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Ah, let us explain. Once America was filled with what you consider classic conservatives. And they were perfectly fine. The problem is that in the last decade or so, "conservative" has come to mean something far more extreme and, yes, authoritarian. By its very nature, the word implies looking backward, and resisting change and improvement. In practical terms, it's embodied in Trump's un-American extreme hostility toward immigrants, even though it's not so long ago that his own ancestors arrived here - one of whom had been kicked out of Germany. In general, conservatives these days imply intolerance - of immigrants, of women's rights, of civil rights - and a favoring of money/corporations over people.
I'm not sure what Carlin you're referring to, and wish you had been clearer. Senator Jim Carlin?
George Carlin
Not sure I agree with your assessment, but I appreciate your insight.
I score center slight left on all of the political leaning quizzes I take.
I want to know why some people have such disdain for the right, the conservatives.
I consider myself an old school classic liberal in the vein of Carlin. I don't always agree with the right but it seems like I find myself siding with them more so than the far left. The far left is getting too authoritarian and too much for big government.
I want to know in polite terms why and what is wrong exactly with the conservative crowd and please try and keep it polite and as fact based as we can.
Conservatism has morphed quite a bit in the USA over the past decade. I would suggest you define what you find appealing about conservatism first before posters offer a critique of it.
There is a vast distance from say George Will to say Donald Trump......I know Trump is NOT a "classical conservative" by any stretch. But he is the face of the modern/current GOP.
Conservatism has morphed quite a bit in the USA over the past decade. I would suggest you define what you find appealing about conservatism first before posters offer a critique of it.
There is a vast distance from say George Will to say Donald Trump......I know Trump is a "classical conservative" by any stretch. But he is the face of the modern/current GOP.
I prposedly dropped conservative and right in the OP in an attempt to sorta broadly define my point. I get that there are nuances though.
The believe individualism is tied to property rights and land ownership, and their ideology has mostly failed to promote their supposed values in the modern age.
I also don't like the 'liberal' democracies that turn citizens into self interested voters and politicians into caterers for special interests.
And they fetishize these ideas rather than offer them some meek endorsement to the point of cult hood.
The believe individualism is tied to property rights and land ownership, and their ideology has mostly failed to promote their supposed values in the modern age.
I also don't like the 'liberal' democracies that turn citizens into self interested voters and politicians into caterers for special interests.
And they fetishize these ideas rather than offer them some meek endorsement to the point of cult hood.
J. S. Mills was cool however.
Ok.
You're probably more of a collectivist in your thinking overall.
Other than doctrinal Leftists .... you don't like much of anything.
"i disagree with almost everything you say, but i will defend, to my death, your right to say them.
(Voltaire, a "Founding Father" of what has come to be called the Enlightenment, on many occasions and paraphrased in many forms)
I try to maintain that lofty sentiment in every thing I post here, (and admittedly, don't always quite measure up to it). but I can see very little respect for it in too many of the posts here.
Last edited by 2nd trick op; 05-25-2020 at 06:28 PM..
I don't have a problem with either liberals or conservatives, if using the dictionary definition:
Liberal - open to new behavior or opinions and willing to discard traditional values
Conservative - holding to traditional attitudes and values and cautious about change or innovation
I consider myself more liberal, but I see the positive side of conservative also.
Donald Trump is no conservative. His anti-science, conspiracy theorist, xenophobic followers are also not representative of true conservatives.
I don't have a problem with either liberals or conservatives, if using the dictionary definition:
Liberal - open to new behavior or opinions and willing to discard traditional values
Conservative - holding to traditional attitudes and values and cautious about change or innovation
I consider myself more liberal, but I see the positive side of conservative also.
Donald Trump is no conservative. His anti-science, conspiracy theorist, xenophobic followers are also not representative of true conservatives.
I score center slight left on all of the political leaning quizzes I take.
I want to know why some people have such disdain for the right, the conservatives.
I consider myself an old school classic liberal in the vein of Carlin. I don't always agree with the right but it seems like I find myself siding with them more so than the far left. The far left is getting too authoritarian and too much for big government.
I want to know in polite terms why and what is wrong exactly with the conservative crowd and please try and keep it polite and as fact based as we can.
Politics is not linear.
There is no "left of center" or "right of center". People don't think like that.
Take a list of issues and put them in two columns, like A and B or 'liberal' and 'conservative'.
'For' and 'Against' or 'Approve' and 'Disapprove' any list of stuff ... these are the issues
Then have people fill it out.
One person happens to fill out A-B-A-B- etc all down the line, while another person answers it B-A-B-A- all down the line.
Gosh it looks like they are both moderates, some conservative viewpoints and some conservative viewpoints. They should get along famously, like "hey, we're reasonable, we can see both points of view" ...
Actually those two 'moderates' are polar opposites. They couldn't be more further apart if they tried.
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