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Not a question of unions or no, but how is the union behaving, mainly the administrators. When it becomes ridiculously lucrative to be a high-ranking officer in a union, there will be problems. Lots of problems.
Kinda reminds me of the plotline of the movie "Blue Collar". I think that movie might still be relevant today along with these vlogs from Charlie LeDuff posted in 2014 about the UAW attempt to unionize the VW plant in Chattanooga.
Ive worked in several union shops and been through two union votes in shops where there there was no union representation. The negotiations while "legal" (lol) were not voluntary.
Anyway, I never said there aren't times that a company won't voluntarily work with a union, so my point stands; at the end of the day govt will force a resistant company to negotiate with union representation.
there is an old saying...……….a union is only as good as its members...…….
as to your reference to "forcing" a company to negotiate,in the end its both union and company who when unable to reach a consensus it is resolved by a mediation board. whose members are picked by both sides...…. https://nmb.gov/NMB_Application/
there is an old saying...……….a union is only as good as its members...…….
as to your reference to "forcing" a company to negotiate,in the end its both union and company who when unable to reach a consensus it is resolved by a mediation board. whose members are picked by both sides...…. https://nmb.gov/NMB_Application/
Ownership should be able to run a co. without outside interference. If a company wants to negotiate with a union or bring in a third party it should be on a voluntary basis only.
If an employee or employees are dissatisfied with pay or working conditions they can complain up the chain or quit, but no one is entitled to a job or the backing of the state with its guns to force change.
Actually, you're speaking for the corporations, not workers. You do realize don't you that corporate owners sure as hell don't want any union coming in and telling them how to run their companies. As corporations see it they are really the one getting abused by unions where unionized. It certainly isn't the workers. Tell me something, do you not realize that unions in the labor contracts will try to take away the corporation's right to fire without giving any cause?
so...……..how would you feel if your wife asked for a divorce..... but refused to give you a reason??
Ownership should be able to run a co. without outside interference. If a company wants to negotiate with a union or bring in a third party it should be on a voluntary basis only.
If an employee or employees are dissatisfied with pay or working conditions they can complain up the chain or quit, but no one is entitled to a job or the backing of the state with its guns to force change.
where did you get the idea companies who agreed to having a union negotiate for their employees could not fire one of those employees...…. no one is "entitled" to not being discharged for a legitimate reason...…..
Unions were the working class negotiators. Philosophically, unions are amazing: a free market counter to free market problems.
In the US, at least, I think corporate management and union leadership both bear blame for unions losing good-faith worker rights negotiation in exchange for a power battle between said leaders. Shame, unions could and should be better. But again, neither is really blameless.
I missed it apparently. Good points that I agree with. When I first started working back in the 70”s I worked with an old guy close to retirement. One day I was complaining about paying for union dues. Among other things he said to me “you need to remember that unions were brought about by companies. If they could be counted on to treat their employees fairly there would be no need for a union “
Corporations have been abused by unions. Protecting the jobs of willfully unproductive workers while forcing is abuse against the corporation. Supporting a political party (using dues paid by members who, in many cases, don’t support the same party) which is determined to steal every cent they can from the corporation’s coffers in interest of “the greater good” is abuse. Pushing pensions so high that there is no sustainable way to meet the obligation is abuse.
As I’ve said before, private sector unions at one time served a purpose. They forced a young nation to address issues that needed to be addressed. They have long outlived their usefulness and have become parasites. As for public sector unions, they’ve always been parasites.
The protection of unproductive workers occurs primarily in the public sector. When I was a union guy, most of my contracts had 'production standards' provisions. Production was monitored via computer systems, and workers who didn't measure up got the boot. I saw several people get the boot this way, and the union did not fight it.
OTOH, if the company tried to fire someone arbitrarily, say because a manager decided he didn't like the guy, the union would step in and fight. I saw quite a few guys have their jobs saved in this way.
Ahh, the old union debate. And, the usual suspects have boarded the anti union train to come to the defense of our beloved corporate titans. It's truly a testimony of efficient propaganda, that people in today's America no longer know who's buttering their bread, and that means that the shallow corporate news media, an anti union entity in it's own right, has won the hearts and minds of the working class.
This is why history tends to repeat itself, and why each generation must learn from their own mistakes. The elites are overjoyed that the unwashed masses are so easily distracted from a real education with regards to their own labor history, a simple two minute reading of the posts on "work and employment" forums would let us know why we need protection from the powerful. And no one but a complete fool thinks that only a saint should represent the workers interest. A union is only as strong as it's members want it to be...
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