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Here’s a decent link on the subject. This has happened in past elections from both republicans and democrat candidates. At no time has any “fake” elector been charged, because they were just making their case as an elector under the law but were not actively seeking to deceive anyone nor did they deceive anyone. This is the same with the fake electors for Trump. They were not actually trying to deceive anyone and just like in the Tilden case, Pence never opened the electoral envelope because they had no official backing.
If you want to argue Trump should face some disgrace because of this, okay maybe I buy that. But otherwise, this looks like the democrats once again stretching laws and using laws in unprecedented ways to stop Trump from running for president even thought half the country’s population wants him to. It’s telling to me that ever AG and prosecutor in all seven states are democrats. That’s no coincidence.
First of all, the author himself says he actually doesn't know whether or not anyone was charged for the 1876 elector controversy - just that he can't find any evidence that they were. Secondly, it was a completely different situation in the first place. The vote in South Carolina had a voter turnout of 101% due to Democrats stuffing ballot boxes to keep Hayes out of there and end Reconstruction. They were fooling illiterate voters with ballots with Lincoln on them, to make them think they were voting Republican when they were actually voting Dem. All kinds of dirty tricks. The Democrats were putting up slates of fake electors because they wanted to do anything they could to kneecap the Radical Republicans and take power back in the South.
And frankly, those fake electors SHOULD have been charged in 1876, even if they weren't. They are a perfect example of the effects of the ultimate Republican fecklessness in those days - the fact that they never did what should have been done. Which is they should have thrown the Confederate leaders in prison or executed them, stripped them of their land, and awarded it to the freedmen. Instead, they let the Dems intimidate them into the 1877 compromise, which wrecked reconstruction and started the Jim Crow era.
And just like those fake electors, the AZ electors should be charged and thrown in prison as well.
Last edited by Mr. Clutch; 04-26-2024 at 12:06 PM..
An 1876 precedent, and the author even has to admit to an obvious difference:
"Blatant falsehood", "demonstrably untrue". Worth avoiding in official government that one puts one's name to, wouldn't you say?
The difference the author tries to assert is that in some historical cases there was reason to believe the election in those states could flip to the other candidate, but the author also acknowledges that was not the case in all instances and there is need to be careful in prosecuting such actions. In 2020, there were some questions about whether some of these states would flip to Trump. There were also several documented anomalies with how the vote tallies played out. As in things we have never seen before. Some of that could have been from the expanded vote times and the presence of a voting box on every corner. Those things made the election night and the days following look different than previous elections.
In the end, these fake electors are similar to what has been done in the past without prosecution, and there literally was no harm done in any of the cases. Right or wrong, the practice has been accepted as normal BY BOTH PARTIES UNTIL democrats decided they wanted to go against conventions and weaponize the law against Trump.
Trump and these cohorts deserve some egg on their face for these actions, but the prosecution of these folks is out of line. It’s sets a new tone that I think will bite democrats in the future (deservedly so).
What irritates me the most is how the left wing media is framing what happened, like it was some grand conspiracy to steel the election. Not even close. They had no legal backing and never would have had the chance to vote. It was done out of zealotry and show more than anything. Stupid? Yes. Deserving of harassment and prosecution? No.
The difference the author tries to assert is that in some historical cases there was reason to believe the election in those states could flip to the other candidate, but the author also acknowledges that was not the case in all instances and there is need to be careful in prosecuting such actions. In 2020, there were some questions about whether some of these states would flip to Trump. There were also several documented anomalies with how the vote tallies played out. As in things we have never seen before. Some of that could have been from the expanded vote times and the presence of a voting box on every corner. Those things made the election night and the days following look different than previous elections.
In the end, these fake electors are similar to what has been done in the past without prosecution, and there literally was no harm done in any of the cases. Right or wrong, the practice has been accepted as normal BY BOTH PARTIES UNTIL democrats decided they wanted to go against conventions and weaponize the law against Trump.
Trump and these cohorts deserve some egg on their face for these actions, but the prosecution of these folks is out of line. It’s sets a new tone that I think will bite democrats in the future (deservedly so).
What irritates me the most is how the left wing media is framing what happened, like it was some grand conspiracy to steel the election. Not even close. They had no legal backing and never would have had the chance to vote. It was done out of zealotry and show more than anything. Stupid? Yes. Deserving of harassment and prosecution? No.
The second paragraph isn't true though. The Democrats in 1876 very well may have been arrested had they done this at a different time but that timeframe was different. The country was a decade past a civil war with another being threatened due to black Republican political power. The Republicans made a decision not to risk the country over the fake electors by sacrificing the political power of the freedmen. The Democrats dropped their opposition to Hayes in exchange for the Republicans ending Reconstruction.
In the Arizona example, there was no evidence that merited that ragtag group of folks declaring themselves electors. They got what they deserved, and what frankly, the fake electors in 1876 deserved. Just because politicians made a mistake 150 years ago doesn't mean they need to keep making the same ones today.
Arrest and jail them and stop this foolishness from happening again.
First of all, the author himself says he actually doesn't know whether or not anyone was charged for the 1876 elector controversy - just that he can't find any evidence that they were. Secondly, it was a completely different situation in the first place. The vote in South Carolina had a voter turnout of 101% due to Democrats stuffing ballot boxes to keep Hayes out of there and end Reconstruction. They were fooling illiterate voters with ballots with Lincoln on them, to make them think they were voting Republican when they were actually voting Dem. All kinds of dirty tricks. The Democrats were putting up slates of fake electors because they wanted to do anything they could to kneecap the Radical Republicans and take power back in the South.
And frankly, those fake electors SHOULD have been charged in 1876, even if they weren't. They are a perfect example of the effects of the ultimate Republican fecklessness in those days - the fact that they never did what should have been done. Which is they should hav thrown the Confederate leaders in prison or executed them, stripped them of their land, and awarded it to the freedmen. Instead, they let the Dems intimidate them into the 1877 compromise, which wrecked reconstruction and started the Jim Crow era.
And just like those fake electors, the AZ electors should be charged and thrown in prison as well.
State governments were involved in the 1876 elector controversy. This time private citizens created fake documents and submitted them to the federal government. This is no different then a private citizen creating a fake check from the state revenue office and attempt to cash it. Someone submitting fake documents to get state unemployment approved.
In the end, these fake electors are similar to what has been done in the past without prosecution, and there literally was no harm done in any of the cases. Right or wrong, the practice has been accepted as normal BY BOTH PARTIES UNTIL democrats decided they wanted to go against conventions and weaponize the law against Trump.
.
When has this been done in the past? Hawaii had just become a state and both parties sent up electors because they were in disarray and they did it openly, not in secret meetings as they did in the swing states involved and not to swing a presidential election. Do you know of others?
Still though, a year and a half? That doesn't seem right.
a quick search shows average felony investigations expected to go to trial at 7-10 months so i don't think 18 months on such a high profile case is unreasonable.
i wish this happened sooner, specifically during Brnovich's term but...... it didn't.
Election fraud 2020. Of course Trump won. Banana republic here we are. This admin needs to be removed and replaced before they finish destroying the country.
Do not vote for another 4 years is this treasonous scum admin. Please!
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That doesn't seem right.