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Over 100 posts in this thread and so far nobody has fully identified the root problem. When the root problem is correctly identified, I believe the correct solution is easy to discern. Unfortunately, the correct solution is politically unacceptable, which is why politicians eventually find it easier to accept minimum wage increases.
I believe people these days are protesting for a $15/hr minimum wage - or for higher minimum wages generally - because a critical mass has emerged of adults actually trying to live on minimum wage. Initially, minimum wage was intended for marginalized minorities - the original minimum wage legislation is actually an artifact of our racist past - and with the decline of Jim Crow, teenagers and 'secondary' earners (e.g. seniors choosing to work part time, and stay-at-home moms who went to work part-time once their kids started school) took up minimum wage work.
In 2012, 48.5 percent of minimum wage workers were 25 or older - that proportion surely is higher today and quite possibly over 50 percent.
Someone in this thread did mention that minimum wage workers today are largely adults. But they missed the other element of today's problem.
Simply put, rents today are too damn high. Personal finance geeks and policy wonks recommend paying no more than 30% of your income for housing, but today 11 million renters spend at least half their income on shelter. This is unsustainable long-term.
People are protesting for a $15 minimum wage because they are having difficulty paying the rent, and because paying today's high rents is unsustainable for many.
Building an adequate supply of housing for low-wage workers would cool off most of the protesters. but high regulation, land prices and development fees make it unprofitable to build housing that low-wage workers can afford. NIMBY-minded homeowners make it politically unacceptable for municipalities to encourage opr allow affordable new development. Since expanding supply if politically unacceptable, elected officials find it easier politically to increase minimum wage. Since increasing minimum wage does not resolve the housing shortage, political pressure for higher minimum wages will continue indefinitely - the problem will never be solved in the foreseeable future.
Are the "takers" in society such as yourself going to pay for this housing? Of course not. You expect everyone else to do it. Raising minimum wage only raises the cost of everything in addition to decreasing employment and advancement opportunities for those trying (not you..you aren't trying) to climb upwards. Raising the minimum wage at the fast food places is just going to result in increasing automation and soon (now in some areas) you will go in and order off an iPad type of device and pick up your burger. There will be way less actual people working in the fast food shop. You get what you ask for.
Are the "takers" in society such as yourself going to pay for this housing? Of course not. You expect everyone else to do it. Raising minimum wage only raises the cost of everything in addition to decreasing employment and advancement opportunities for those trying (not you..you aren't trying) to climb upwards. Raising the minimum wage at the fast food places is just going to result in increasing automation and soon (now in some areas) you will go in and order off an iPad type of device and pick up your burger. There will be way less actual people working in the fast food shop. You get what you ask for.
All I ask in housing is a tiny house on a tiny piece of land, which at current prices and interest rates should cost no more than THE RENT I AM CURRENTLY PAYING.
People who today are paying way too much to rent could actually afford to own downsized housing. Where did you get the idea they're not going to pay for it when they are already paying even more?
So yes, I would be willing to pay for it and have demonstrated the capacity to pay for it.
That's another thing and they don't sell many $3.99 Big Macs. I'm sure most people do what I do and go for the two Jr Whoppers and two fries for $4.99....
Even if were to assume 4.4% increase on a $3.99 Big Mac what that implies is 95.6% is profits and other coststhat will rise. Last I checked the profit margin at Mcdoanld's is extremely slim because they rely on volume.
What many who have never been in the food business don't understand is margins,food costs,labor costs and lastly profits and how SLIM that profit margin really is. I guess the people putting their money and financial lives at risk should make the same or less than the person flipping the burgers.
People always use McDonalds,Burger King etc as examples of huge evil employers but fail to understand that very few of these restaurants are corporate owned. Most are franchisees who operate on a slim margin, have to basically give away food when the corporation dictates it ($1 menu) and still feed their own families and make owning the place worth all the work and investment they've put in.
Then you get "well, they can raise prices or, it will only raise prices .20-.50 cents. Well, customers may not be willing to pay that in a volume that will allow them to remain profitable.
Then add in all those down the supply line that will have to have raises and the wholesale cost of goods shoots up as well.
Some can't see the forest for the trees or aren't willing to look beyond their own noses.
I don't get it. The same people arguing against raising the minimum wage for low skill workers at fast food or retail jobs because those workers don't deserve it, argue that low skill high-wage manufacturing jobs should come back (though they are basically vanishing anyhow and without unions--good luck on those high wages).
As far as immigrants taking needed jobs--that is absolute bull. There is a nursing shortage. Plenty of jobs in businesses catering to the growing elderly population.
Nursing homes cannot get Americans to work as aides, so everyone working in them are foreign born.
What many who have never been in the food business don't understand is margins,food costs,labor costs and lastly profits and how SLIM that profit margin really is. I guess the people putting their money and financial lives at risk should make the same or less than the person flipping the burgers.
People always use McDonalds,Burger King etc as examples of huge evil employers but fail to understand that very few of these restaurants are corporate owned. Most are franchisees who operate on a slim margin, have to basically give away food when the corporation dictates it ($1 menu) and still feed their own families and make owning the place worth all the work and investment they've put in.
Then you get "well, they can raise prices or, it will only raise prices .20-.50 cents. Well, customers may not be willing to pay that in a volume that will allow them to remain profitable.
Then add in all those down the supply line that will have to have raises and the wholesale cost of goods shoots up as well.
Some can't see the forest for the trees or aren't willing to look beyond their own noses.
The main customer for these businesses are those on the lower scale. An increase in Minimum wage results in more spending and more movement through the entire economy. It leads to higher wages and some inflation.
My first full time job was in the service area and the only time I received a raise was when Minimum went up. Back then minimum was around $1.85/hour. The price of gas was around .20/ gallon. Base that and minimum should be around $18.00/hr. Oil and gas control the economy more then any other cost or commodity.
That's another thing and they don't sell many $3.99 Big Macs.
What are you talking about? The study didnt mention McDonald's or Big Macs at all. I just used a $3.99 Big Mac as an example of the price increase.
Furthermore, the study did include wage raises for other workers as well. What it didnt include was the increased demand as a result of higher pay for workers who spend all their money in good ol' America (unlike the rich who spend alot abroad or dont spend). In addition, the study didnt include the fact that higher pay leads to less turnover which reduces costs for businesses.
the manufacturing jobs for the most part went to asia.
us is a service based economy.
the average us wage isn't even 15.00 an hour.
the majority of people, including the majority on this forum live paycheck to paycheck.
That's because Asia is now in their own industrialization era, just like we had ours.
To compete, we need people to not "manufacture" stuff, we need people to DESIGN. STEM rings the bell the most... we need more people in science and engineering. It's easy to outsource people when the job is to put together something someone has already designed. It's not easy to outsource the actual designer, that's where the creative and technical juices come together and is not easily replicated.
Furthermore, the study did include wage raises for other workers as well.
Oh really? I want you to cite in that study where the increased labor costs for the guy driving the truck, the mechanic fixing the truck, the cashier at the gas station, the field hand, the meat processing plant worker, the guy at the paper mill, the guy at the plastics factory, the person painting the lines in the parking lot and the guy sweeping the floor at the fryer plant were accounted for.
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In addition, the study didnt include the fact that higher pay leads to less turnover which reduces costs for businesses.
There is not a whole lot training involved with teaching someone to squirt ketchup onto a burger, hence the reason they are making $7.50 to begin with. Workers with higher wages make higher wages in part because they have skills the employer wants to retain.
Oh really? I want you to cite in that study where the increased labor costs for the guy driving the truck, the mechanic fixing the truck, the cashier at the gas station, the field hand, the meat processing plant worker, the guy at the paper mill, the guy at the plastics factory, the person painting the lines in the parking lot and the guy sweeping the floor at the fryer plant were accounted for.
There is not a whole lot training involved with teaching someone to squirt ketchup onto a burger, hence the reason they are making $7.50 to begin with. Workers with higher wages make higher wages in part because they have skills the employer wants to retain.
You havent read the study at all. The whole point is that labor costs are a SMALL share of overall costs and as the minimum wage increases, and the bargaining power of all workers among the bottom 30% increase, the price inflation would be minimal.
Regarding turnover, its not only training but the actual hiring process as well. It all adds up to decreased costs for businesses. Same with much higher demand as a result of workers who spend their money in America getting a bigger paycheck.
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