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Old 08-18-2022, 05:21 AM
 
21,495 posts, read 10,617,936 times
Reputation: 14157

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Quote:
Originally Posted by James Austen View Post
Right on

I would like to hear though from all the fireside Generals on how exactly the withdrawal should have been handled. There were bound to be thousands and thousands of Afghans heading to Kabul airport, desperate to leave. That situation, like the last days in Vietnam was unavoidable. Many did not reach the airport, stopped by the Taliban and turned back so it could have been even more chaotic.

The US and the rest of the coalition had to leave. I couldn't see the US, Britain and other Forces staying on any longer. It was well overdue in fact. Despite all the money and military aid provided over almost 20 years it was plain that all that had been created was a rotten, corrupt and weak entity that collapsed like a house of cards when the withdrawal date was finally known.

Anyway it provides Trump's ranting puppets Hannity and Carlson with enough propaganda to last awhile and keep their followers from finding out about any of the achievements under the Biden admin. you mention above
The very first thing any competent president would do was not close Bagram Airbase before they evacuated everyone. And he would have consulted with his allies and come up with an effective plan for withdrawal as Brave New World said. There is no excuse for the way Biden handled this fiasco.

 
Old 08-18-2022, 05:26 AM
 
Location: western NY
6,510 posts, read 3,199,669 times
Reputation: 10231
Quote:
Originally Posted by katygirl68 View Post
The very first thing any competent president would do was not close Bagram Airbase before they evacuated everyone. And he would have consulted with his allies and come up with an effective plan for withdrawal as Brave New World said. There is no excuse for the way Biden handled this fiasco.
That's it, in a nutshell.

 
Old 08-18-2022, 06:07 AM
 
Location: Great Britain
27,330 posts, read 13,588,407 times
Reputation: 19681
Btw, the US phases in Afghanistan were -

Operation Enduring Freedom 2002 - 2014, which was the US Combat operation as part of the UN International Security Assistance Force (ISAF). This was the US equivalent of British forces Operation Herrick.

Operation Enduring Freedom - Wikipedia

Following thend of the combat phase, the US embarked on Operation Freedom's Sentinel is part of the NATO-led Resolute Support Mission, which began on January 1, 2015. OFS had two components: counterterrorism and working with allies as part of Resolute Support. The main objectives were training Afghan forces, and helping to support the democratic Afghan Government. This was the US equivalent of British forces Operation Toral.

Operation Freedom's Sentinel - Wikipedia

The final US Operation was Operation Allies Refuge which was a United States military operation to airlift certain at-risk Afghan civilians, particularly interpreters, following Biden's poorly planned withdrawal in 2021. This was the US equivalent of British forces Operation Pitting.

Operation Allies Refuge - Wikipedia

Last edited by Brave New World; 08-18-2022 at 06:22 AM..
 
Old 08-18-2022, 10:10 AM
 
14,435 posts, read 14,374,163 times
Reputation: 45876
Quote:
Originally Posted by mlulu23 View Post
Everything you said was false. You really need a better news source. If you even bothered to scan those videos of biden's gaffes most were from other countries like Australia, GB, India etc. They were laughing at biden, not with him. I go with facts, and know that President Trump was greatly respected by many other nations except the ones that leaned left. Germany laughed when President Trump warned them about being too dependent on Russian fuel. But they aren't laughing now.

"Germany Electricity Benchmark Prices Surge over €500 for the First Time Ever — As Natural Gas Also Reach Record Highs"

https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/202...-record-highs/
I'm not gaffing you're just blind. You obviously rely on sources for your information that are outside the mainstream. No nation I am aware other than perhaps Brazil with its egotistical nutty President Balsonaro liked Trump. When Biden took office there was a collective sigh of relief among the G7 nations that America was back.

Give me a list of all the nations and leaders that "respected President Trump".
 
Old 08-18-2022, 10:17 AM
 
14,435 posts, read 14,374,163 times
Reputation: 45876
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brave New World View Post
All US Forces and NATO forces moved from Combat Operations to Resolute Support, as of the 1st January 2015.

How many times do I have to tell you thins and provide links.

The UK lost 636 Service Personnel during the US led War on Terror, which is just about more than the rest of Europe combined.

There were also thousands of British personnel horrible maimed and left with life changing injuries.

So to infer that the British were somehow cowards, just demonstrates the need for Britain and other countries to stay out of future US led conflicts, given that some Americans have short memories and enjoy rewriting history.

British Army - Combat Operations - Operation Herrick - Wikipedia

British Army - Support Operation as part of NATO Resolute Support - Operation Toral - Wikipedia

British military operation to evacuate British nationals - Operation Pitting - Wikipedia

As for Iraq, the British Operation was - Operation Telic - Wikipedia

Later Operations against the Muslim Caliphate in Iraq, related to Operation Shader - Operation Shader - Wikipedia
America lost over 2,000 soldiers and spent far more money in Afghanistan than Britain ever did.

Much of the problem many Americans have with our NATO allies is that we believe we are always the nation that has to bear the lion's share of the commitment in any military action. At the end of the process, Britain only had a few hundred soldiers in Afghanistan.

Frankly, if Britain wants to stay out of future military actions I suppose that is the business of the British government. My feeling though is that nations that are not truly committed to NATO should not enjoy the support of countries like the USA that are committed.

If I had had my way we would have pulled out of Afghanistan as soon as we had confirmation that Bin Laden was dead.
 
Old 08-18-2022, 11:18 AM
 
1,462 posts, read 664,750 times
Reputation: 4813
Quote:
Originally Posted by katygirl68 View Post
Yes I know, but that doesn’t excuse Joe Biden’s incompetent withdrawal from Afghanistan.
War is just HELL. The beginning, the middle and the end. Withdrawals from war like all parts of war are hellish and chaotic. See the Vietnam War. See all wars historically. If you are looking for a peaceful withdrawal from war my advice to you is don't vote for the folks who put us in them. Remember from this day forward, there are no peaceful, orderly withdrawals from war. Look at Afghanistan, and you'll know what President Biden was up against. But he knew that getting out of the unsustainable war after 20 years was the RIGHT thing to do. He knew the blowback he would get but had the guts to do it.

Actually President Biden had some skin in the game of US wars as his son gave his life for his involvement. (please refer to the burning pit law that was just enacted and many Republicans who readily finance us GOING to war, refused to vote for it. Cost too much $. Romney was one who voted against it) Additionally President Biden lifted the Muslim ban so the Afghan folks who helped us could come to the US.

I am very grateful to President Biden for getting us out of that war. I wouldn't want my sons or daughters to have to go to war. Would you elect to send your sons or daughters to Afghanistan if this war continued and the draft were re-enacted? If we're all being honest, unless you're a military family, that war went on as long as it did because it was far removed from most Americans.
 
Old 08-18-2022, 11:19 AM
 
21,495 posts, read 10,617,936 times
Reputation: 14157
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brave New World View Post
Btw, the US phases in Afghanistan were -

Operation Enduring Freedom 2002 - 2014, which was the US Combat operation as part of the UN International Security Assistance Force (ISAF). This was the US equivalent of British forces Operation Herrick.

Operation Enduring Freedom - Wikipedia

Following thend of the combat phase, the US embarked on Operation Freedom's Sentinel is part of the NATO-led Resolute Support Mission, which began on January 1, 2015. OFS had two components: counterterrorism and working with allies as part of Resolute Support. The main objectives were training Afghan forces, and helping to support the democratic Afghan Government. This was the US equivalent of British forces Operation Toral.

Operation Freedom's Sentinel - Wikipedia

The final US Operation was Operation Allies Refuge which was a United States military operation to airlift certain at-risk Afghan civilians, particularly interpreters, following Biden's poorly planned withdrawal in 2021. This was the US equivalent of British forces Operation Pitting.

Operation Allies Refuge - Wikipedia
About that airlift, the administration let anyone on the airlifts who could make it to the airport and claimed the vetting would come later.

How many terrorists did he let in to our country so he could have the photo of a full plane and crow about the largest evacuation since Dunkirk?

How many people actually believe anyone who got here and didn’t pass the vetting was returned to Afghanistan? Or believe there was any vetting at all?

What would be the point when our borders are useless? No one is stopping anyone from coming here, which is another stain on this president.
 
Old 08-18-2022, 11:27 AM
 
21,495 posts, read 10,617,936 times
Reputation: 14157
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shallow Hal View Post
War is just HELL. The beginning, the middle and the end. Withdrawals from war like all parts of war are hellish and chaotic. See the Vietnam War. See all wars historically. If you are looking for a peaceful withdrawal from war my advice to you is don't vote for the folks who put us in them. Remember from this day forward, there are no peaceful, orderly withdrawals from war. Look at Afghanistan, and you'll know what President Biden was up against. But he knew that getting out of the unsustainable war after 20 years was the RIGHT thing to do. He knew the blowback he would get but had the guts to do it.

Actually President Biden had some skin in the game of US wars as his son gave his life for his involvement. (please refer to the burning pit law that was just enacted and many Republicans who readily finance us GOING to war, refused to vote for it. Cost too much $. Romney was one who voted against it) Additionally President Biden lifted the Muslim ban so the Afghan folks who helped us could come to the US.

I am very grateful to President Biden for getting us out of that war. I wouldn't want my sons or daughters to have to go to war. Would you elect to send your sons or daughters to Afghanistan if this war continued and the draft were re-enacted? If we're all being honest, unless you're a military family, that war went on as long as it did because it was far removed from most Americans.
You really believe the propaganda don’t you? Biden wouldn’t have gotten out of Afghanistan if he wasn’t forced to by Trump’s deal. I wanted the war to end but a competent withdrawal could have been accomplished. Biden did not do that. Nothing else you say matters. He botched the withdrawal, period.
 
Old 08-18-2022, 12:14 PM
 
6,205 posts, read 3,414,765 times
Reputation: 11158
Quote:
Originally Posted by katygirl68 View Post
About that airlift, the administration let anyone on the airlifts who could make it to the airport and claimed the vetting would come later.

How many terrorists did he let in to our country so he could have the photo of a full plane and crow about the largest evacuation since Dunkirk?

How many people actually believe anyone who got here and didn’t pass the vetting was returned to Afghanistan? Or believe there was any vetting at all?

What would be the point when our borders are useless? No one is stopping anyone from coming here, which is another stain on this president.


I’m not going to discuss or elaborate on the vetting issue any further than this statement: your concern is warranted.

Here is an open source product:

https://media.defense.gov/2022/Feb/1...IG-222-065.PDF

Just the Afghan refugee issue alone is enough for me to wish we were still in BAF and KAF keeping the peace as best we can, and those 100,000, give or take a few thousand, were all still in Afghanistan, doing their version of MAGA, Make Afghanistan Great Again.
 
Old 08-18-2022, 12:31 PM
 
1,462 posts, read 664,750 times
Reputation: 4813
Quote:
Originally Posted by katygirl68 View Post
You really believe the propaganda don’t you? Biden wouldn’t have gotten out of Afghanistan if he wasn’t forced to by Trump’s deal. I wanted the war to end but a competent withdrawal could have been accomplished. Biden did not do that. Nothing else you say matters. He botched the withdrawal, period.
Oh Katy. Katy, Katy. "Nothing I say matters" because you no longer have the capacity to discern the truth.

This is where I leave you.........
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