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Originally posted by nature's message
I feel sorry for whoever voted for birth controls to be illegal.
People who want to ban birth control are rediculous. They refuse to accept that people will have sex regardless of marriage. (I'm a christian, but I know that the world works differently from my beliefs) They also don't realize that birth control will actually prevent abortion.
I'm pro-life, but part of being pro-life is also about abortion prevention! And the pill does that.
I support legalized abortion. Until we have a society that educates its people, ensures that every child will be safe, and offers support for women--especially victims of rape and incest, rather than victims of mere stupidity--who become pregnant and who would not otherwise have support, so that the child may have the opportunity to grow up wanted and without abuse, I see no reason to force individual women to carry the burden of society's neglect. (How's that for a sentence?) Those who want abortion to be illegal--step up to the plate and adopt the unwanted and therefore profoundly at-risk children who will be born. Otherwise, shut it.
Having said that, I think it's disingenuous, at best, to support legalized abortion based on the argument that the right to an abortion is a question primarily of sovereignty over one's own body. And this is the position of the Left. I believe, of course, that any person has sovereign rights over his or her own body, but in the case of pregnancy, there is another body involved, as well. Abortion is counterintuitive. We all know this. Because no female mammal, human or nonhuman, willfully kills her own child, unless under extreme stress or duress. Thus, when the Left says that nobody likes having an abortion, I have to ask, "Why?" How is it possible to claim, on the one hand, that abortion is "a difficult decision" that nobody wants to make, but on the other claim that "it's only a fetus." If it's "a difficult decision," surely there's more at stake than "only a fetus"? What's at stake, in my opinion, is the promise of life. And when humanity decides to condone the wiping out of that promise, based primarily on political and/or personal preference, we have a serious moral problem as a society.
My take, therefore, is that neither the Left nor the Right is being honest.
I'm mixed on the subject. I do believe abortion is wrong and that it is murder.At the same time I am anti-welfare and don't believe taxpayers should support an unwanted life from craddle to grave.
Since most of the aborted fetuses would have been born to unwed mothers there can be no question that many of them would have became criminals if given the chance to live. So abortion does help control the crime rate in this sense. If only we could bring back to life the aborted babies who would have been good and productive and in turn give retroactive abortions to the entire violent criminal population. That would be a fair trade.
Because no female mammal, human or nonhuman, willfully kills her own child, unless under extreme stress or duress.
Not true. Don't you watch Animal Planet?
Seriously, I don't know how you can make this statement. Lots of animals kill their young. In fact, it's not uncommon for a polar bear to eat her baby. There was a controversy last year in Germany when a mother bear at a zoo began eating her young and nobody knew if they should interfere or let nature take its course. Maybe the cubs were sick or wouldn't feed. In nature, the weakest child is often killed or abandoned by the parent.
This is off-topic, but I had to respond. Sorry!
Quote:
Originally Posted by MovingForward
My take, therefore, is that neither the Left nor the Right is being honest.
I do agree with this statement, however! It's not always a difficult decision for some women. I'm way past menopause, but if I still got my period and missed a week, if I didn't want a baby, I'd take a pill or do whatever I needed to make sure I wasn't pregnant. Maybe some people here would call that an abortion. I would not wait 3 months and then say "I changed my mind" because then it would be an abortion.
This is why I earlier wrote the abortion debate can never be won by either side, because nobody will compromise, especially the anti-choice groups. I do not think it's a Left or Right issue, however. I am without a doubt on the Left on most issues, but I am dead set against late term abortions. I also know Republicans who believe in pro-choice, although the party has been shrinking so much that only the extreme right wingers will be left soon.
Last edited by justNancy; 09-20-2009 at 04:56 AM..
With the advent of nearly fail-proof contraceptives, it's highly unlikely that someone who advocates a woman's right to her own body would get pregnant by accident. If you're born to parents that are pro-choice, you should feel blessed to know that they actually wanted you.
the point I am trying to make is, if abortion is ONLY the womans right, then the paying of child support should also be the mans right.
after all, if the man wanted the abortion, and the woman did not, then the man should not be forced to pay for something he did not.
either make child support and abortion go both ways for both men and women, or just make it only the womans and not the mans.
Qusetion to the pro abortion crowd (at least the 45 that have voted abortion legal always):
So you really think it is not murder to abort a fetus that is 6 or 7 months along that is perfectly viable and healthy?
This is part of always that you are voting for
And if you don't think it is murder, why?
For me it is not about whether abortion is taking a life or not. That is secondary. It is about the woman having the right to make that decision. Not some government deciding for her. I believe she has absolute authority over what happens to her body.
In regards to late-term abortions. Those are a very small percentage of all abortions. I don't know of anyone who has had one.
In regards to late-term abortions. Those are a very small percentage of all abortions. I don't know of anyone who has had one.
Agree. According to every statistic I've ever read, less than 0.2% of all abortions are performed after the 24th week. They're illegal in most states. I said in another comment that I'm dead set against them, but if you keep reading this post, you'll see why I am slowly changing my mind. Sometimes they are necessary.
I mentioned a long time ago that a worked with a woman whose infant died at 1 or 2 weeks old. She tried desperately to get an abortion in her 7th month and couldn't. At first I judged her and called her a hypocrite, because she was so passionately pro-life and protested against abortion. However, I couldn't help but feel sorry for a woman when I learned that her baby had little chance of surviving and would only suffer if she did. I don't know why the doctors didn't find the deformity earlier. Unlike the woman in the following article, she got to hold her baby.
[URL="http://www.rhrealitycheck.org/blog/2008/07/08/obamas-late-term-abortion-comments-ignore-stark-realities"]Obama's Late Term Abortion Comments Ignore Stark Realities | RHRealityCheck.org[/URL]
"If there is such a thing as adding insult to this sort of injury, however, the award goes to Congress and the Bush administration for their passage of the "Partial Birth Abortion Ban," and the U.S. Supreme Court for their ruling in Gonzalez v. Carhart. While this piece of legislation does nothing to limit late term abortions, it does outlaw a specific procedure that allowed doctors to remove the fetus body intact."
Apparently, the law against late term abortions can be quite cruel.
Seriously, I don't know how you can make this statement. Lots of animals kill their young. In fact, it's not uncommon for a polar bear to eat her baby. There was a controversy last year in Germany when a mother bear at a zoo began eating her young and nobody knew if they should interfere or let nature take its course. Maybe the cubs were sick or wouldn't feed. In nature, the weakest child is often killed or abandoned by the parent.
This is off-topic, but I had to respond. Sorry!
I do agree with this statement, however! It's not always a difficult decision for some women. I'm way past menopause, but if I still got my period and missed a week, if I didn't want a baby, I'd take a pill or do whatever I needed to make sure I wasn't pregnant. Maybe some people here would call that an abortion. I would not wait 3 months and then say "I changed my mind" because then it would be an abortion.
This is why I earlier wrote the abortion debate can never be won by either side, because nobody will compromise, especially the anti-choice groups. I do not think it's a Left or Right issue, however. I am without a doubt on the Left on most issues, but I am dead set against late term abortions. I also know Republicans who believe in pro-choice, although the party has been shrinking so much that only the extreme right wingers will be left soon.
But you haven't contradicted what I said. First of all, animals are individuals--just like humans are--and they respond to stress/duress differently. Animals in captivity are often highly stressed and behave in ways that they would not if in their natural habitat. I also meant by "stress" that when survival is at stake, animals might kill their weaker young. This often happens with Pandas, who give birth to twins but can feed only one. They kill the weakest.
I don't know anyone, Left or Right, who supports late-term abortion, except in the case of danger to the mother's life.
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