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Old 02-28-2022, 07:32 PM
 
Location: Tricity, PL
61,740 posts, read 87,172,581 times
Reputation: 131736

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Quote:
Originally Posted by hothulamaui View Post
I doubt anyone underestimates Putin.

Putin is increasingly operating emotionally and likely to use all the weapons at his disposal, including nuclear ones. It’s important not to have any illusions — but equally important not to lose hope.
“Every time you think, ’No, he wouldn’t, would he?’ Well, yes, he would,”
“And he wants us to know that, of course. It’s not that we should be intimidated and scared…. We have to prepare for those contingencies and figure out what is it that we’re going to do to head them off.”

Read on - here is an interesting analysis:
https://www.politico.com/news/magazi...there-00012340
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Old 02-28-2022, 07:32 PM
 
30,065 posts, read 18,674,911 times
Reputation: 20886
Quote:
Originally Posted by warhorse78 View Post
I remember reading about that with the canal being dammed. The more I hear about what Ukraine and their new boy leader, the more I realize they are not the sweet innocent victims they claim to be. Like I said in a thread I posted, Ukraine government lost any sympathies I had when I learned they were abusing India students who were trying to leave. And I trust nothing from the MSM, which is owned and run by greedy men with an agenda, and it's not to save people but to make money and get more power.


And India, who has the forth most powerful military in the world. And despite the NATO agreements the USA made, if China and India band together to support Russia, the USA will bow out of NATO and join them. They got way too much money tied up in China and India.
Well................................. cutting off the water supply to Crimea to make it financially more difficult to occupy happened AFTER RUSSIA INVADED CRIMEA.

I would have been shocked if Ukraine maintained the water supply and made the Russian occupation easy.

You must understand that the only reason Ukraine shut it down was AFTER RUSSIA STOLE CRIMEA FROM UKRAINE. In doing so, they also stole the offshore oil and gas reserves in Crimean waters. Given current matters, Ukraine obviously made the right decision.
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Old 02-28-2022, 07:42 PM
 
30,065 posts, read 18,674,911 times
Reputation: 20886
Quote:
Originally Posted by tinytrump View Post
All those who were pro Russia and loved the Putin/Trump romancé will now see pure evil. Putin is not fighting army against army but firing on innocent civilians. I said it 1000 times -Russia is not our friend. We will feel this war one way or another.
Sooooo............................................ . why didn't Biden:

1. Supply Ukraine with more defensive armaments than Trump?

2. Increase US oil production to lower global prices and reduce Putin's main revenue source- oil?

3. Send Ukraine predator drones to destroy armor?

4. Work with US companies to develop Ukrainian oil and natural gas to eliminate Putin's energy stranglehold on Europe?

5. Move NATO troops to the border of Belarus and tell Putin an invasion of Ukraine would trigger a similar invasion of Belarus?

6. Out flank Putin diplomatically by offering NATO membership to Ukraine AND RUSSIA at the same time, eliminating Putin's reason to invade?

7. Negotiate with Putin face to face, rather than sending Giggles, who botched the diplomatic mission?

8. Commandeer Russia's merchant marine fleet with the onset of war?

9. Work with opposition elements in Russia to weaken Putin, much like Putin and China have worked with democrats to weaken the US?

10. Cut off purchasing Russian oil?
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Old 02-28-2022, 07:53 PM
 
Location: Native of Any Beach/FL
35,708 posts, read 21,070,199 times
Reputation: 14256
Quote:
Originally Posted by hawkeye2009 View Post
Sooooo............................................ . why didn't Biden:

1. Supply Ukraine with more defensive armaments than Trump?

2. Increase US oil production to lower global prices and reduce Putin's main revenue source- oil?

3. Send Ukraine predator drones to destroy armor?

4. Work with US companies to develop Ukrainian oil and natural gas to eliminate Putin's energy stranglehold on Europe?

5. Move NATO troops to the border of Belarus and tell Putin an invasion of Ukraine would trigger a similar invasion of Belarus?

6. Out flank Putin diplomatically by offering NATO membership to Ukraine AND RUSSIA at the same time, eliminating Putin's reason to invade?

7. Negotiate with Putin face to face, rather than sending Giggles, who botched the diplomatic mission?

8. Commandeer Russia's merchant marine fleet with the onset of war?

9. Work with opposition elements in Russia to weaken Putin, much like Putin and China have worked with democrats to weaken the US?

10. Cut off purchasing Russian oil?
So your 3.5 memo or OP is the solution?? Even though Trump made you think he was a king, the President does not just have all those powers. Like # 4 you want the potus to go to hedge fund companies to develop gas n oil in a years time ? Most of our business are owned by foreign investors, in Miami alone we have Russian billionaires who own alot of property and businesses. Money rules, we sold much of our birthrights.
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Old 03-01-2022, 06:36 AM
 
30,065 posts, read 18,674,911 times
Reputation: 20886
Quote:
Originally Posted by tinytrump View Post
All those who were pro Russia and loved the Putin/Trump romancé will now see pure evil. Putin is not fighting army against army but firing on innocent civilians. I said it 1000 times -Russia is not our friend. We will feel this war one way or another.
I don't think anyone ever thought that Russia was "our friend" and certainly not Trump, who told Putin he would bomb Moscow if he invaded Ukraine. Putin believed him (and I think he was right).

Russia has a GDP less than CA and close to that of Spain. They are only a greater threat due to their nukes. One can see that their conventional military forces are far weaker than anyone thought and their equipment, despite modernizations, is not up to task. Russia spends 1/7th as much as we do on defense. Is it a regional threat? OF COURSE to non NATO nations. RUSSIA IS A THREAT TO EUROPE WITH REGARD TO ENERGY. The main reason for the invasion was to secure Ukranian gas and oil reserves to prevent them from being THE SUPPLIER of gas and oil to Europe and thus destroying the Russian economy. Russia had to take Ukraine to save their economy.

China, on the other hand, is close to the US economically and has conventional forces that dwarf any other army. Let's face it- any conflict will be with conventional forces, not nukes, and that is what really matters. The use of nuclear arms means the end of the world in which no one wins. China is threatening trade routes important to the US and nations which have vital supplies for our economy. CHINA IS CLEARLY THE BIGGEST THREAT.

What can Ukraine do now to save themselves, given the west has left them high and dry?

1. Agree to JOINT development and management of the Ukranian oil and gas fields

2. Give the contract leases to Russian, not US companies

3. Agree to keep open the canal from the Dnieper that supplies water to Crimea

4. Recognize Crimea as Russian, but share the offshore gas and oil reserves near Crimea

5. Ask for a UN force to occupy Ukraine and restore order

6. Sign a non aggression pact with Moscow and maintain Ukranian sovereignty.
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Old 03-01-2022, 06:39 AM
 
30,065 posts, read 18,674,911 times
Reputation: 20886
Quote:
Originally Posted by tinytrump View Post
So your 3.5 memo or OP is the solution?? Even though Trump made you think he was a king, the President does not just have all those powers. Like # 4 you want the potus to go to hedge fund companies to develop gas n oil in a years time ? Most of our business are owned by foreign investors, in Miami alone we have Russian billionaires who own alot of property and businesses. Money rules, we sold much of our birthrights.
#4 DOES EXIST

That is through awarding gas and oil leases on federal property to private companies. How do you think we get the oil out of US holdings? The federal government does not have oil drilling and derricks of their own.

Why do you think Joe and Hunter were getting millions from Ukraine? IT WAS ABOUT OIL AND GAS.
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Old 03-01-2022, 06:42 AM
 
Location: Buckeye, AZ
38,936 posts, read 23,908,308 times
Reputation: 14125
Quote:
Originally Posted by hawkeye2009 View Post
Media from the west has been celebrating the resistance of Ukraine, which is certainly good. Ukranian resistance appears stronger than anyone thought.

However, Putin has the bulk of his higher tech weapons still in Russia and have not been deployed. Further, the bulk of the Ukranian army is in the east. Their main fuel depo was bombed, limiting the mobility of those units. Additionally, Putin controls the air which can make mincemeat of a retreating army. One simply needs to look at images of the scorched Iraq troops retreating from Kuwait to understand this.

If Blitzkreig taught us anything, it is that too many troops concentrated forward against a mobile enemy is not a good idea and is a recipe for encirclement.

Let's hope that Ukraine stages a tactical retreat to prevent their army from being encircled and cut off from the rest of the country. Ironically, on those very same grounds, Soviet armies were repeatedly encircled and destroyed by forces of the Wehrmacht in WW2.
Here is the problem, if Putin declares war, he can easily be tried as a war criminal by the World Court. He arguably should be already, but with a declared war, he WILL be. He may have the tools, but it would not be wise to declare war on Ukraine.
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Old 03-01-2022, 07:23 AM
 
Location: Boston, MA
5,347 posts, read 3,218,339 times
Reputation: 7000
Quote:
Originally Posted by warhorse78 View Post
I remember reading about that with the canal being dammed. The more I hear about what Ukraine and their new boy leader, the more I realize they are not the sweet innocent victims they claim to be.
Show me any world leader who's a "sweet and innocent" victim. They all will do anything to remain in power. Trump, Biden, Putin, Netanyahu, insert any leader's name here.

That's not the point. The point is that Ukraine is a sovereign nation and you don't invade other countries simply because they make you look bad. After the 1991 coup, Ukraine embraced democracy and became a civilized, modern society. Russia accepted democracy but held strong to it's backwards communist roots. Sure, there was a vacuum right after 1991 and a handful of Russians got super rich on this newfound "capitalism" but at its core you have people like Putin who are so entrenched in Soviet mentality they cannot move forward. This is nothing more than Putin trying to secure his legacy in a time of increasing unrest and his country slipping backwards while the rest of the world moves forward.
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