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Old 02-09-2020, 08:48 PM
 
Location: Foot of the Rockies
90,297 posts, read 120,779,853 times
Reputation: 35920

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Quote:
Originally Posted by njbiodude View Post
It's the same here in the US. Dont think it doesn't take months in many metros to get seen by a specialist. This even goes on with cancer patients.

Generally the US has lower life expectancies and worse outcomes than other "first world" nations too. And we certainly pay a heck of a lot more.
Our LE is 0.2 yr lower than the EU average. IOW, about 2 1/2 months.
https://www.cia.gov/library/publicat.../2102rank.html

As far as outcomes, our 5 year cancer survival rates are at the top.
https://www.healio.com/hematology-on...ghest-in-world
"Five-year survival for the most common 18 cancers remained highest globally for the United States, Canada, Australia and New Zealand, followed by Finland, Iceland, Norway and Sweden, according to data through 2014 from CONCORD-3."

That's not to say there can't be improvements made. I would like to see a UHC because I think it's the right thing to do. I have no unrealistic expectation that it will save a bundle, though.

 
Old 02-09-2020, 08:50 PM
 
8,155 posts, read 3,678,584 times
Reputation: 2719
Quote:
Originally Posted by InformedConsent View Post
How would a "public option" be funded?
How is the private insurance funded?
 
Old 02-09-2020, 09:00 PM
 
Location: Del Rio, TN
39,874 posts, read 26,514,597 times
Reputation: 25773
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hoonose View Post
States can't do their own HC because they don't have the money and cannot create it. Heck, just take any state's senior HC costs alone and that will be about the same cost as their entire state budget!
Now take that and expand it to all 330 million people in this nation. If a single, small, relatively homogeneous and prosperous state can't afford it-it's a given that a nation of 330 million highly diverse people, plus 20-30 million criminal aliens, can't begin to afford it. I do have one other question. Native Americans living on the reservation pay no federal income taxes on money earned on the res. Puerto Rican residents pay no income tax on their income. Now-will the taxpayers be on the hook for paying for their health care-on top of the millions of illegals?
 
Old 02-09-2020, 09:11 PM
 
8,155 posts, read 3,678,584 times
Reputation: 2719
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mircea View Post
That's disingenuous.

There's a difference between State constitutions and the US Constitution.

The US Constitution bars a sales tax unless it is apportioned by population.

In other words, the sales tax that you could legally pay is based on the population of your State.

So, people in California, New York and Texas would be paying a 30% sales tax while people in Vermont, Wyoming and Montana would be paying 0.5% because, um, that's what the Constitution says.

That's why you have a 13th Amendment.

The government cannot say if your income is this, your income tax is 25%, because that's illegal under the Constitution.

Again, your income tax rate would be based on the population of your State, which means people in California, New York and Texas would be paying 30x to 60x more than people in the least populated States.

The 13th Amendment lets the government get around apportionment.

To enact a sales tax/VAT, you would need a constitutional amendment to avoid the apportionment clause.

However, the government could levy an excise tax on select goods, groups of goods or classes of goods based on NAICS.



Nobody cares what Australia and Canada do.

The US has States as large as Australia and Canada.

More money is required because your system of healthcare delivery is unlike those countries.



Those are teeny-tiny countries compared to the US.

And, with the exception of France and the UK, none have aircraft carriers.
Lol, where do I even start.

yes, it is by population. Do you know what total and per capita is?


Teeny-tiny, lol. Only Germany is 83 mil.

Now to the funniest part, aircraft carriers, lol?
 
Old 02-10-2020, 02:28 AM
 
Location: the very edge of the continent
89,030 posts, read 44,840,107 times
Reputation: 13715
Quote:
Originally Posted by serger View Post
How is the private insurance funded?
Those who have it pay for it. Those who don't, don't pay for it. You're saying the "public option" will be funded the same way? Those who have it pay for it. Those who don't, don't pay for it? I'd be good with that.
 
Old 02-10-2020, 07:32 AM
 
Location: Barrington
63,919 posts, read 46,748,172 times
Reputation: 20674
Largest hospital healthcare systems in US:

https://www.beckershospitalreview.co...rica-2019.html

Focus on #1, a publicly- traded, for profit corporation:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/HCA_Healthcare

It’s ranked # 67 on the Fortune 500.

This is the system Rick Scott, former Florida Governor, now a US senator, and close friend of Trump ran.

This is the hospital system that, at the time, was fined more than $2 billion in settlement of Federal suits for Medicare/ Medicaid fraud. Employees were the whistle blowers. Scott was forced out and received a jaw dropping exit package.

It dropped the reference to Columbia to get the stink of fraud off its back.

For 30 plus years, hospitals either acquire other hospitals or are acquired. It is the era of Big Hospital.

Big Hospital meets Big People.

75% of us are overweight/ obese. One- third of the US population has been diagnosed with Diabetes or Pre- Diabetic. It’s an epidemic.

$10,000 / year/ per patient is spent to treat Diabetes and its complications

Being overweight/ obese makes most people far more susceptible to all sorts of nasty diseases that are costly to diagnose/ treat. It’s now possible to treat and often survive diseases that once were nearly always fatal.
That costs money. Big Money.
 
Old 02-10-2020, 07:36 AM
 
Location: OH->FL->NJ
17,005 posts, read 12,595,161 times
Reputation: 8925
Wont happen here. The health insurance companies and hospital lobbies will not stop until they have all of everyone's money. They own congress.
 
Old 02-10-2020, 07:49 AM
 
Location: Barrington
63,919 posts, read 46,748,172 times
Reputation: 20674
Quote:
Originally Posted by Katarina Witt View Post
Our LE is 0.2 yr lower than the EU average. IOW, about 2 1/2 months.
https://www.cia.gov/library/publicat.../2102rank.html

As far as outcomes, our 5 year cancer survival rates are at the top.
https://www.healio.com/hematology-on...ghest-in-world
"Five-year survival for the most common 18 cancers remained highest globally for the United States, Canada, Australia and New Zealand, followed by Finland, Iceland, Norway and Sweden, according to data through 2014 from CONCORD-3."

That's not to say there can't be improvements made. I would like to see a UHC because I think it's the right thing to do. I have no unrealistic expectation that it will save a bundle, though.
The most common cancers are lung, prostate and colon.
Mean age at diagnosis:

Lung- 70
Prostate-66
Colon-70

The majority of these cancers are diagnosed, treated and primarily paid for by Medicare.
 
Old 02-10-2020, 07:57 AM
 
Location: the very edge of the continent
89,030 posts, read 44,840,107 times
Reputation: 13715
Quote:
Originally Posted by ottomobeale View Post
Wont happen here. The health insurance companies and hospital lobbies will not stop until they have all of everyone's money. They own congress.
FWIW, the insurance companies wrote Obamacare. Obama, Pelosi, et al, fell in line with their demands:

Insurers poised to win big - Los Angeles Times

 
Old 02-10-2020, 08:05 AM
 
5,177 posts, read 3,091,598 times
Reputation: 11054
Quote:
Originally Posted by ottomobeale View Post
Wont happen here. The health insurance companies and hospital lobbies will not stop until they have all of everyone's money. They own congress.
Wait a minute! Senator Durbin claimed “the banks own this place”.

Last edited by TimAZ; 02-10-2020 at 08:49 AM.. Reason: Sp
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