Welcome to City-Data.com Forum!
U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Politics and Other Controversies
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 06-22-2009, 08:29 PM
 
69,368 posts, read 64,174,590 times
Reputation: 9383

Advertisements

Quote:
Originally Posted by saganista View Post
What??? Where on earth did that come from??? What UHC country had to buy up all their hospitals, clinics, and insurance companies as part of implementing their plan? You've gone goofy on this one...
Japan for example, where a lot of the hospitals are public now..

And while we are at it, maybe we should cut costs like Japan does
Only 12% of Japanese hospitals test patients' blood after transfusions

Woo, yeah, lets cut everyones medical costs, then no one will be complaining about needing UHC...
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 06-22-2009, 09:06 PM
 
19,198 posts, read 31,495,300 times
Reputation: 4013
Quote:
Originally Posted by summers73 View Post
I respectfully disagree on the 2% statistic. The direct costs may only be 2%, but the indirect ones are likely staggering. Costs such as unnecessary regulations, huge increases in insurance causing a shortage in the OB/GYN specialty, etc.
Can you identify any of these regulations? Can you cite any data that support a relationship between malpractice cases and insurance premiums? I would suggest instead that medical insurance premiums vary inversely with both the stock market and the degree of competition in local insurance markets. I would suggest further that the number one factor contributing to increasing medical malpractice claims is increasing medical malpractice. A very good and dispassionate book about the matter is The Medical Malpractice Myth written by Prof. Tom Baker, who teaches law at the University of Connecticut.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 06-22-2009, 09:14 PM
 
Location: Pinal County, Arizona
25,100 posts, read 39,286,148 times
Reputation: 4937
Quote:
Originally Posted by saganista View Post
What??? Where on earth did that come from??? What UHC country had to buy up all their hospitals, clinics, and insurance companies as part of implementing their plan? You've gone goofy on this one...
Let me offer this to mull: What other countries that now have a UHC, also had private, for profit, Health Insurance companies in place, when the government took over?

Same would go with Hospitals and Clinics.

But, here is the "Big One" for you to consider: Which of the other COUNTRIES you allude to have the same Constitution as the United States with the same requirements related to Eminent Domain?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 06-22-2009, 09:34 PM
 
19,198 posts, read 31,495,300 times
Reputation: 4013
Quote:
Originally Posted by pghquest View Post
Japan for example, where a lot of the hospitals are public now..
Do you ever actually answer a question asked? As in What UHC country had to buy up all their hospitals, clinics, and insurance companies as part of implementing their plan? As for hospitals in Japan, by the way, about 80% of them are private.

Quote:
Originally Posted by pghquest View Post
And while we are at it, maybe we should cut costs like Japan does
Only 12% of Japanese hospitals test patients' blood after transfusions
What is the rate in the United States?

Quote:
Originally Posted by pghquest View Post
Woo, yeah, lets cut everyones medical costs, then no one will be complaining about needing UHC...
No, let's listen to the baseless rant of a bunch of right-wingers. That's never gotten us into any trouble before.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 06-22-2009, 09:41 PM
 
19,198 posts, read 31,495,300 times
Reputation: 4013
Quote:
Originally Posted by Greatday View Post
But, here is the "Big One" for you to consider: Which of the other COUNTRIES you allude to have the same Constitution as the United States with the same requirements related to Eminent Domain?
Perhaps you don't comprehend the question. Why would eminent domain or any other means or form of public acquisition of private property be any part of converting to a UHC plan? Can you actually believe that universal state ownership of medical facilities is a requirement for switching to a UHC plan?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 06-22-2009, 09:43 PM
 
Location: Ottawa, Canada
609 posts, read 1,175,751 times
Reputation: 173
Quote:
Originally Posted by pghquest View Post
Hospitals dont get paid enough by the government and have to file bankruptcy and close?

Doctors have their salaries cut and no longer see it worth 8+ years of school for a smaller salary?

Seniors, cant find retirement homes to go to because the cuts wont pay for their stay?

Employers across the country cut out their insurance causing an increase in the uninsured, not a decrease?

When people from other country come here to receive medical treatement at the taxpayers dime?

When medical facilities get caught committing insurance fraud, and get fined, thereby limiting the amount of money available for your medical care?

When hospitals dont have enough money to buy newer, better machines for better care and have to go without?

When the government decides that a procedure is worth $X and the hospitals say no, they cant afford to do it for that amount..

When insurance companies start to pay off the politicians to get access to their new billion dollar insurance contracts with the government for care..

Any others? Any answer?
and coming from a country with universal healthcare, and visiting many countries with UHC, this never happens..

What IF, someone on this forum began talking about something they knew nothing about. oh too late
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 06-22-2009, 10:00 PM
 
Location: Pinal County, Arizona
25,100 posts, read 39,286,148 times
Reputation: 4937
Quote:
Originally Posted by saganista View Post
Perhaps you don't comprehend the question. Why would eminent domain or any other means or form of public acquisition of private property be any part of converting to a UHC plan? Can you actually believe that universal state ownership of medical facilities is a requirement for switching to a UHC plan?
If the United States establishes a program that is Government operated / run, thereby putting the companies out of business - the law would mandate the Government pay them "just and fair compensation" - just the same way the Government has to do when they take property for a road

Would all private property / business have to be bought by the Government? Depends upon the proposal you look at. Some have suggested that this is the way it should be. Others don't.

A forum like this is absolutely no place to adequately discuss / debate this issue as it is filled with complexities. But, some of the best of the best in Constitutional law have acknowledged this point.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 06-22-2009, 10:03 PM
 
Location: Midwest
38,496 posts, read 25,849,201 times
Reputation: 10791
Quote:
Originally Posted by malamute View Post
What you guys want is not possible. You want the American taxpayers to provide free care to all the people of the world who want to come here and get it. Illegals can simply come over and head straight to any ER and we're supposed to give them completely free health care. Welfare indigents can decide to keep having as many children as they like and the taxpayers are expected to provide completely free health care to them.
Well why don't we tear down the statue of Liberty!

"Illegals" probably don't come to the US for healthcare. They probably have a better plan and service in their homeland!

Quote:
Fortunately, you can actually find out that generally, health care in Mexico is very impressive, and in most places, very excellent,
Quote:
Generally, the costs of those medical care services vary a lot by hospital, by physician, or by the seriousness of one’s conditions. On the average, an office with a doctor-specialist included, could cost you between 250 and 300 pesos, or roughly about twenty five dollars. Lab tests could cost about one-third of what its real cost is in the United States. CAT scans are 25% more affordable than what it rates in the US. Overnight stays in private hospital rooms can only cost you about three-hundred pesos, roughly about $35 only. Furthermore, visiting the dentist for some teeth cleaning procedures only costs two hundred pesos or $20. Indeed, health care in Mexico is very much affordable as compared to the rates in the United States.
Health Care in Mexico
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 06-22-2009, 10:06 PM
 
Location: Midwest
38,496 posts, read 25,849,201 times
Reputation: 10791
Quote:
Originally Posted by malamute View Post
Can you give me a link to where Obama's plan would actually deport illegals who aren't paying their maternity bills? Or wouldn't the anchor baby be still considered a citizen that gets his parents all the rights of citizenship and food stamps?

And yes I do care about my family and me. I actually do not have a whole lot of money left over after bills to support more free health care for everyone. I have an insurance plan, but I don't have an iPhone and I know that many uninsured people spend plenty of money on things that I don't.

Why is it all about going after the money of the working and currently insured?

Or will you inform the uninsured that they may have to give up going to concerts, eating out in fast food restaurants, cable television because they're now going to have to start chipping in for all this health care people want?
I can give you links that show Americans are going to other countries for surgeries etc........... because the care is high quality and much less expensive.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 06-22-2009, 10:08 PM
 
Location: Midwest
38,496 posts, read 25,849,201 times
Reputation: 10791
Quote:
Originally Posted by monkeywrenching View Post
what happens when the goverment does not want to pay for your childs medical needs anymore because it will cost too much because of a serious illness anymore, or your spouses needs because they have breast cancer?
Do you mean what happens when health insurance companies deny claims for the above mentioned health problems?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:


Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Politics and Other Controversies
Similar Threads

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 09:55 PM.

© 2005-2024, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Contact Us - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35, 36, 37 - Top