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Old 05-02-2018, 12:34 AM
 
23,654 posts, read 17,543,106 times
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Are others starting be think California is owned by the drug cartels or am I the only one?

I can't explain why the politicians put up with this dangerous stuff, there has to be a reason. It's usually follow the money.
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Old 05-02-2018, 05:50 AM
 
19,721 posts, read 12,293,256 times
Reputation: 26556
Quote:
Originally Posted by rstevens62 View Post
Our leaders have caused this mess!! LOL

Overdoes and opioid related deaths were much lower in the days before DEA cracked down on doctors and pill mill offices, all those former pill addicts are now heroin addicts, thats why OD and deaths continue to skyrocket every single year. It was safer for addicts to abuse opioid pills, versus street heroin, which could have anything laced in to add weight.

If you really look at whats happening here, its fairly easy to recognize whats going on.
You can't have licensed doctors being drug dealers. The doctor has the responsibility to stop giving drugs to those who abuse them. Pill mills were just dealing opiates to people who would resell them in other places. Something had to be done.
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Old 05-02-2018, 06:29 AM
 
Location: Home, Home on the Front Range
25,826 posts, read 20,740,542 times
Reputation: 14818
Quote:
Originally Posted by moneill View Post
So Anthony Bourdain just did a show about West Virginia -- those folks are concerned with the alcohol and drug problem in their community.

They say it is the most difficult thing to see it so openly in their community.

Ugliness is everywhere -- it is sad.

But to think it only happens in big cities is a little naive.

Or only in big liberal cities.

I suspect it isn't just the liberals who have substance abuse problems.
Speaking of West Virginia, I read this today:

“Last fall, after watching the death toll from opioids climb unchecked for years, Dr. Rahul Gupta, the man in charge of combating one of the worst health crises in America, decided to do something no one had ever tried. He ordered his staff to do an in-depth analysis of every person in his state who had died of a drug overdose over the preceding year—all 887 of them.”

https://www.politico.com/magazine/st...olution-218118

According to the article, WV has the highest opiate overdose death rate in the country.
This doctor’s approach has apparently stemmed the tide a bit.
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Old 05-02-2018, 08:55 AM
 
28,122 posts, read 12,651,249 times
Reputation: 15342
Quote:
Originally Posted by tamajane View Post
You can't have licensed doctors being drug dealers. The doctor has the responsibility to stop giving drugs to those who abuse them. Pill mills were just dealing opiates to people who would resell them in other places. Something had to be done.
Have to consider safety and security too, if this law pushes all the addicts to street heroin and overdose and deaths continue to skyrocket...well, what good was it to crackdown on pill mills and doctors handing out scripts? LOL

And if doctors are required to give appropriate level of care, well, cutting someone off from legal legitimate opioids and forcing them to buy something off the street ( a MUCH more dangerous situation), is that really the safest treatment? If they are going to abuse a drug, lets at least make sure its a drug they can be sure of what it is and whats in it, and not something made in barn!

If they did this for safety reasons, like they claim, then they have failed miserably, and in the process made the cartels billions of more dollars and 100s of 1000s of lifetime customers.
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Old 05-02-2018, 08:57 AM
 
Location: Chicago
937 posts, read 929,352 times
Reputation: 531
Quote:
Originally Posted by jm1982 View Post
This is what you get when you have “tolerant “ liberal policies . They tolerate stuff like this .
And it’s destroys quality of life for decent people .

—-

Junkies have been filmed openly shooting up in a San Francisco subway station amid piles of vomit and unconscious bodies.

Commuter Shannon Gafford recorded the disturbing video at the Civic Center BART station, saying he sees the same thing every day.

Posting his video to Facebook, Gafford wrote: 'Someone needs to clean this up. Every morning, every day, it's the same thing.

'Junkies shooting up and making Bart the most pleasant experience ever! I walk the Civic Center Station everyday and not once has this changed.

'Does someone need to be hurt first ? I've posted several of these videos and sent it to #BartSF #BartPoliceDepartment and nothing.'

Shocking footage shows junkies taking over San Francisco BART station | Daily Mail Online
You know what else destroys quality of life for decent people?

Trying to have a casual conversation about gas prices being high on a hot summer day with a Conservative.
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Old 05-02-2018, 08:59 AM
 
28,122 posts, read 12,651,249 times
Reputation: 15342
Quote:
Originally Posted by TigerLily24 View Post
Speaking of West Virginia, I read this today:

“Last fall, after watching the death toll from opioids climb unchecked for years, Dr. Rahul Gupta, the man in charge of combating one of the worst health crises in America, decided to do something no one had ever tried. He ordered his staff to do an in-depth analysis of every person in his state who had died of a drug overdose over the preceding year—all 887 of them.”

https://www.politico.com/magazine/st...olution-218118

According to the article, WV has the highest opiate overdose death rate in the country.
This doctor’s approach has apparently stemmed the tide a bit.
I cannot believe they are still throwing money at law enforcement to fight this, considering that they have failed year after year to get a handle on this, how long do you keep spending money on something history proves does not work at all? Did prohibition on alcohol teach them nothing? LOL
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Old 05-02-2018, 09:02 AM
 
27,307 posts, read 16,257,687 times
Reputation: 12102
Anybody traveling to SFO download the crap map to avoid the steaming piles of crap left on the sidewalks.
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Old 05-02-2018, 09:07 AM
 
10,920 posts, read 6,926,121 times
Reputation: 4942
The biggest issue with SF homeless (chronic drug-using homeless) is that they're concentrated in an area of the City that now gets many visitors.

You're more aware of the existence of these people if you're casually visiting SF.

You won't notice homeless in the majority of the neighborhoods of the City.

Homelessness is certainly an issue. But the naivety of some people here that seem to be implying that homelessness and drug addiction are a SF thing is very embarrassing. Every single large city struggles with this problem. Just in different ways. Most cities are very good about hiding it... But it's there, under the surface.

"Cleaning" up just means moving those people somewhere else. Rarely are the underlying causes of the homelessness or drug addiction solved in the process.

This is a very complicated issue, and no one in SF likes it. If you actually think they do, you know nothing about this city.
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Old 05-02-2018, 09:34 AM
 
19,721 posts, read 12,293,256 times
Reputation: 26556
Quote:
Originally Posted by rstevens62 View Post
Have to consider safety and security too, if this law pushes all the addicts to street heroin and overdose and deaths continue to skyrocket...well, what good was it to crackdown on pill mills and doctors handing out scripts? LOL

And if doctors are required to give appropriate level of care, well, cutting someone off from legal legitimate opioids and forcing them to buy something off the street ( a MUCH more dangerous situation), is that really the safest treatment? If they are going to abuse a drug, lets at least make sure its a drug they can be sure of what it is and whats in it, and not something made in barn!

If they did this for safety reasons, like they claim, then they have failed miserably, and in the process made the cartels billions of more dollars and 100s of 1000s of lifetime customers.
Pill mills weren't treating patients, they were providing drugs to a middleman to be sold illegally elsewhere. They drove hundreds of miles to Florida to obtain their goods from the source.

This reasoning sounds like the old-- "if the kids are going to do it be safe and do it under my roof" mentality of bad parents. No, you can't drink, take drugs or have sex in my house. No I will not enable your irresponsible behavior.

When addicts can no longer depend on a medical source, then it is decision time. No one is "forced" to keep using. They can pursue rehab which is being funded, or they can hit the street fentanyl express. People do quit, if they want to. There are drugs used in rehab to help them feel better. Too bad so many will not take the initiative to help themselves.

But doctors cannot be handing out opiates like candy because someone asked. Fewer patients getting it easily for minor injuries means fewer new addicts. If addicts start out on recreational street heroin, just to try it for fun, it is only their fault.
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Old 05-02-2018, 02:28 PM
 
Location: Home, Home on the Front Range
25,826 posts, read 20,740,542 times
Reputation: 14818
Quote:
Originally Posted by tamajane View Post
Pill mills weren't treating patients, they were providing drugs to a middleman to be sold illegally elsewhere. They drove hundreds of miles to Florida to obtain their goods from the source.

This reasoning sounds like the old-- "if the kids are going to do it be safe and do it under my roof" mentality of bad parents. No, you can't drink, take drugs or have sex in my house. No I will not enable your irresponsible behavior.

When addicts can no longer depend on a medical source, then it is decision time. No one is "forced" to keep using. They can pursue rehab which is being funded, or they can hit the street fentanyl express. People do quit, if they want to. There are drugs used in rehab to help them feel better. Too bad so many will not take the initiative to help themselves.

But doctors cannot be handing out opiates like candy because someone asked. Fewer patients getting it easily for minor injuries means fewer new addicts. If addicts start out on recreational street heroin, just to try it for fun, it is only their fault.
This, exactly.

Doctors get incentives to prescribe opiates. They don't have to prescribe them as apparently the argument that nothing else works as well is bogus, but their bottom lines would suffer if they didn't.


"As tens of thousands of Americans die from prescription opioid overdoses each year, an exclusive analysis by CNN and researchers at Harvard University found that opioid manufacturers are paying physicians huge sums of money -- and the more opioids a doctor prescribes, the more money he or she makes."

https://www.cnn.com/2018/03/11/healt...ise/index.html


"Emergency rooms are where many patients are first introduced to powerful opioid painkillers, but what if doctors offered over-the-counter pills instead? A new study tested that approach on patients with broken bones and sprains and found pain relievers sold as Tylenol and Motrin worked as well as opioids at reducing severe pain."

https://www.apnews.com/c8a5e43be7754...in-ER-patients
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