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Doing drugs that destroy your mind and body doesn’t make you free; it enslaves you and makes you weak. That’s why blue state governments and even some red states like the idea.
Lol. I want what this guy is smoking... Or should be smoking.
I have no problem with pot being legal. All drugs? I don't know there are some pretty nasty ones out there should probably be regulated. I suspect there are a lot of folks on the religious right that see 'drugs' as immoral and that is the basis of their reasoning. I cannot speak for them.
Conservatives talk about individual freedoms.
Libertarians talk about it even more, but tend to vote Republican (as a whole).
They act as if they would fight and die for my "freedoms" to, for example, give speeches to White Suprematists about how the Holocaust was a myth.
They go on about "Natural Rights", but yet don't seem to know what that actually means....
And so, my example and question is this. Here in MA. I can now walk into a store and buy (and consume later) pot in any and all flavors and types. I can buy large quantities of it, just like with booze. For almost a decade a citizen of this commonwealth has been able to use it with no penalties. We can grow it.
I'd really like to hear comments from thoughtful conservatives - not rants or excuses from those whose minds are already made up. Simply - why are virtually ALL the states that have looked at this as a "natural law" situation Blue? We could say AK, ME and NV are purple, but all are different in many ways....but, by and large, those 70 million or so people who are not going to get arrest records, jail stints and general abridging of their rights....are in solid blue areas.
Why? If the talking points about conservatives getting government out of their lives are anywhere near true - why would they support putting normal citizens in jail and charging them with crimes...whilst their Blue Brothers are enjoying pain relief and relaxation and recreation?
I'd really like to hear a reasoned response because I cannot think of one...except that the authoritarian concept of "law and order" is so strong in red states that they fear their citizens are not capable of such decisions....and THEY have to force prohibitions upon them.
Whether or not one can legally sell, purchase and consume a previously illegal substance isn't what I would consider proof positive of personal freedoms. As another poster said democrats and republicans (or each state) like to regulate peoples lives they just regulate different things. As far as why particular states regulate what they regulate I'm sure it is complex and related to culture and popular opinions on such matters.
Whether or not one can legally sell, purchase and consume a previously illegal substance isn't what I would consider proof positive of personal freedoms. As another poster said democrats and republicans (or each state) like to regulate peoples lives they just regulate different things. As far as why particular states regulate what they regulate I'm sure it is complex and related to culture and popular opinions on such matters.
No it's not. Popular opinion is for legalization or, at minimum, complete decrim.
You have to go back to the "black and brown thing" - that is, hispanics and blacks tended to smoke more week and do more coke. Their numbers don't count in many states.
Also, REPUBLICANS still don't favor legalization, while independents and democrats do.
That proves my point of backwards world...
The point is, we know that that Bible Belt and so-called conservatives have long tried to regulate behavior in the bedroom and in our own homes and minds. That is their calling card and the foundation of their entire world view. Why do you think GOP Presidents have brought Falwell and Graham into the White House as advisors and friends? Falwell told us teletubbies were gay (among many other things).
Am I generalizing? Yes, of course. But the facts remain. A person in MA is, IMHO, much more free due to knowing their health care is better, their chances for education are many and that they can use a relatively harmless herb without being taken away by people with guns.
No it's not. Popular opinion is for legalization or, at minimum, complete decrim.
You have to go back to the "black and brown thing" - that is, hispanics and blacks tended to smoke more week and do more coke. Their numbers don't count in many states.
Also, REPUBLICANS still don't favor legalization, while independents and democrats do.
That proves my point of backwards world...
The point is, we know that that Bible Belt and so-called conservatives have long tried to regulate behavior in the bedroom and in our own homes and minds. That is their calling card and the foundation of their entire world view. Why do you think GOP Presidents have brought Falwell and Graham into the White House as advisors and friends? Falwell told us teletubbies were gay (among many other things).
Am I generalizing? Yes, of course. But the facts remain. A person in MA is, IMHO, much more free due to knowing their health care is better, their chances for education are many and that they can use a relatively harmless herb without being taken away by people with guns.
Those are very big deals.
O good Lord.
Of course state laws have nothing to do with the voters or popular opinion its all about the black and brown people.
Which laws is it exactly that so-called conservatives in the bible belt have enacted to regulate behavior in the bedroom, homes and minds?
If your happy in MA with better healthcare, education and legal pot why are you so concerned about what other states are doing?
Ah, finially we know what happened, just not which drug
Quote:
Originally Posted by MJJersey
Doing drugs that destroy your mind and body doesn’t make you free; it enslaves you and makes you weak. That’s why blue state governments and even some red states like the idea.
OK MJJersey, so what drug did you take that destroyed your mind and made your arguments weak, since you are obviously speaking from experience?
O good Lord.
Of course state laws have nothing to do with the voters or popular opinion its all about the black and brown people.
Which laws is it exactly that so-called conservatives in the bible belt have enacted to regulate behavior in the bedroom, homes and minds?
If your happy in MA with better healthcare, education and legal pot why are you so concerned about what other states are doing?
Let me address the points in order. Black and Brown people have never counted as much as White People in the South (and in the USA as a whole). Period. We could go through Slavery, Jim Crow, Racism and even modern-day voter suppression...but they don't count as much. We could talk about wealth being the "vote" based on all of history...but why repeat ourselves? These are facts.
This is a political debate forum and I am bringing up an issue that shows that the opposite of "common knowledge" among many conservatives is true. That's a political topic - who can doubt that ruining the lives of millions of people is political? So that answers that.....
Now, as far as regulating behavior...
Southern Black Codes - Constitutional Rights Foundation
"South Carolina’s code reflected the white obsession with controlling the former slaves. It banned black people from possessing most firearms, making or selling liquor, and coming into the state without first posting a bond for “good behavior.” The code made it illegal for them to sell any farm products without written permission from their white employer, supposedly to guard against stealing. Also, blacks could not practice any occupation, except farmer or servant under contract, without getting an annual license from a judge."
"The law went on to state that, “Marriage between a white person and a person of color shall be illegal and void.”
Lynching itself was a "legal" form of making sure a Black person didn't even give a compliment to the style or looks of a white woman, let alone hold her hand. DEATH - by mob, with LE participating. That's "the law".
We don't have to spell out which states these are.....the usual suspects. Just "coincidence" that the same ones often have stricter drug laws and suppress voting, etc. - just happenstance, right???
Not only did these states (and according to law they still do) go deep into the bedroom and mind, but they also - in MODERN TIMES - controlled the behavior of free individuals in public places. The City of Montgomery Alabama actually closed ALL parks and pools rather than share them with free men and women (the wrong ones). The South did the same with schools....taking all the resources from public schools so the white folks could send their kids to their own kind of schools.
I could go on. But if your knowledge of history needs some buttressing I would ask you to read for yourself. No one can convince another of things that are already set in their minds.
I am not talking about ancient history here. As above, some of the laws are still valid. The drug war is still on. Voting Rights are being suppressed...and much more.
I'm going to bow out of this thread now since all the backs and forths have already been made.
Some good discussion - other than a few who are self-appointed "Drug Czars" for whatever reason. If one is not willing to listen to reason and then take another look at their hardened opinions, then participation in a discussion is somewhat useless. They may as well just start a web site or blog and push their views.
But a reasoned discussion can get people thinking.
One important factoid for people to remember is that the USA was Founded based on the world views of MA - another general statement, but never the less quite true. MA and New England have been consistent in terms of slowly advancing human rights (abolition, etc.) and human rights. Only recent propaganda put forth by right wing oil billionaires (mostly out of Texas) has spun a different story.
Legal Pot, Universal Health Care, Universal Education, Abolition, Arms manufacturing, safety (fire codes) and now gay rights and many other such things are part and parcel of all of this. Is it perfect? No, far from it. Pols in MA. are corrupt like pols everywhere. The difference is that The People insist on certain things and most of them involve freedom and/or improvements in our lot. A fire code or access for disabled may seen like "punishments for business", but in a society of millions they are just the opposite - the price of FREEDOM for ALL.
The strong, healthy and lucky (by birth) middle aged top-of-the-heaps usually have it all good. But, as they say, you judge a society by how it treats the weakest among them. That is the advancement of liberty and freedom. How "free" is someone with wealth in S. America who needs to live with a 16 foot masonry wall around their house and armed guards?
No it's not. Popular opinion is for legalization or, at minimum, complete decrim.
You have to go back to the "black and brown thing" - that is, hispanics and blacks tended to smoke more week and do more coke. Their numbers don't count in many states.
Also, REPUBLICANS still don't favor legalization, while independents and democrats do.
That proves my point of backwards world...
The point is, we know that that Bible Belt and so-called conservatives have long tried to regulate behavior in the bedroom and in our own homes and minds. That is their calling card and the foundation of their entire world view. Why do you think GOP Presidents have brought Falwell and Graham into the White House as advisors and friends? Falwell told us teletubbies were gay (among many other things).
Am I generalizing? Yes, of course. But the facts remain. A person in MA is, IMHO, much more free due to knowing their health care is better, their chances for education are many and that they can use a relatively harmless herb without being taken away by people with guns.
Those are very big deals.
It's MA, only criminals have guns. But you have your groovy Rice Krispy marshmallow flavored Hipster edible crap so there's that. It won't stop what is happening in Lawrence with the fentanyl which then spreads all around your precious state and surrounding states like a big wave of carnage centered right in your uber liberal paradise. WHY doesn't your utopian state FIX Lawrence the epicenter of death? Oh wait, because it is a minority majority city, can't rock that boat. That's some cold freedom.
PS- Only Tinky Winky was gay- RIP TW.
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Ah, finially we know what happened, just not which drug
