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You're kidding, right? The PROBLEM with the 'above' is that when I take Chinese citizenship, my government might forbid me to accept Taiwanese citizenship....and I COULD end up in jail. My Israeli citizenship MIGHT be frowned upon by the authorities in my OTHER country, Saudi Arabia..causing me further legal woes...up to and including the loss of cherished body parts.
Should I opt for North Korean citizenship, and then be asked to gather information for THEM from my OTHER home, the USA, I might well end up in trouble with BOTH my governments.
Had I lived in New Jersey in 1940 as a dual German-US citizen...and had BOTH nations ordered me to report for military duty for the coming war, I'd have had to say 'yes' to one, and 'no' to the other....and either way, I'd have been 'doing my duty' for one nation, and guilty of draft evasion by the other.
As I said in previous posts , if you're obeying the laws there should be no problem.
Spying for any country could get you in trouble.
The title of this thread has to do with CHANGING citizenships....not collecting them.
Would you really want to get CHINESE citizenship? Eeeeyewwwww... Or North Korean?
If I am eligible for dual citizenship, and I think it will benefit me, I will apply. I have to look after my own interest, as it is clear the leadership of this country (on either side) isn't. The leadership of the last 8 yrs, and the past and current economic policy do not justify blinding loyalty at the expense of my own interest.
Fair enough. As I said before, if citizenship involves only one's self-interest, and entitles one to all the benefits of citizenship, with no requirements, obligations, or duties, then by all means, become a citizen of as many places as will accept you. Under THOSE conditions, who could object?
The title of this thread has to do with CHANGING citizenships....not collecting them.
You're absolutely correct, and I was about to make this point myself. The original OP post was about "changing" citizenship...which I would see not as a 'betrayal', but as a voluntary moving from 'one to the other'....(as in becoming a college student doesn't mean you're 'betraying' your high-school..it simply means you've 'moved on').
Somehow, we got side-tracked into the subject of "dual citizenship"..a subject much different than simply immigrating to a new country.
Wrong..it will get you into trouble with the country you're spying ON. The country you're spying FOR will regard you as the "good guy". If you're a citizen of BOTH, you'd be in lots of hot water, and would obviously be suddenly 'out of favor' with ONE of 'your' governments..which was precisely my point. What's 'good' for one country is often 'bad' for another....even if they're friendly nations.
Wrong..it will get you into trouble with the country you're spying ON. The country you're spying FOR will regard you as the "good guy". If you're a citizen of BOTH, you'd be in lots of hot water, and would obviously be suddenly 'out of favor' with ONE of 'your' governments..which was precisely my point. What's 'good' for one country is often 'bad' for another....even if they're friendly nations.
I posted:
""Spying for any country could get you in trouble."
I did NOT post which country.
You posted:""The country you're spying FOR will regard you as the "good guy".
And in the case of Valerie Plame ????
And it all goes back to a simple statement aboutchanging citizenship, not spying....if you obey the laws there is nothing wrong with changing citizenship.
""Spying for any country could get you in trouble."
I did NOT post which country.
You posted:""The country you're spying FOR will regard you as the "good guy".
And in the case of Valerie Plame ????
And it all goes back to a simple statement aboutchanging citizenship, not spying....if you obey the laws there is nothing wrong with changing citizenship.
Valerie Plame was the victim of spineless, amoral politicians engaged in bitter infighting....she was the scapegoat and her career was sacrificed in order to 'punish' her spouse. What does that have to do with 'spying' as a concept?
MOST governments have many agents who gather intelligence from OTHER countries. They pay them, they protect them, and they regard them as neccessary. Call them 'spies' if you wish, but they don't NORMALLY get into trouble with the nations for which they work.
If this works, I'm going to look into becoming a Roman Catholic Muslim Jew. Should be interesting.
Mohandas Ghandi considered himself to be a Christian, a Jew , A Hindu, and a Muslim and tried to live the precepts of all four faiths. Good luck on your spiritual journey.
As someone who will be giving up his U.S. Citizenship, my reason is different than I've seen listed in this thread.
Having permanently moved to Australia in the last year, as a physician, there is a huge financial mess, of the IRS who requires every U.S. citizen, for life, who makes >$80K US must file U.S. taxes every year.
As we have moved permanently to Australia, this becomes a huge burden. The tax year here is from July to June. Here there is not social security per-se', but instead when an employer pays you, 9% is also paid to your personal retirement account, called superannuation. There is something called salary packaging that makes certain things pre-tax income, that would be taxable in the U.S.
Accountants tell us that the complexity of filing taxes long term in the U.S. is substantial, but also, that upon retirement, the IRS may well find that one's superannuation is taxable income (even through social security - the equivalent wouldn't be).
Another U.S. physician some years ago got audited in AU and although he didn't end up having any tax liability, ended up with >$50K in accountant bills to sort everything out with the IRS.
The U.S., is, to my knowledge, the only country in the world, who makes someone who permanently moved from the U.S. file such paperwork, even though the person is residing and working and being taxed elsewhere.
So, I will be heading up to Brisbane to the U.S. Consulate and turning in my U.S. Passport; not out of disrespect to the U.S., but out of fear of the I.R.S.
I don't think of any of the personal things. You see, I am looking at what is best for the country. You might want to try that sometime.
I take it you're one of those people who puts the state above individuals and their rights. That's very un-American. Jefferson probably wouldn't have nice things to say about that way of thinking...
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Giving up US Citizenship
