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Oh and to lammexican: please don't call me a hypocrite. I'm 22 years old and still a dependent of my parents while I attend graduate school in the Bay Area. I don't discuss finances with my parents, so I don't know what they'll do with their check or if they'll even receive a check. And why did you take so much hostility to me mentioning the federal debt? Would you rather we pretend that it doesn't exist?
BTW - government has no "rights"... only specially delegated powers, via their constitutions.
I haven't been a taxpayer since 1993, when I left National Socialism. NO, I am not in hiding. I even wasted time picketing IRS offices, and making a nuisance of myself on radio and TV. Chalk it up to youthful exuberance.
There was no implication that Congress had no delegation of authority to tax incomes of taxable entities, engaged in revenue taxable activities. But for the most part, Americans are unaware how they volunteered to be "persons liable".
Here's a hint:
All the people I personally know who were hassled by the EYE ARE US had two things in common: (a) Socialist InSecurity account and number, and (b) Open, interest bearing bank account.
All the people I personally know, myself included, who were NOT hassled, had two things in common: (a) NO SSN (or inactive) and (b) NO interest bearing accounts (usury).
No instrumentality of the Federal Reserve will open an interest bearing bank account for an unnumbered American (God bless their hearts).
See: Ezekiel 18:13 KJV
(But wear your asbestos underwear before reading it aloud...)
I was 38 when I was awakened from the delusion that I was a "free man". It took a lying lawyer and a judge who went along with the charade to dash cold water in my face. I learned the lesson that I was a slave, and with God's help, I would be a free man.
Only after much research and reading the law did I discover the cruel joke - everything done to me was done by my own consent.
"HE who consents cannot complain...."
To start your own journey of enlightenment: Yahoo! Groups
No I'm a proud american that isn't looking to rip anyone off including my country. Call me naive but I benefit much from being an american and have no problem with doing my part. There will always be those that cheat the system but we all have to pay for our choices one way or the other. I hope you are enlightened soon and stop ripping off the country that has allowed you to live such a good life. Right now sir you are an embarassment. It is not us that are blinded it is you. Just because I am not in the military does not mean that I don't contribute to my country. That means I am a contributor and you are a leech. Don't blame me you exposed yourself as a leech. God bless america and have mercy on your soul.
And again, violence wouldn't happen. It may have happened 140 years ago, but those were radically different times, when the international community condoned the violent suppression of political movements counter to the will of the state. Today, the UN wouldn't just stand by and watch as the federal forces massacre their fellow Americans, they'd act. And yet again, I stress that the backlash from the global community would render any violence the US may like impose on separatists void, although I could see a trade embargo occuring, but not for long.
Time heals all wounds. Just 50 or so years after the Revolutionary War, Britain and America became great trading partners, and I'm sure that an independent Texas or Alaska or whatever would quickly become allies with the America.
Violence isn't necessary to gain true freedom, as evidenced by the glorius movements orchestrated by great men like Ghandi and Dr. King.
Oh and to lammexican: please don't call me a hypocrite. I'm 22 years old and still a dependent of my parents while I attend graduate school in the Bay Area. I don't discuss finances with my parents, so I don't know what they'll do with their check or if they'll even receive a check. And why did you take so much hostility to me mentioning the federal debt? Would you rather we pretend that it doesn't exist?
I am happy to see someone so young active in the politics of their country. You must reealize that calling for sucession is treason according to our constitution. You, I, and all of us have much that we owe our country and abandoning it because you don't like the way it is going is your right, so move. With that said dividing our union for whatever reason is hipocracy. Either you or your parents were educated in our public system and were allowed to be succesful because of the regulation that our government provides. You drive on Public roads everyday and use many public works that you take for granted. The difference between conservatives and liberals is that liberals realize those things taken for granted, and feel a sense of responsibility. We don't just abandon our country when times are tough and we feel powerless.
And again, violence wouldn't happen. It may have 140 years ago, but those were radically different times, when the international community condoned the violent suppression of political movements counter to the will of the state. Today, the UN wouldn't just stand by and watch as the federal forces massacre their fellow Americans, they'd act. And yet again, I stress that the backlash from the global community would render any violence the US may like impose on separatists void, although I could see a trade embargo occuring, but not for long.
Time heals all wounds. Just 50 or so years after the Revolutionary War, Britain and America became great trading partners, and I'm sure that an independent Texas or Alaska or whatever would quickly become allies with the America. Violence isn't necessary to gain true freedom, as evidenced by Ghandi and Dr. King.
Oh violence will happen most of the time people are displaced and deprived of their rights and dignity as human beings violence will indeed happen. Ghandi and Dr. King were the exceptions Israel-Palestine, Iraq, Lebanon, India-Pakistan, Cyprus, and Rwanda are more the rule.
Also the UN will not do anything just like the did not do anything in Srebrenica, nor Rwanda, nor are they doing anything in Darfur or the Democratic Republic of the Congo. Additionally I think you may be looking at this with to simple a perspective. All the people in a state really do not hold the same ideologies if the US was to break up along ideology, as breaking up along state lines would not really accomplish the goal of separating liberals and conservatives, what would happen to all the liberals living in the conservative state or all the conservatives living in the liberal state? They couldn't be given the vote as that would destroy the very essense of the ideological two state solution was chosen and woe to those that have the choice of second class citizenship or displacement? What happens to those who refuse to give up there lands or political rights. What other then forceble displacement would happen? What about states like mine that are split near 50-50 who would have claim to North Carolina the liberal state or the conservative one? Not that any of this matters because it will never happen, but just some intersting things to think about.
Oh and to lammexican: please don't call me a hypocrite. I'm 22 years old and still a dependent of my parents while I attend graduate school in the Bay Area. I don't discuss finances with my parents, so I don't know what they'll do with their check or if they'll even receive a check. And why did you take so much hostility to me mentioning the federal debt? Would you rather we pretend that it doesn't exist?
The federal debt does exist but I this stimulus is to get the economy moving again so that we have the ability to pay it off in the future instead of ten years of recession waiting for the market to turn like 1873.
I wouldn't say it'll never happen, but probably not anytime soon. But with regards to the UN just standing by and watching, I disagree. Sure the UN didn't intervene in Rwanda, the Sudan, and many other instances. However, we're talking about the hypothetical break-up of the US. This would be, in their minds, far more important than almost any other event in the history of the post-WW1 world. They would most certainly intervene, and judging by the anti-American sentiments usually portrayed by the UN, I have a strong inclination to believe that they'd side with the separatists.
And we're not talking about ethnic differences here, we're talking about solely political differences. The new nation-states wouldn't haul off and massacre political minorities, nor would they limit their right to vote. Regular elections would take place, however with the new degree of political homogenisation achieved by the creation of the new republics, their voices would be overshadowed by the conservative majority in the case of the South or Midwest, or the liberal majority in the case of the West Coast or Northeast.
Ideally I'd like to see a confederation established amongst all of the former American states in many ways similar to the EU, or perhaps even the Swiss Confederation. And since that doesn't seem any more far fetched the hypothetical we're discussing now, I don't see why that couldn't happen.
But from what I understand most of the projects incorporated into the "stimulus bill" are very much long term. We won't be seeing any results for quite a while. And at what cost? An additional trillion dollars in debt. Call me crazy but I don't think the federal government should be spending money they don't have. Just as I can't eat at Red Lobster or the Olive Garden every day on a college student's budget, the feds shouldn't spend money when they're $50 trillion in debt.
I do not think the UN would intervine at all because it really has no power independant of Nation-States, none nada 0, and any Nation-States contributing troops to the UN would not want their troops put at any signifigant degree of risk. So the UN would not intevine, nation states might...if it were in their intersted but not a legal and legitimate multinational NGO.
My next question is how would people in places like New Mexico, Nevada, Colorado, North Carolina, Virginia, Florida or any of the marginal to democratic leaning states in the Conservative zone think about joining a conservative state, the did not vote for the Republicans so why should they be grouped solely by geography? Secondly people are killed solely for their political differences all the time and many political differences are rooted in ethnicity and religion it would be diffacult to separate the two. Personally I like it the way it is the fewer barriers to trade, travel, work, residence etc. the better. Also I see all of this as far fetched and an impossiblity for my lifetime that doesn't mean it isn't fun to discuss though.
But from what I understand most of the projects incorporated into the "stimulus bill" are very much long term. We won't be seeing any results for quite a while. And at what cost? An additional trillion dollars in debt. Call me crazy but I don't think the federal government should be spending money they don't have. Just as I can't eat at Red Lobster or the Olive Garden every day on a college student's budget, the feds shouldn't spend money when they're $50 trillion in debt.
I wouldn't call you crazy I would call you naive. Based on your logic we should shut down the federal government since its broke you can thank Ronald Reagan for that. Lets see who takes us over first. Those troops over seas have to stay where they are since we are broke . Come on the right wing in this country is ridiculous there logic is flawed in so many ways its pathetic.
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