.

Originally Posted by Vacationmacation

^^ Approximately 1.5 million Armenians, Assyrians and Pontac Greeks were killed during WWI.

How many Germans, French, and others were killed?

Originally Posted by Vacationmacation

Discussing about a historical event does not make one hate that country. It's good to teach and learn so that it won't be repeated.

Good...then you can discuss the decision of Winston Churchill to cancel an order of naval ships for the Ottoman Empire, which led the Ottomans to side with the Axis Powers.

Originally Posted by RecentlyMoved

- it's called news. maybe someone should tell them to start acting like civilized humans

Maybe you should stop interfering in the political, social and economic affairs of Turkey.

Originally Posted by Protege

That YouTube video explains the reason behind the relocation orders. As many as 200,000 Armenians took up arms against the Ottoman Empire both to sabotage its defense efforts while also joining the invading Russian army. That's more than the number of troops the US has ever had in the recent Iraq War.

Over half a million Ottoman Muslims were killed by Armenians and Russians and there are records for these people. Most Armenians died from starvation and disease, the same factors that killed most of the nearly 3 million Ottoman Muslim deaths during WWI. This is because the Entente Powers placed a blockade on the already bankrupt Ottoman Empire.

Cool....now we can discuss the stupidity of the Brits and their goading the Greeks to invade Turkey and the ill-fated results of that.

Well, never mind......we'd both be talking over everyone's heads and that just isn't fair.

Mapping.....

Mircea

[djacques]

The Armenian genocide was better known and documented at the time it was happening (including by Americans when we were a neutral country; we never actually did declare war on the Ottoman Empire, and we had diplomatic relations with them until April 23, 1917) than the Jewish holocaust while it was happening.

Obviously that doesn't justify jibes 100 years later about "acting like civilized humans" and so on. And of course there were security concerns about the Armenians being a pro-Russian phalanx on the country's frontier. But that doesn't alter the fact that genocide, or an attempt at such, occurred.

[Protege]

Originally Posted by Vacationmacation

Completely inaccurate....

Armenian revolutionary leaders such as Boghos Nubar, Hovhannes Katchaznouni, and Garegin Pastermadjian all admit unequivocally that there were 200,000 Armenians who fought against the Ottoman Empire alongside the invading Russian army from the outset of WWI in 1914, 8 months prior to the relocation orders of 1915. Boghos Nubar at the Paris Peace Conference specifically stated 200,000 belligerents de facto.

The Ottoman Muslim civilians who were killed by Ottoman Armenians are not only identified by name and city (From the time of the Turkish War of Independence), there are also mass graves, reports, photographs, etc. They're known to be Muslims due to their clothing, miniature Korans, and other Islamic items.

[Supachai]

Originally Posted by TheHurricaneKid

I read somewhere that Africans were trading with Americans before the Spanish and the American people. Not to mention the fact that Natives came from Asia/Siberia.

There's not much evidence that exists to suggest that Africans came to the Americas, but the evidence points mainly to Phoenicians, who aren't really Africans anyway. It's claimed that a group of Phoenicians and Celts came to South America and sailed up the Amazon after they escaped the sacking of Carthage by Rome.

[Erobrer]

Originally Posted by Mircea

I guess you thought wrong. The oldest known skeleton in the Americas is that of a Negroid woman circa 25,000 BCE. She was found in a cave system in Brasil. Her DNA is too deteriorated for extensive testing, so one can only guess that she came from West Africa or more likely from Micronesia/Melanesia.

When you consider that Melanesians had settlements in what is now Chile on the South American west coast, she is probably originally from Australia/Indonesia.
Mircea

Do you have a source for your claim?