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Old 11-21-2018, 04:34 PM
 
Location: Richmond
1,645 posts, read 1,215,670 times
Reputation: 1777

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ohiogirl81 View Post
My house can hurt someone only if they trespass and trip over a hand tool I've been looking for since 2007. A gun on the other hand ...

You are leaving a singular thing out, you can choose to defend your house with a security system, you could defend your house with a baseball bat. You can defend your household with a Taser; or you could defend your household with a gun. None of these things will harm anyone on their own, they require human intervention.


The criminal that made the conscious decision to break into your home, by that decision made a conscious act to break the law. If you are then choosing to defend your household, you are responding to a person or group of people that have already committed at least one criminal act. How you will be able to defend your household is then best left of to you, and the materials that you feel best meet your needs.


If you are exceptionally good in the Martial Arts, you might only need a staff, or a sword. If you are more frail, a gun could be a good choice. The point is you should still be able to make that choice.
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Old 11-21-2018, 04:39 PM
 
Location: The Republic of Texas
78,863 posts, read 46,671,010 times
Reputation: 18521
I get this eerie feeling, some people actually think the words, "Shall not be infringed" means Shall be Limited
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Old 11-21-2018, 04:46 PM
 
482 posts, read 242,801 times
Reputation: 683
Quote:
Originally Posted by LesLucid View Post
Get off your high horse. Humans are citizens, not much else qualifies. I keep a pocket constitution right on the side table beside me, within reach where I sit right now. Do you really think they wrote the constitution to be a document just temporary in nature? Of course not!

The constitution is the supreme law of the land, we are a constitutional republic, our nation is founded on that document. The constitution contains within it the means to modify itself if needed so obviously it was envisioned that it would survive and might have to be modified, rather than trashed and ignored which is so popular now.

And again, technology simply doesn’t matter. It isn’t about technology, it’s about rights. The SCOTUS tells us the intent of the constitution and its writers with each new challenge, whether based in technology or not.

And Carbon is right. The constitution doesn’t grant rights, it protects inalienable rights.
https://legaldictionary.net/inalienable-rights/
They never envisioned a world where technology would move faster than our culture or legal system could adapt or adjust. How could they? Anyways, Trying to interpret the constitution's intent in regards to just things like the internet isn't really possible at this point. Just wait until Artificial intelligence, 3D printing, or cloning become the norm.

The constitution and our current legal system aren't going anywhere, but if you believe that modern legal scholars could not develop a vastly more effective way to govern this nation in 2018, you are sadly mistaken. The great divide in this country that is taking place is partly the result of people acknowledging that our legal system is no longer working as well as it once did, and that it's going to get MUCH worse as time goes on.
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Old 11-21-2018, 04:53 PM
 
Location: Clyde Hill, WA
6,061 posts, read 2,014,523 times
Reputation: 2167
Quote:
Originally Posted by BentBow View Post
Cannons didn't just shoot cannon balls.
My cannon loads are 50 lug bolts, not a ball.
They had rapid fire guns.
They had rockets.



All made by the PEOPLE, not the Government, not the military.
Our military didn't have it, unless the people who were the military had it.
I'm sure the founders realized the jump from archery, to gunpowder and more advancements would come.
Good points...points taken.

https://www.massmoments.org/moment-d...to-boston.html

Quote:
On this day in 1776, Colonel Henry Knox reached the headquarters of the Continental Army in Cambridge. The young Boston bookseller had pulled off a daring plan. He had led a small group of men on a 300-mile journey from Boston to Fort Ticonderoga in New York State. Once there, the party disassembled cannon taken when the British surrendered the fort and retreated to Canada in May 1775. In less than two months time, Knox and his men moved 60 tons of artillery across lakes and rivers, through ice and snow to Boston.
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Old 11-21-2018, 04:55 PM
 
Location: Clyde Hill, WA
6,061 posts, read 2,014,523 times
Reputation: 2167
Quote:
Originally Posted by BentBow View Post
I get this eerie feeling, some people actually think the words, "Shall not be infringed" means Shall be Limited
Well no right is unlimited. Freedom of speech does not include the right to shout 'fire' in a crowded theater. Freedom of religion does not include the right to practice human sacrifice.
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Old 11-21-2018, 05:09 PM
 
Location: The Republic of Texas
78,863 posts, read 46,671,010 times
Reputation: 18521
Quote:
Originally Posted by travis t View Post
Well no right is unlimited. Freedom of speech does not include the right to shout 'fire' in a crowded theater. Freedom of religion does not include the right to practice human sacrifice.
Actually, you can yell fire in a theater and Murder has always been illegal.
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Old 11-21-2018, 05:26 PM
 
Location: Just over the horizon
18,462 posts, read 7,100,791 times
Reputation: 11708
Quote:
Originally Posted by spider99 View Post
No, FatBob.

Once again, there is NO SUCH THING AS NATURAL RIGHTS. Human rights are relative, not universal.
A slave being whipped by his master did not have the right to self defense. The constitution did not protect that man's natural right to self defense because that man was not a citizen, and the Constitution was created to protect the rights of citizens. It took almost a hounded years for most black men in this country to receive their "natural right" to defend themselves and almost 200 years before they could do it without being unfairly persecuted. Just look at the quote you posted and think to yourself how ridiculously hypocritical that is in regards to the era that it was written.

Seriously, READ A BOOK DUDE........

Just because someone can prevent you from exercising your natural right to self defense doesn't mean that it doesn't exist.

If someone prevents a woman from having an abortion, does that make Roe v Wade null and void?

Did that slave being whipped not have a natural human right to escape or otherwise prevent being whipped if he could?


Say you and I are the last two people on Earth after some natural disaster.....

Now, being that I'm well over 6 foot and a hair shy of 240 lbs......chances are better than average that I'm bigger and stronger than you are. ....(maybe you're bigger, doesn't really matter)

If I decide that you have stuff that I want and I'm willing to beat you ....or worse to get it....

Do you have a natural right to defend yourself from me in any way you can?

Keep in mind there are no police to call.

No courts to convict me.

Do you or do you not have a right to defend yourself and your property against me?
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Old 11-21-2018, 05:40 PM
 
19,724 posts, read 10,142,200 times
Reputation: 13096
villageidiot1




The Girandoni air rifle was an airgun designed by Tyrolian inventor Bartholomäus Girandoni circa 1779. The weapon was also known as the Windbüchse ("wind rifle" in German). One of the rifle's more famous associations is its use on the Lewis and Clark Expedition to explore and map the western part of North America in the early 1800s. This was a semi auto rifle, capable of 30 shots and originally designed for use by the Austrian Army.
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Old 11-21-2018, 05:44 PM
 
Location: Just over the horizon
18,462 posts, read 7,100,791 times
Reputation: 11708
Quote:
Originally Posted by travis t View Post
Well no right is unlimited. Freedom of speech does not include the right to shout 'fire' in a crowded theater. Freedom of religion does not include the right to practice human sacrifice.


This has been debunked ad nauseum.

There is no law against yelling fire in a crowded theater.

What's against the law is the false call to action, because it endagers the other people in the theater.

The word "fire" is irrelevant.......you can't yell "free cupcakes in the lobby" either.

You can say the word fire anyplace, including the crowded theater.

So, it's not a limitation on speech, it's a limitation on endangering others.

It would only be a limitation on speech if you actually banned the word "fire" from being spoken anytime, anywhere.

So, banning a particular type of gun would be analogous to banning a particular word altogether.......

Not just banning it it from being yelled in a theater.
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Old 11-21-2018, 05:55 PM
 
27,307 posts, read 16,240,346 times
Reputation: 12102
Quote:
Originally Posted by LesLucid View Post
You cannot bear a nuke as a small arm, at least right now. When you can, we’ll worry bout that. The main difference between small arms and nukes is that one is a specific, directed weapon, the other is an indiscriminate weapon of mass distruction. Weapons of mass distruction, whether chemical, biological or nuclear, have been carefully monitored and controlled by all nations for almost as long as those weapons have existed.
The actual owning of a nuke weapon is not illegal. Just the proper storing of the fissile material could be cost prohibitive.
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