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Originally Posted by runnerup
Your posts still remind me of a child. Are you of age to be in this forum? Again you throw out facts without backing them up with substantial internet sources. BTW I really want the UK's dental system. Have you seen their teeth!
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I'm spouting off facts that I have given links to in the many many threads I have been invovled with concerning this issue. You have not seen my other posts.. but EVERY FACT and STATISTIC I have mentioned on these boards have been backed up. I just dont' waste my time reposting them yet again.. on yet another thread about the healthcare issue.
BTW.. dental is an entirelly different issue. Dental is separately purchased from "medical" and is NOT considered "medical" that qualifies for medical coverage in the U.S.. so I don't know why you are throwing that into the mix.
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The fact is that most people in the US get healthcare through their employer. You are trying to get them to drop their free insurance and instead "buy" their plans through higher taxes. Why would anyone agree to that. Especially if it will be substandard care.
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LOL. first off the insurance is not "FREE".. but then that mentality. that you think it is "FREE" is part of the problem with the healthcare system in the U.S. Your own article points to the fact that rising healthcare costs is the number one reason why average household income has DECREASED since 2000 because of the rising cost of health insurance.. but in case you missed that little tidbit in the article you linked to here it is:
Over the last five years, health-insurance premiums have more than doubled, leaving firms like General Motors on the brink of bankruptcy. Expensive health care has also hit workers in the pocketbook: it’s one of the reasons that median family income fell between 2000 and 2005 (despite a rise in overall labor costs). Health spending has surged past 16 percent of GDP. The number of uninsured Americans has risen, and even the insured seem dissatisfied.
Need we mention that part of the big reason the American autoworkers are so strapped is because of health care costs for their current employees AND retirees? Or how the number of uninsured in this country has upticked quite quickly in the U.S. AND how employers are now cutting back on actual benefits..leaving many UNDERINSURED (although they have a false sense of security that they are insured, only to find out their coverage does not cover certain things).
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33% uninsured is not that bad considering that we have 300 million people in the US. A lot of those people are people in their 20s who do not need it anyway. And I really don't care that illegals and people who came here on visas don't have insurance. The people who came here on visas are stealing jobs from hard working Americans and working for less money. I have no sympathy.
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These people who are "stealing" jobs.. are people who are coming to America no different than our forefathers and our grandparents.. etc. ANd they are here LEGALLY.. which means they are not doing anything wrong in being here. Now.. that being said.. considering AGAIN.. that the U.S spends DOUBLE the amount of GDP (and quickly rising btw) and manages to have 11% uninsured (and AGAIN.. climbing.. wonder what those numbers are now that jobs are being lost and thereby insurance is being lost) While other countries spend HALF THE AMOUNT in percentage of GDP than we do , yet manage to have ALL their people covered
So.. basically you think it's great that we spend more and get far less. Oh.. and our government , out of all the money spent on healthcare, manages to spend 44% of that expenditures and again.. not all of it's citizens are insured (this is medicaid/medicare). .. 11% plus and climbing remained uninsured.
Wow.. I guess you have really low expectations.
BTW.. again. . .we have the HIGHESTER % of our population (regardless of size..we are talking percentages here) NOT COVERED!!!
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Why don't you just get a job that gives you health insurance. I promise you that would be the simplest way to resolve your problem.
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First.. I have been looking for a job .. since December.. and in this ecnomy I have gotten squat.. and i'm highly qualified for a decent position...
Now.. how many entrepeneurs have to give up their dream.. and possibly stifle THEIR innovation because of the high cost of health insurance and care. Don't you see something WRONG with that picture here. Being a SLAVE to a "company" for health benefits along. Here I am , trying to make a business for myself rather than have to work for someone else (personal responsibility no?) and possibly build my business to create more jobs.. but then have to give that up?? How SAD is that.. that we all have to be robotic drones for the corporate man because of health insurance. Why is that tied into employment anyway..
And it shouldn't be.. BTW.. its KILLING American business and global competition. When other companies in those countries that have socializes medicine do not have that added expense. I refer you to the information from the article about decresae wages DESPITE increased labor costs for U.S companies.
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Lady, stop complaining about wait times in rural PA and move to where there are more doctors. There are NO wait times where I live. You are a sensationalist and ridiculusly uneducated.
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LOL.. you know nothing about me.. first of all.. I am originally from Long Island NY.. plenty of Dr's there.. and guess what.. still wait times to see a Dr. I had my mother in law visiting here from Europe.. she got sick.. I called our family Dr and was told hte next appointment was 3 weeks away!! BTW.. my DR.is in Allentown.. hardly RURAL PA!
Do not speak of what you do not know! BTW.. wait times in RURAL areas are usually far less. My mom in rural MT can go see her Dr at a drop of a dime! It's called population density!
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Ok lets compare the percentage of innovation in the US of medical inventions versus the UK. I bet we win.
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Let's look at something here for a second. People will ALWAYS go where there is more money to be made. So YES.. they have come here because there is MORE MONEY to be made..for whatever reasons. However, don't you think that a DR. doing what he loves (because you have to have a love for what you are doing in ordre to be so dedicated to it) would do it in his own country if all things are equal. Do you seriously think that innovation would cease if the U. S stopped overpaying for it's medicines? BTW. or medicines are purchased at 50% what we pay for our own innovations around the world? Why do you think that is.. because we're stupid enough to pay DOUBLE!!
Americans seem to think that if it costs more it must be better. I seriously doubt people will stop creating and inventing new forms of medicine if we adopted a UHC too.. BTW. Dr's in UK and FRance and other socialized countries do quite well financially.
BTW.. Japan is considered the worlds most innovative country overall
Japan is the Worlds Most Innovative Country - Report
It's called triage. And a bleeding cut is not as important when Susie Q is dying of a heart attack. You are so self centered. Do you think the wait times will improve or get worse with UHC? Also just to let you know unless you are a hemophiliac the blood clots very quickly so you will not be sitting for hours bleeding.
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You call ME A child and then resort to name calling and calling me self centered.. which , btw, is in violation of CD rules. I haven't name called or been disrespectful to you.. I've given you facts and figures (and if you want the links to all that information then do a search on all my posts.. you'll find them. )
A heart attack patient wil not have to wait in an ER. They would be admitted right away and there heart pumping again.. so you're spouting nonsense. And yes.. the blood clots.. my point was you go to any ER there is a wait time.. when there are people there.. unless of course you are EMERGENT!!! It's called TRIAGE.. remember??
so heart attack patient will get in before other things
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I don't believe you. Where are the facts to back this up. You are making up stats just to prove your point. And no I will not read your earlier posts as you always say so get over it.
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Other posters who have seen my threads and my posts know well where those facts came from as I have pointed to them. You don't want to do a simple search by my screen name to retrieve them.. that's up to you.. I don't need to prove anything to you because I know.. and others know that I HAVE backed up everything I've said time and time again.
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Sensationalism... My insuarance will pay for it so I will not be financially ruined. My grandmother had cancer and the insurance paid for it. And guess what little misinformed she still has her insurance. They didn't drop her. And another thing if I went back to work after a catastrophe than I would just get put on whatever plans the employer has provided.
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Ah.. well if you are happy to be a slave to a job just for medical benefits you go right ahead. Some of us would like to actually CREATE jobs!! Go figure
AS for your grandmother.. well yes.. she stil has insurance (she's on medicare ).. but let's just pretend for as second that she is YOU and you and lets say that you left your job to open your own business, but guess what.. you go to purchase NEW insurance.. and .. what's this? You had a catastrophic illness.. well I'm sorry sir, we can't take you .. we are medically underwritten. OR you get offered a great position with a smaller company for more money, but they don't offer insurance because they are a small company (my mother works for a very small town as town clerk.. they didn't have insurance and she had to purchase her own, but couldn't purchase her own because of pre-existing condition)
Oh.. and also.. YOU being added to your employers plan will raise everyone's premium once you are on it and start using it. You'll cause your employer to have to spend MORE money by hiring you.. just a little tidbit I thought you'd want to know.
[quote][/QUONo system will EVERY be perfect.. but for all the articles that talk about the downside to the Canadian system.. not one of them has been calling for an American system. We are looked at as what NOT to do with your medical system!
TE]
The people in the article did call for an american system. Did you even read it?
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Lady your facts are so wrong! You have you not read earlier posts about the WHO study. It was done in 2000. It was not analyzing the quality of healthcare but the system itself. It was biased towards socialized medicine. You are so uninformed and obviously uneducated. Also I guess you meant lower birth mortality. But unlike you I check the facts before writing and we have a very similiar birth mortality rate to other western countries.
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I never knocked AMERICAN MEDICINE.. I knocked the AMERICAN SYSTEM!!!!
And when you have system of medicine that FAILS SO MANY.. 33% of it's population IT'S GIONG TO AFFECT THE OVERALL HEALTH OF THE COUNTRY
WE were ranked in the 30's.. I think right above SLOVENIA
by a DISTINGUISHED WORLD orginization.. they are not "biased" on socialized medicine..
just becuase they gave you results you didn't like they are biased..
I know my facts.. I know them well.. I've read the study...
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It seems you do not like the Canadian system. However you are willing to gamble that an American UHC will become more like the UK and not Canada. How do you know that this will not happen?
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Are you serious with that question.. well.. if you create your OWN system.. taking the best that different socialized systems have to offer than it won't happen.. it's called learning from other's mistakes
What is wrong with the Canadian system should not be adopted here. It's not the fact that it's socialized that gives it it's problems.. There are many other socialized models that do not have the same problems as the Canadian ones? just like it is NOT the fact that our system is entirely PRIVATIZED that makes it fail us.. ?? Actually the ones that work the best are the ones that combine both Private And Government!!! a BALANCE between the two that allows for access for all citizens AND less GDP spending .
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