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As a libertarian leaning Conservative, I don't really have a dog in the abortion fight.
I personally think it's abhorrent in almost all cases but that doesn't mean that I think it should be illegal on a Federal level.
But it's astounding how many on the Left are so uninformed that they think that if Roe vs Wade is overturned that abortion will automatically become illegal nationwide.
If by some chance the SC does overturn, it simply goes back to being decided on by the individual states. And that's how it should be anyways.
What settles it for me is:
A womb is not a public space.
So many ways to look at it. I wonder how it is the state would become aware of a woman and her medical records. It being largely unenforceable is really where I draw the line. If a baby is born in a hospital someone without the doctor patient privilege would know its missing. Its in a public space/ Perhaps an argument may be made for starting to show etc on that angle but generally as a libertarian myself , when someone does a home invasion , I tend to think that the bias should go to the homeowner as the sovereign. In cases of clear invitation like delivery people, worker or friend they invite over then the bias may swing in the other direction.
In other words state involvement just tends to make it worse. Prosecuting people that defend themselves causes more attacks because they know that the state has their back. They can case the place, crawl though a window etc. To prove yourself innocent now you need to film yourself. It invites surveillance. To enforce abortion then search ans surveillance is the only means to enforce it.
With the left losing their minds over the possibility of a 6-3 conservative Supreme Court, i wonder how many actually know what the makeup of the 1973 Supreme Court was that ruled in favor of a woman’s right to have an abortion? Was it 5-4 liberal? Maybe 6-3 liberal?
The court at the time of the ruling was 6-3 conservative.
Roe v Wade is what Liberals drag out and bandy about in an attempt to get a knee-jerk reaction.
It might be relevant in the 1976 or 1980 Elections, or even the 1992 Election, but not today.
The Supreme Court would never reverse Roe v Wade, because they would rely on other precedents and established case law.
The worst case scenario is that the Supreme Court would restrict abortion to the 1st Trimester, which would be consistent with other Supreme Court decisions and also in keeping with Roe v Wade, which did not grant abortion on demand whenever it was desired, because the Court was viewing the case in the context of a 1st Trimester abortion.
Abortion in its current state, legally anyway, isn't changing. The culture has moved on since 1973, and now everyone has a some level of distaste for the practice itself, but generally all go along with letting the individual choose their own path.
Abortion as "concern" for potential justices isn't the concern. It is simply the truncheon used to hopefully scare/bully GOP lawmakers into nominating liberal activists who will side with Democrats on a few gazillion other things that they cannot get done in the House and Senate, and it makes it sound super duper serious to the average voter.
Buit Democrats know as well as Republicans that abortion itself, as in Roe v Wade and all that, isn't going anywhere. It's just an easy metaphoric football and stand in argument for the real argument, which is EXACTLY as follows:
Democrat senator - we want justices who will generally follow the Constitution when it serves the purpose of blocking the GOP, and who will ignore that same Constitution at will if it serves our purposes.
Republican senator - we want justices who will generally follow the Constitution when it serves the purpose of blocking the Dems, and who will ignore that same Constitution at will if it serves our purposes.
Roe v Wade is what Liberals drag out and bandy about in an attempt to get a knee-jerk reaction.
It might be relevant in the 1976 or 1980 Elections, or even the 1992 Election, but not today.
The Supreme Court would never reverse Roe v Wade, because they would rely on other precedents and established case law.
The worst case scenario is that the Supreme Court would restrict abortion to the 1st Trimester, which would be consistent with other Supreme Court decisions and also in keeping with Roe v Wade, which did not grant abortion on demand whenever it was desired, because the Court was viewing the case in the context of a 1st Trimester abortion.
I agree with this wholeheartedly. Liberals are overstating the case and kvetching over nothing.
As an extreme lefty, I’d LOVE it if a conservative dominated SCOTUS overturned Roe. I can’t paint a better dream scenario.
However, I was taking Biology 1B during the time of Roe vs Wade and up on the cabinets of the biology lab were "pre-born humans" floating in preservative.
One for every week of the human gestation period. It was a eye opening experience. I am sure that the Supreme Court lawyers had no clue about life and biology.
None of them were ever in a Biology 1B class. So they really never had to face the consequences of their decisions.
At 24 weeks we had a "pre-born" human die in the womb.
The hospital asked us...."what do you want to do with it?. Do you want us to throw it away??, do you want to cremate it?? or do you want a religious ceremony and burial"??.
The next pregnancy we were faced with genetic testing after two "fetal dimise". The pro-life husband wanted to do testing and abort if necessary. My pro-choice wife, refused to do testing and was going to deliver a baby no matter its genetic makeup.
Abortion is a awful choice.
A womb is not a public space.
But it is a space with awful consequences that last a lifetime for every participant, not just the "pre-born" human.
It is in the end more than "not a public space" it defines us by the choices we make and I guess makes us human for good or wrong.
I agree with this wholeheartedly. Liberals are overstating the case and kvetching over nothing.
As an extreme lefty, I’d LOVE it if a conservative dominated SCOTUS overturned Roe. I can’t paint a better dream scenario.
I get your drift on this. If the conservatives were to take full control of the Supreme Court and then threw out the Roe vs. Wade decision, it would sink their ship as no other major issue would do. They would be shooting their cause in both feet.
Trump said before getting elected the kind of judges he would nominate !!!
Not keeping his promise would do more harm and make him look like a RINO or a democrat !!!
Trump has been outstanding and remarkable when it comes to keeping his promises !!!
Some people say he's kept more promises than he made !!! A President like no other !!!
I'm praying that the next President who makes promises, realizes at some point in time, that the promise should never have been made in the first place.
While I accept the Court's makeup at the time, I am also curious to know what is meant by judicial conservative at the time. Were those justices politically conservatives or judicial conservatives? And, yes, there is a difference. But, as Barrett has opined herself, the bedrock of Roe v. Wade is unlikely to be overturned by the Supreme Court. Rather, what you're likely to see are more restrictions passed by states being upheld, such as restrictive hospital admitting requirements or earlier and earlier abortion bans based on weeks of pregnancy.
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